Eteri Tutberidze interview 05.05.2017 | Page 21 | Golden Skate

Eteri Tutberidze interview 05.05.2017

Ender

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Yeah but skaters/coaches don't care for those who don't care for their skating. I'm pretty sure Eteri/Med don't care about the haters amidst the majority of the skating world respecting her and of course, the programs win. Which is way more significant and important than ascribing to what a minority of people (who aren't the judges, at that) think they SHOULD be doing.

I think Eteri's students' choreography isn't particularly groundbreaking but she does push her students to challenge themselves in other areas. Medvedeva' transitions and footwork do get progressively more difficult, and she is projecting better, even if the interpretation is lacking.

She might be remembered as a harsh coach but she does what's necessary for her skaters to win. Nobody will ever remember that Evgenia won with (in your opinion) tacky programs - they'll only remember her dominance and consistency (and contrary to your assertion, there are PLENTY who care for her skating even if it's not Kostner level choreo/interpretation. She also wouldn't be the first skater (especially Russian skaters) to do tacky programs and win Worlds and (likely) the Olympics. Even Mao had some "tacky" choreo at the beginning of her career but her technical ability and consistency helped her win.
Asada was "consistent"? Well... maybe when the judging wasn't harsh.
 

CanadianSkaterGuy

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Asada was "consistent"? Well... maybe when the judging wasn't harsh.

She was, before starting to get hit with URs and when flutzing became more scrutinized and, most importantly, before she grew and jumps weren't as effortless for her.

When I say consistency, I say that with respect to the rest of the field. And with respect to later in her career. She used to do 3-3 (and 3-3-3) combos like they were nothing.
 

Ender

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May 17, 2017
She was, before starting to get hit with URs and when flutzing became more scrutinized and, most importantly, before she grew and jumps weren't as effortless for her.

When I say consistency, I say that with respect to the rest of the field. And with respect to later in her career. She used to do 3-3 (and 3-3-3) combos like they were nothing.
I think it's more correct to say Asada landed questionable jumps consistently when she was young. If we take into account the specialists were not harsh in those days, then I agree.
However the standard of today is... fully rotated.
 

CanadianSkaterGuy

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I think it's more correct to say Asada landed questionable jumps consistently when she was young. If we take into account the specialists were not harsh in those days, then I agree.
However the standard of today is... fully rotated.

Well the deduction was way harsher (counted as a double) so URs weren't called as much in general unless super obvious. With the 30% deduction (stillless severe than a downgrade), tech specialists became more comfortable with nailing UR jumps. It's also when UR and flutzing became wayyy more scrutinized by slow motion replays and fans (especially with YouTube gaining popularity), so tech specialists felt more compelled to do their job and be less lenient. But nevertheless, Asada rotated her jumps much more consistently and less questionably in terms of rotation at the beginning of her career (which is often the case until a skater's body changes).
 

hanca

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Sep 23, 2008
I think it's more correct to say Asada landed questionable jumps consistently when she was young. If we take into account the specialists were not harsh in those days, then I agree.
However the standard of today is... fully rotated.

The jumps were not questionable. They were adequate quality for the rules from that time. The same way as many skaters did not go completely down on sit spin and now it would not be counted as a sit spin, but the rules from that time allowed it. You have to judge a skater according to the rules from that time. The current rules can't be made valid into past.
 

Ender

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May 17, 2017
The jumps were not questionable. They were adequate quality for the rules from that time. The same way as many skaters did not go completely down on sit spin and now it would not be counted as a sit spin, but the rules from that time allowed it. You have to judge a skater according to the rules from that time. The current rules can't be made valid into past.
Or we could say the term consistency was only invented when the current ladies started landing 7 triples left and right?
 

iamchrislao

On the Ice
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Jan 13, 2014
I think it's more correct to say Asada landed questionable jumps consistently when she was young. If we take into account the specialists were not harsh in those days, then I agree.
However the standard of today is... fully rotated.

u really shouldnt open ur mouth when u havent really followed her career. When she was younger, her combos and 3As were to die for. Fully rotated and consistent, etching her name in the history books. Everybody knew she was the one to watch out for. When she grew, as with any skater, we saw signs of it in her jumps. But did she overcome this? Of course. Look at how she turned things around for vancouver. Then she retooled her skating and started from scratch, all in the name of change. Quite admirable considering the birthing pains and negative early results. Of course there were going to be urs, mistakes. Retooling was unheard of in skating...until perhaps mao, who gave such a legendary free in sochi and rebounded to win her 3rd world title.
 

CanadianSkaterGuy

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Jan 25, 2013
Or we could say the term consistency was only invented when the current ladies started landing 7 triples left and right?

Well, if Kim did every competition like Vancouver even with 6 triples we could call it consistent. And her results are consistent with her podium finishes (not that a podium equates to a good performance). However Medvedeva is probably the only consistent 7-triple senior skater today and one of the few under IJS.
 

andromache

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Mar 23, 2014
I'm so disappointed and disinterested in the obsession with consistency for ladies skaters. The top men in the world are hugely inconsistent, and the pairs are probably only slightly less so. Consistency matters, but not as much as it seems to right now.
 

CanadianSkaterGuy

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Jan 25, 2013
I'm so disappointed and disinterested in the obsession with consistency for ladies skaters. The top men in the world are hugely inconsistent, and the pairs are probably only slightly less so. Consistency matters, but not as much as it seems to right now.

Well the great irony is that Medvedeva's consistency is making her predictably the winner and "boring". If she weren't winning so much I'm sure there wouldn't be half the talk of Tanos and glitz and choreo choices and whatnot.
 

skylark

Gazing at a Glorious Great Lakes sunset
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Well the great irony is that Medvedeva's consistency is making her predictably the winner and "boring". If she weren't winning so much I'm sure there wouldn't be half the talk of Tanos and glitz and choreo choices and whatnot.

Oh, I disagree. I dislike Medvedeva's so-many tanos and the sameness of her choreography because for me, those factors detract from the performance and make me think about them instead of losing myself in her performance ... which I'm almost able to do because she's charming and engaging. I'm sure there are other people besides me who also react that way. Her charm, freshness, and her other amazing technical qualities make up for it partially, but not entirely.
 

CanadianSkaterGuy

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Oh, I disagree. I dislike Medvedeva's so-many tanos and the sameness of her choreography because for me, those factors detract from the performance and make me think about them instead of losing myself in her performance ... which I'm almost able to do because she's charming and engaging. I'm sure there are other people besides me who also react that way. Her charm, freshness, and her other amazing technical qualities make up for it partially, but not entirely.

I don't think her choreo is the same - the interpretation and sentiment isn't a huge departure but I've actually compared programs from her first two seasons and they aren't as identical as some make it seem.

Her programs have been entirely different other than Na Katere (5 years ago). In a year where so many skaters are repeating past programs or doing warhorses, she continues to be unique in her musical selections. And I'm sure she will bring a special quality to her skating in an Olympic season because she can only challenge herself at this point.

And lol at her switching Tanos to Rippons. It's like when people complained about Surya doing a backflip on two legs so she did it on one. She hears what people are critiquing her on but is still making changes on her terms and some of these changes "address" the naysayers, in an amusing way. You don't like Tanos on everything? Fine... I''mma mix it up with some (more difficult) Rippons, so you stop complaining about all my *Tanos*. :p
 

Jaana

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No, when you only tunnel vision on that you lose the ability to get there in the first place, or at least to sustain it. Plus there is more to skating than just what gets a medal. Nobody cares if you win a medal if they don't care for your skating. If a skater wants an actual career then they will need to be aware of more.

Maybe that applied years and years ago as there were two big US tours, COI and SOI, and skaters needed to be successful in competitions plus popular to be invited into them. Those days are over and the matters are a lot different now. E.g. Japan has several short tours, but the Japanese audiences seem to like Russian skaters, all of them...

Anyway, I don´t think that these days skaters have a professional career, if they stay in skating maybe more as coaches or choreographers. As such they became popular if their students achieve success...
 

Tolstoj

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Nov 21, 2015
I'm so disappointed and disinterested in the obsession with consistency for ladies skaters. The top men in the world are hugely inconsistent, and the pairs are probably only slightly less so. Consistency matters, but not as much as it seems to right now.

It's harder to stay consistent every single time.

Personally i feel the opposite: when Javi or Patrick wins despite many mistakes, i don't think it's fair for the skaters behind them who skated a clean and more difficult program. (and it is a common thing in figure skating unfortunately, especially if you are representing a "minor" country)

Then of course you'll remind me that jumps aren't everything in figure skating, sure but in the past we're used to see low PCS when there are falls because those detracts from the performance, while now if you have the reputation of the champion, your PCS don't decrease.

It happens even in ladies figure skating (Carolina Kostner FS at Worlds 2014, Adelina Sotnikova or Kaetlyn Osmond few times) but not that often in this Olympic cycle.
 

moriel

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Mar 18, 2015
Maybe that applied years and years ago as there were two big US tours, COI and SOI, and skaters needed to be successful in competitions plus popular to be invited into them. Those days are over and the matters are a lot different now. E.g. Japan has several short tours, but the Japanese audiences seem to like Russian skaters, all of them...

Anyway, I don´t think that these days skaters have a professional career, if they stay in skating maybe more as coaches or choreographers. As such they became popular if their students achieve success...

Yeah, btw, japanese audiences seem to be totally crazy about Medvedeva so i suppose she has whatever it requires =)
 

andromache

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Mar 23, 2014
It's harder to stay consistent every single time.

Personally i feel the opposite: when Javi or Patrick wins despite many mistakes, i don't think it's fair for the skaters behind them who skated a clean and more difficult program. (and it is a common thing in figure skating unfortunately, especially if you are representing a "minor" country)

Then of course you'll remind me that jumps aren't everything in figure skating, sure but in the past we're used to see low PCS when there are falls because those detracts from the performance, while now if you have the reputation of the champion, your PCS don't decrease.

It happens even in ladies figure skating (Carolina Kostner FS at Worlds 2014, Adelina Sotnikova or Kaetlyn Osmond few times) but not that often in this Olympic cycle.

I'm not saying I want to see people winning who make mistakes - I want to see someone who usually bombs or is mistake-prone unexpectedly skate perfectly and be able to win. This happens in men's all the time - Yuzu, Javi, Boyang, etc. are all super inconsistent, but whoever skates cleanest on the day of will win. Same in pairs. But in ladies, it seems like taking risks and making mistakes is too risky, because it might hurt your reputation, and then when you finally DO skate perfectly you won't be rewarded. So the ladies aren't able to make the technical progress that men and pairs have.

Like, I was mad at the time, but looking back, I LOVE that Adelina basically came out of nowhere to win in Sochi. She was always super inconsistent, but she put together two clean programs, and bam, won. I just don't see that happening in the foreseeable future. If Gracie or Kaetlyn or Gabby or Anna or some other inconsistent-yet-otherwise-possibly-complete-package skates two perfect programs, they'll still be relatively underscored because of their past inconsistency.

Or if, for example, Mirai tries her 3A in every competition leading up to the Olympics, keeps falling and/or underrotating it, places 5th-6th on her GP placements, but then lands it in two programs at the Olympics and skates perfectly, can she unexpectedly win the Olympics? (Let's assume that with a 3A, Mirai's TES beats Evgenia's.) Anyway, I doubt it, because her scores will be penalized for all of her past mistakes.
 

Ender

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May 17, 2017
u really shouldnt open ur mouth when u havent really followed her career. When she was younger, her combos and 3As were to die for. Fully rotated and consistent, etching her name in the history books. Everybody knew she was the one to watch out for. When she grew, as with any skater, we saw signs of it in her jumps. But did she overcome this? Of course. Look at how she turned things around for vancouver. Then she retooled her skating and started from scratch, all in the name of change. Quite admirable considering the birthing pains and negative early results. Of course there were going to be urs, mistakes. Retooling was unheard of in skating...until perhaps mao, who gave such a legendary free in sochi and rebounded to win her 3rd world title.
I did watch Asada when she was young. I remember many of her jumps didn't have flow. Of course it's still high standard for those days. But it doesn't mean I have to say Asada's jumps were super. They were not, in my opinion.
 

koatcue

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Aug 31, 2011
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I'm not saying I want to see people winning who make mistakes - I want to see someone who usually bombs or is mistake-prone unexpectedly skate perfectly and be able to win. This happens in men's all the time - Yuzu, Javi, Boyang, etc. are all super inconsistent, but whoever skates cleanest on the day of will win. Same in pairs. But in ladies, it seems like taking risks and making mistakes is too risky, because it might hurt your reputation, and then when you finally DO skate perfectly you won't be rewarded. So the ladies aren't able to make the technical progress that men and pairs have.
I'd love that too:) But really for me all depends on the program...Before seeing anything I want Anna to win, but all can change due to program. Sometimes you just can't resist
 

koatcue

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Country
Russia
PS - I think Kaetlyn and Gracie at their hypothetical best could beat Zhenia or at least make it competitive.
 

Tolstoj

Record Breaker
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Nov 21, 2015
I'm not saying I want to see people winning who make mistakes - I want to see someone who usually bombs or is mistake-prone unexpectedly skate perfectly and be able to win. This happens in men's all the time - Yuzu, Javi, Boyang, etc. are all super inconsistent, but whoever skates cleanest on the day of will win. Same in pairs. But in ladies, it seems like taking risks and making mistakes is too risky, because it might hurt your reputation, and then when you finally DO skate perfectly you won't be rewarded. So the ladies aren't able to make the technical progress that men and pairs have.

Like, I was mad at the time, but looking back, I LOVE that Adelina basically came out of nowhere to win in Sochi. She was always super inconsistent, but she put together two clean programs, and bam, won. I just don't see that happening in the foreseeable future. If Gracie or Kaetlyn or Gabby or Anna or some other inconsistent-yet-otherwise-possibly-complete-package skates two perfect programs, they'll still be relatively underscored because of their past inconsistency.

Or if, for example, Mirai tries her 3A in every competition leading up to the Olympics, keeps falling and/or underrotating it, places 5th-6th on her GP placements, but then lands it in two programs at the Olympics and skates perfectly, can she unexpectedly win the Olympics? (Let's assume that with a 3A, Mirai's TES beats Evgenia's.) Anyway, I doubt it, because her scores will be penalized for all of her past mistakes.

Okay i'd agree on that, though it did happen at Worlds 2017 where Gabby Daleman and Karen Chen skated clean and received the big scores.

It could have happened for Gracie a couple of times including Worlds 2016 (where she was first after the SP with a 3 points margin), but she has never skated two clean programs back to back so it's totally her fault.

The thing about Mirai is that she isn't the best skaters even when it comes to skating skills, speed, transitions and she struggles with underrotations quite a lot. With two clean programs including one 3A she could medal at the Olympics but winning it? i'm not sure.

Let's say Gabby Daleman lands a 4T and clean the rest of her programs at the Olympics, then i can see her being the Olympic champion honestly.

PS - I think Kaetlyn and Gracie at their hypothetical best could beat Zhenia or at least make it competitive.

I think it was definitely a possibility for Gracie two years ago at Skate America, GPF and Worlds, Kaetlyn i don't think so: even with a clean 3lo at Worlds if you give the additional points to her FS, the combined score would have been still behind Evgenia.
 
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