Teeny-tiny skaters?

Bluediamonds09 · Oct 17, 2016

Should we be worried about the Russian girls skating program?......
I didn't start this post to be cruel or to bash my least favorites, or to bash the country of Russia. Im actually very concerned.
I've noticed this for years now: the young ladies skaters coming out of the newly revamped, "get-ready-for-Sochi" skating program are very, very tiny. Not petite, not small, but rail-thin tiny. Not all of them, but about 90 percent. Yes, about 90 percent of all the highly anticipated Russian ladies skating prodigies are absolutely minuscule! I know some people were just born tiny, some people are just naturally thin, and that's ok. But what has me worried is that even the Asian ladies skaters are bigger than the Russian girls. I look at Gubanova and Nugumanova and several others, and something doesn't feel right.
Could it be that the Russian skating federation really wants their girls small so they can be super flexible and get those level 4 spins? Because these youngsters could also double as contortionists. Nearly every single one of them!
Could it be that the federation wants small girls who can easily do triple jumps?
I'm honestly just guessing here. But remember Tuktamysheva? She hit puberty and even when she was in her comeback 2014-15 season she was being called fat. I think size is a big deal in the Russian skating school. Lipnitskaya's mother, or team, were even measuring what she was eating.
I understand that these junior ladies are only 13 or 14, and puberty is coming soon, but why are they all so small already? Why do they all have the same body type?
Note: I actually really like how the Russian ladies program makes sure their skaters are super consistent. It's amazing.

Sam-Skwantch · Oct 17, 2016

Bluediamonds09 said:
. But what has me worried is that even the Asian ladies skaters are bigger than the Russian girls. I look at Gubanova and Nugumanova and several others, and something doesn't feel right.
.

Have you seen the Korean qualifiers podium for senior ladies?

https://mobile.twitter.com/GeumNa/status/787575610436558848/photo/1

They are teeny tiny IMO.

Biellmann · Oct 17, 2016

Bluediamonds09 said:
Should we be worried about the Russian girls skating program?......
I didn't start this post to be cruel or to bash my least favorites, or to bash the country of Russia. Im actually very concerned.
I've noticed this for years now: the young ladies skaters coming out of the newly revamped, "get-ready-for-Sochi" skating program are very, very tiny. Not petite, not small, but rail-thin tiny. Not all of them, but about 90 percent. Yes, about 90 percent of all the highly anticipated Russian ladies skating prodigies are absolutely minuscule! I know some people were just born tiny, some people are just naturally thin, and that's ok. But what has me worried is that even the Asian ladies skaters are bigger than the Russian girls. I look at Gubanova and Nugumanova and several others, and something doesn't feel right.
Could it be that the Russian skating federation really wants their girls small so they can be super flexible and get those level 4 spins? Because these youngsters could also double as contortionists. Nearly every single one of them!
Could it be that the federation wants small girls who can easily do triple jumps?
I'm honestly just guessing here. But remember Tuktamysheva? She hit puberty and even when she was in her comeback 2014-15 season she was being called fat. I think size is a big deal in the Russian skating school. Lipnitskaya's mother, or team, were even measuring what she was eating.
I understand that these junior ladies are only 13 or 14, and puberty is coming soon, but why are they all so small already? Why do they all have the same body type?
Note: I actually really like how the Russian ladies program makes sure their skaters are super consistent. It's amazing.

Look back in history, the soviet gymnasts ect. It's always the same story :confused2:

silverfoxes · Oct 17, 2016

Sam-Skwantch said:
Have you seen the Korean qualifiers podium for senior ladies?

https://mobile.twitter.com/GeumNa/status/787575610436558848/photo/1

They are teeny tiny IMO.

Yes, I'm always surprised nobody ever mentions Eunsoo's size after all the relentless comments on here about Evgenia. And the girls mentioned by the OP look just fine to me (by prepubescent athlete standards anyway). Tursynbaeva comes to mind as well. I'm not saying any of these girls are in fact unhealthy, but why single out Gubanova & Nugumanova of all people? Oh, let me guess...

carotide · Oct 17, 2016

Oh yes.. All teeny-tiny just look at them: Polina Tsurskaya, Maria Sotskova, Elena Radionova, Adelina Sotnikova, Alina Zagitova, Alisa Fedichkina, Daria Panenkova, Stanislava Konstantinova, Elizaveta Tuktamysheva.. (of course for those who are now seniors I'm referring to when they were juniors)

Sam-Skwantch · Oct 17, 2016

silverfoxes said:
Yes, I'm always surprised nobody ever mentions Eunsoo's size after all the relentless comments on here about Evgenia. And the girls mentioned by the OP look just fine to me (by prepubescent athlete standards anyway). Tursynbaeva comes to mind as well. I'm not saying any of these girls are in fact unhealthy, but why single out Gubanova & Nugumanova of all people? Oh, let me guess...

Satoko is very teeny tiny. I just don't see the big deal but then again I'm in ice rinks around figure skaters most of the time and they are all so tiny I just don't even think about it any more. I see American skaters having powder lunch like everyday. I actually think they are quite healthy and all of the skaters I know and work with, they are probably way more healthy than the average American teenager. Then again...that's a pretty low standard there. :slink:

Violet Bliss · Oct 17, 2016

Figure skating and gymnastics favors small female bodies so there are more little girls and women in these sports. In 2010 Olympics, Joanie Rochette was the tiniest medalist against the two Asians.

Should we start worrying about the extra tall and lean women in long and high jumps, long distance running, volley ball, basket ball, etc.?

I remember LOL at a report a long time ago about the US basketball players, the men, somehow ended sharing a bus with the gymnastics girls who were like little puppies to those giants.

TGee · Oct 17, 2016

Uhm, I'm going to suggest folks look for the science on this one.

Here's what I've found as an interested layperson

Similar questions have been asked, at the global level, about small stature, weight, and delayed maturity in female gymnasts. That is, not just about one country, and not just about skating.. As a result, sports scientists have done a lot of work on this for early specialization sports, particularly gymnastics.

Small stature in adolescent gymnasts seems has been attributed to:

1) Higher proportion of the girls come from families with short stature

2) Higher proportion of the girls come from families with Constitutional Growth Delay ( late bloomers, with late growth spurts and puberty but on average normal height eventually )

3) Growth slowing during periods of intense training at a young age, but they appear to catch up...

Both of 2 and 3 mean that skeletal or bone age lags behind chronological age. So they will "look younger" as the development of the bone structure in the face will be in line with the rest of their skeleton. But none of these are cause for concern it would appear.

Here're some academic sources that came up via google..

http://link.springer.com/article/10.1007/s40279-013-0058-5

http://www.tandfonline.com/doi/abs/10.1080/03014469500004072

mrrice · Oct 17, 2016

They are ALL tiny. My Wife Maria B. is absolutely tiny and I wish I had gotten the chance to take a picture with her but, I still have her kiss on my cheek and that will be burned into my mind for the rest of my life as one of my great memories. As tiny as Maria was, she has nothing on Kristi Yamaguchi or Bebe Liang. Tonya Harding is also very short but does not appear to be as small as the others due to her athletic figure. I have met gymnast Svetlana Boginskaya in person and though she had long legs and was the tallest member of the team from Belarus, She was only 5'3". Very tiny and beautiful. She appears to tower over her teammate.

https://66.media.tumblr.com/tumblr_mc9s0q60l21rg6pieo1_500.jpg

Krunchii · Oct 17, 2016

Well they're elite athletes, puberty is delayed so they're going to be a bit smaller than an average girl of their age. Girls tend to grow vertically faster than they are growing horizontally. Just look at how teeny tiny Mao and Yuna were when they were juniors. Not much different from the current crop of junior ladies.

Barb · Oct 17, 2016

Seeing Adelina, Elizaveta, Yulia and especially Elena, I don´t think they were with an unhealthy diet. I mean, look at Elena, she was a miniature and now she is taller or same than María S.

Violet Bliss · Oct 17, 2016

There is just too much attention, scrutiny and criticism about female bodies these days. In overweight nations, the "normal" size is redefined and thin women are eyed with judgemental suspicion or concern.

Different body types suit different sports. In figure skating, small female bodies are preferred for Single but a must for Pairs. Now, why hasn't there been concern raised about the slim young men entering the upper tier because they can rotate fast and do quads more easily than the heavier Men? Plushenko, Reynolds, Brezina, Hanyu, Jin, etc are all very slim and tend to have stamina issue, likely due to their smaller rib cages and lung capacities. Except, of course, Plushenko who is not quite so small.

Can anyone look at tiny vegan Meagan Duhamel and think she is unhealthy? We come in different natural sizes which should be accepted and celebrated. The unnatural and unhealthy sizes, OTOH, need their owners' attention and care.

brightphoton · Oct 17, 2016

Did you know that back in the day, commentators would literally say, on national television, the skater's weight? Even Dick Button doesn't seem to be embarrassed about just telling everyone in the nation how much Karen weighs.

Interestingly, [Karen Kwan] is 5 foot 7 inches, and only 107 lbs.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CQ0xJoshfkw&t=0m28s

mrrice · Oct 17, 2016

brightphoton said:
Did you know that back in the day, commentators would literally say, on national television, the skater's weight? Even Dick Button doesn't seem to be embarrassed about just telling everyone in the nation how much Karen weighs.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CQ0xJoshfkw&t=0m28s

I knew that I'd heard that music somewhere before......Christina Gao used it for her SP in 2012/13 https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=k258izqOONU

sabinfire · Oct 17, 2016

Ugh, this thread's title got this stuck in my head! :gaah:

Crossover · Oct 17, 2016

silverfoxes said:
Yes, I'm always surprised nobody ever mentions Eunsoo's size after all the relentless comments on here about Evgenia. And the girls mentioned by the OP look just fine to me (by prepubescent athlete standards anyway). Tursynbaeva comes to mind as well. I'm not saying any of these girls are in fact unhealthy, but why single out Gubanova & Nugumanova of all people? Oh, let me guess...

Eunsoo is tall and thin like younger Elena Radionova. As much as her expressive presentation style as Elena, her body type has been discussed a couple of time on competition threads IIRC. Eunsoo is thin but not tiny because of her height and I guess she is highly likely to grow as tall as Elena.

I don't see any problem in the mentioned Russian juniors as they look healthy and don't enter into puberty spurts yet. However Medvedeva is a senior, so I also don't have a problem with people talking about her body as Satoko's teenty tiny body has been discussed much more often than Medvedeva. Tursynbaeva seems to have a similar body type of Satoko. I've always thought they can do good jobs in pairs as well (my long time fantasy of seeing a skater like Krisiti some day)

Crossover · Oct 17, 2016

Violet Bliss said:
Figure skating and gymnastics favors small female bodies so there are more little girls and women in these sports. In 2010 Olympics, Joanie Rochette was the tiniest medalist against the two Asians.

Should we start worrying about the extra tall and lean women in long and high jumps, long distance running, volley ball, basket ball, etc.?

I remember LOL at a report a long time ago about the US basketball players, the men, somehow ended sharing a bus with the gymnastics girls who were like little puppies to those giants.

Joannie Rochette has never struck me as a tiny skater because of her muscular body and average height as a skater. Yuna and Mao happen to be tall skaters.

Perhaps, shorter female skaters with a muscular body can be perceived as not tiny such as Meagan Duhamel. I didn't realize how tiny she is until I saw her in person and was surprised by her figure (I'd always thought Eric is just extraordinarily tall).

TGee · Oct 17, 2016

brightphoton said:
Did you know that back in the day, commentators would literally say, on national television, the skater's weight? Even Dick Button doesn't seem to be embarrassed about just telling everyone in the nation how much Karen weighs.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CQ0xJoshfkw&t=0m28s

We may not get weights, but women's heights are still definitely lead points in many sports, including swimming and beach volleyball.

Sports I may add, that are effectively closed to girls/women of short stature, even if by their genetics they can expect to end up tall but are on the slower, late developing growth track. . .

skateluvr · Oct 17, 2016

Recall when Miss America was described as a green eyed blond and her measurements were announced? We are going back to a mysogynistic time. I think Dick Button was a bit like that. He once said Nancy could lose 5 pounds. He was at times obnoxious.

As I have said before- I love to see tall women- older competitors and sadly Katarina Witt types will never ever win gold anything again.

hippomoomin · Oct 18, 2016

First, I think nature has a selection. Top ladies are tiny (Kwan), or skinny (Yuna) or both (Sataoko, Sasha Cohen), and none of the is Russian. You need to be below a certain size to be consistent.

As someone already said, Korean junior ladies are super tiny. Both Gubanova and Nugumanov have developed muscles, and considering how short they are, they have decent amount of muscles

Japanese ladies tend to be stocky (with the exception of Mao and Marin), and I think it's related to the technique. Less competitive Japanese ladies are skinner/tinier than the current top junior Japanese ladies.

I think Evgenia is the only true skinny lady from Russia.

Bluediamonds09 said:
Should we be worried about the Russian girls skating program?......
I didn't start this post to be cruel or to bash my least favorites, or to bash the country of Russia. Im actually very concerned.
I've noticed this for years now: the young ladies skaters coming out of the newly revamped, "get-ready-for-Sochi" skating program are very, very tiny. Not petite, not small, but rail-thin tiny. Not all of them, but about 90 percent. Yes, about 90 percent of all the highly anticipated Russian ladies skating prodigies are absolutely minuscule! I know some people were just born tiny, some people are just naturally thin, and that's ok. But what has me worried is that even the Asian ladies skaters are bigger than the Russian girls. I look at Gubanova and Nugumanova and several others, and something doesn't feel right.
Could it be that the Russian skating federation really wants their girls small so they can be super flexible and get those level 4 spins? Because these youngsters could also double as contortionists. Nearly every single one of them!
Could it be that the federation wants small girls who can easily do triple jumps?
I'm honestly just guessing here. But remember Tuktamysheva? She hit puberty and even when she was in her comeback 2014-15 season she was being called fat. I think size is a big deal in the Russian skating school. Lipnitskaya's mother, or team, were even measuring what she was eating.
I understand that these junior ladies are only 13 or 14, and puberty is coming soon, but why are they all so small already? Why do they all have the same body type?
Note: I actually really like how the Russian ladies program makes sure their skaters are super consistent. It's amazing.

Teeny-tiny skaters?

Bluediamonds09

Sam-Skwantch

“I solemnly swear I’m up to no good”

Biellmann

Match Penalty

silverfoxes

carotide

Sam-Skwantch

“I solemnly swear I’m up to no good”

Violet Bliss

TGee

mrrice

Krunchii

Barb

Violet Bliss

brightphoton

mrrice

sabinfire

Doing the needful

Crossover

All Hail the Queen

Crossover

All Hail the Queen

TGee

skateluvr

hippomoomin

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