Was media harsh with Gracie Gold?

NanaPat · Jun 19, 2017

Manitou said:
Gracie is a skating professional, so if she looses her ability to skate then she she is just a private person. We may hold memories of her when she used to be a skater, but again: she is a skater, and a skater is supposed to skate, not to make a big fuss about some imaginary "feelings".

I don't think Gracie herself has made any kind of fuss.

Some people are less cold-blooded than you are, and do consider people as human beings as well as considering "what can they do for me". I'm kind of in the middle, toward the cold side, about most professionals I deal with. It didn't bother me much that my surgeon was a bit of an *******, as long as he was a good surgeon, but I'm really glad my regular doctor is pleasant and reasonably caring as well as competent, since I rely on his judgment and see him on an ongoing basis.

sinnerspinner · Jun 19, 2017

tars said:
Gracie's pictures from "Stars On Ice" are pretty harsh on her tbh...
http://absoluteskating.com/index.php?cat=photogallery&id=2017soisanjose-1

Gah! Everyone else looks trim.

I don't think Gracie wants to skate. That looks like self sabotage to me. You can't *make* someone want to skate.

Sometimes i think she should push through. Other times i think she looks too miserable for force herself to skate. I worry what would happen to her self esteem if she went to the Olympics and bombed.

TheCzar · Jun 19, 2017

Manitou said:
Nobody was harsh to anybody. She was treated fair.
The skater's job is to skate well. That's all. That's how skater's value is measured and that's the only thing she is supposed to do. It applies to all athletes and all professionals. My employer cares about my "human feelings" only as long as it adds to my professional value. If my professional value for the company is none, then my feelings don't mean squat to him. My value for him is measured how my skills and work can add to the company. That's it.
An actor is measured by his/her acting, a doctor is measured by treating illnesses. I don't care about the doctor as a generic human being. He/she can be a robot or an alien. I don't care. He/she is supposed to help me with my illness. I don't care about his/her feelings, cultural background or world views.
Gracie is a skating professional, so if she looses her ability to skate then she she is just a private person. We may hold memories of her when she used to be a skater, but again: she is a skater, and a skater is supposed to skate, not to make a big fuss about some imaginary "feelings".

That trivialises the human being. The difference between Gracie Gold and your doctor is that your doctor isn't on front page news with the whole world watching. Also very different career paths. Athletes aren't the same as health care professionals. You have to account for their imaginary 'feelings' because taking away the skills- your athlete is literally left with nothing but their psychological and physical need to compete and the consequences that comes with it when something is thrown off key. A physician can kill someone if he makes a mistake- that is why they have to be mechanical in the OR.

It makes me sad that you feel your 'human feelings' are only valued depending on your worth at work. Here in the UK we have grievance support, companies have support systems whom they refer you to if you feel unhappy at work, etc.- just to make sure that when you come to work you have optimum results. Apathy is the reason why some people commit suicide, or have mental breakdowns because of work related issues. It's not so much that you need to feel like you and Gracie Gold, or Meryl Streep or Derek Shepherd are buddy buddies. You just need to be emphatic. Gracie Gold is a young woman under intense pressure, and it seems she doesn't have the right people around her.

musicfan80 · Jun 19, 2017

sinnerspinner said:
I worry what would happen to her self esteem if she went to the Olympics and bombed.

Actually, I'm more worried about what would happen if she bombed again at next year's U.S. Nationals. I really hope that doesn't happen.

As far my opinion on her desire/fitness for skating goes, I've decided to wait until her Sun Valley Ice Show and/or Champs Camp in August. I haven't seen a lot of social media activity from her in about a month - I have no reason to think that it's not a sign she is working hard on her new programs - and getting everything else about her skating ready for next season.

Who knows? This could end up being the best summer of her life - both personally and professionally.

Ares · Jun 19, 2017

I don't think she was treated harshly, if anything it was Gracie who was harsh regarding her own person more than anything. Sure, maybe less social media activity could be better for her, sometimes you can come across some comments that could be nasty but that's only part of the thing.

sheetz · Jun 19, 2017

sinnerspinner said:
I worry what would happen to her self esteem if she went to the Olympics and bombed.

At this point I think most people would consider it a huge success for her to even make the Olympic team.

Manitou · Jun 19, 2017

TheCzar said:
... is the reason why some people commit suicide, or have mental breakdowns because of work related issues. ...

If I had a suicidal or mentally unstable dude applying for a job at my company he would not have even a slightest chance to be invited. I would say: deal with your issues at home, but not here!
I felt embarrassed seeing Gracie and Yulia breaking down. I liked and cheered them both, but when they broke down the bombastic way they both did then they lost my support immediately. I obviously wish them well as human beings, but the competitive sport is not what they should be doing.
You know, even in arts or entertainment - if a ballet dancer or an actor breaks down on a stage then they are ejected from the job with the light speed. That's the way the world should work - you put your own stuff together by yourself. Don't bother the world with your issues.

Lamente Ariane · Jun 19, 2017

Uh, what "breakdown" are you talking about with Julia? If you mean Rostelecom Cup, she had a literal physical injury plaguing her, she didn't stop her program for the fun of it. If skaters "lose your support" the moment you realize they're human beings, I don't know what to say to you. As for Gracie, she's never been my favorite but it saddens me to see anyone seeming to lose their passion, and I sincerely hope if she continues to compete she does so because she rediscovers the joy of skating and finds her competitive fire.

sinnerspinner · Jun 19, 2017

musicfan80 said:
Actually, I'm more worried about what would happen if she bombed again at next year's U.S. Nationals. I really hope that doesn't happen.

As far my opinion on her desire/fitness for skating goes, I've decided to wait until her Sun Valley Ice Show and/or Champs Camp in August. I haven't seen a lot of social media activity from her in about a month - I have no reason to think that it's not a sign she is working hard on her new programs - and getting everything else about her skating ready for next season.

Who knows? This could end up being the best summer of her life - both personally and professionally.

I hope Gracie does whatever makes her happy. Right now it doens't look like skating or at least competing makes her happy.

Of course, i don't know Gracie, but in context to me, it looks like gained weight *accidentally on purpose.* What better way to get out of skating than to do things that will harm ones abilities? Yes, she'll get out there are skate but also look unhappy or plain miserable. I'm interested in psychology and sports psychology, so this is interesting to me.

Mathman · Jun 19, 2017

Manitou said:
If I had a suicidal or mentally unstable dude applying for a job at my company he would not have even a slightest chance to be invited. I would say: deal with your issues at home, but not here!...

I think the point is this. U.S Nationals is open to all qualifiers. If Gracie qualifies, she skates. If she wins an Olympic berth, good for her. If she doesn't, that's life. It is not our job to tell her to go home and work out her issues.

Manitou · Jun 19, 2017

Lamente Ariane said:
...If skaters "lose your support" the moment you realize they're human beings, I don't know what to say to you.

Everybody falls and everybody is a human being with own struggles. However, as long as the athlete has a potential to get up and keep going then that's exactly what the true strength is about. However, I don't think Gracie has that potential anymore.
As to Yulia, I feel sad for her, it was not her fault at all, she was just a little girl broken by the enormous entire world's pressure. If the world had left her alone back then, probably she would be in competition right now.
Gracie lost to herself. Plus, she was not a little girl. She might be a great person, but I can state with a high degree of probability, that the world class competition is not meant for her.

Manitou · Jun 19, 2017

Mathman said:
I think the point is this. U.S Nationals is open to all qualifiers. If Gracie qualifies, she skates. If she wins an Olympic berth, good for her. If she doesn't, that's life. It is not our job to tell her to go home and work out her issues.

To do that she must be first at Nationals, I believe. If that's what the rules are at this moment. Everybody else is at the federation's mercy.

sheetz · Jun 19, 2017

Will Gracie need to qualify for Nationals or will she get a bye?

mrrice · Jun 19, 2017

I believe that her finishing in the Final Flight gets her a bye. I take that back. I just read the rules regarding byes into Nationals and it seems that only the 5 get them. So yes, it looks like Gracie will have skate her into a spot at Nationals. Something she is more than capable of doing when she's at, or near, her best. Let's hope she's ready and motivated to make it happen.

sabinfire · Jun 19, 2017

mrrice said:
I believe that her finishing in the Final Flight gets her a bye. I don't remember the exact rule but I think the top 12 skaters are invited to return.

According to this, only the top 5 finishers make it:

"Placing in the top five in a senior event at the previous year's U.S. Championships"
http://www.usfsa.org/events?id=84176

Remember, Gracie received two Grand Prix assignments this year:

"Earning an "international bye" based on proximity of an international assignment in the current season to the sectional championships"

twirlingblades · Jun 19, 2017

sabinfire said:
According to this, only the top 5 finishers make it:

"Placing in the top five in a senior event at the previous year's U.S. Championships"
http://www.usfsa.org/events?id=84176

Remember, Gracie received two Grand Prix assignments this year:

"Earning an "international bye" based on proximity of an international assignment in the current season to the sectional championships"

Both of her GP assignments are in November, which is the same month as sectionals, so she will get a bye (unless she withdraws).

drivingmissdaisy · Jun 19, 2017

Does this exempt her? "Winning a medal at the most recent Olympic Winter Games"

Mathman · Jun 19, 2017

Manitou said:
To do that she must be first at Nationals, I believe. If that's what the rules are at this moment. Everybody else is at the federation's mercy.

In this respect, she is no different from any other competitor.

Manitou · Jun 19, 2017

Mathman said:
In this respect, she is no different from any other competitor.

She is, because the past reputation, I believe, plays important part in the decision making.

Assume she's third, and the fourth competitor is close behind. If that fourth competitor is a girl with a clean reputation of not collapsing when crowds are watching, then I hope that competitor is strongly preferred.

drivingmissdaisy · Jun 19, 2017

Manitou said:
Assume she's third, and the fourth competitor is close behind. If that fourth competitor is a girl with a clean reputation of not collapsing when crowds are watching, then I hope that competitor is strongly preferred.

Given her history and potential, I'd say that if she's 3rd, there is a 0% chance of Gracie getting left off the team.

Was media harsh with Gracie Gold?

NanaPat

sinnerspinner

TheCzar

musicfan80

Ares

sheetz

Manitou

Lamente Ariane

Skating Skills -5, Fashion +3, Camp +4

sinnerspinner

Mathman

Manitou

Manitou

sheetz

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