The challenges of music editing/cutting | Golden Skate

The challenges of music editing/cutting

Mrs. P

Uno, Dos, twizzle!
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Dec 27, 2009
Pulling from the programs thread:

Also, one obvious challenge is cutting music. A lot of these pieces have to be edited and I get a sense most skaters find it easier to go with what has been done music edit wise then try to edit something completely from scratch.

FWIW, the Shibtuanis have been working with a music editor this season and last.

Actually most skaters use music editors one way or another (whether they get a pro to actually cut it, or they or their choreographer do it), each season no matter the piece. For example: Not everyone uses the same cut of warhorses every time.

I guess what I'm referring to is that the Shibs are using a musician to cut their music. I get that somebody has to do it regardless. :) But I would imagine that if you don't want to invest the time or money to cut a piece that has not been used a lot in skating, I can see why people stick to the same edits.

That is the point I am making. They are not the first ones to do this nor will they be in the future. Adam uses a pro musician, Jeremy Abbott's edit/cut of Exogenesis in 2012 was done with a professional and part of it was even composed extra by Steven Jamail in order to avoid the lyrics (which weren't allowed at the time), there are many others. When I mentioned the warhorses in the previous post was to point out that even those aren't all the same cuts, they differ in even the smallest ways.

I have heard references over the years to music editing/cutting, but I think it would be fun to have a discussion. How have skaters tried to get music edited for competition (examples above).
 

Sam-Skwantch

“I solemnly swear I’m up to no good”
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I hope this isn't taken as self promoting because I only edit for friends I know who skate but it can be extremely maddening to try and mix cuts together. I've spent hours arranging different pieces and in the end determined that they just don't work. I failed epically with a shakira mix one time. :slink:

It is rewarding when everything clicks and a program music all comes together. I mixed up three different Harry Potter tracks to come up with this version of a hypothetical program.

https://youtu.be/1PJCsTojx8g

I'd be more than willing to field questions on the editing or even take a challenge and try and mix together a new program based on some GS suggestions.
 

YesWay

四年もかけて&#
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Sep 28, 2013
it can be extremely maddening to try and mix cuts together.
This^

I've done it a couple of times, and never mind mixing parts from different songs/pieces - just taking one piece of music... editing it to include only the parts you want... while making it the right duration... and getting it to sound slick and natural... can be a total NIGHTMARE.

I'm sure it's something that becomes easier with practice... but I haven't had that much practice...! :-/
 

JSM

On the Ice
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Dec 11, 2011
I think a lot of fans and observers underestimate the time and consideration that can go into a piece of music. Like Sam-Skwantch, I've spent many hours trying to cut pieces that just don't work out in the end. The biggest problem I've had is making it sound "complete". Music can build but it must go somewhere, in the defined program length, in order for it to work.

In addition, the piece must be well defined, have a beginning and an end, it must work with the skater, it must flow from one section to the next, it must change tempos to incorporate the elements, it must be approved by the coaches, it must work with an ice rink sound system, it must sound good to the judges, it must be pleasant for an audience, and most importantly, it has to be something that resonates with the skater, who will hear it every day, multiple times a day, for a year, and still be able to perform their hearts out during the competition. It's a lot to ask for a program.
 

Mrs. P

Uno, Dos, twizzle!
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Dec 27, 2009
So i'm curious if there's been any on-the-record information regarding music cuts/editing.

I know that Charlie White has a generally good reputation for music cutting; that's something Meryl said has been valuable in their dance career. Are there examples of others saying the same about their choreographers/music editors?
 

SnowWhite

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One musician/composer that a lot of skaters work with is Karl Hugo. He composed the middle piece of music in Virtue/Moir's FD this past season (called Shadows) and he's worked with them before too, when they were still with Marina. He divides his work with skaters into three categories on his website: composition, re-composition and adaption, and arrangements and orchestration. He's worked with Marie-France and Patrice when they were competing, Miki Ando, Anna Cappellini & Luca Lanotte, Meagan Duhamel & Eric Radford, Gracie Gold, Yuzuru Hanyu, Gabriella Papadakis & Guillaume Cizeron, Cathy Reed & Chris Reed, Joannie Rochette, Synchro Canada, Kaitlyn Weaver & Andrew Poje and Yuna Kim, among others.
 

theoreticalgirl

Rinkside
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Feb 23, 2006
There are plenty of publications out there that discuss all aspects of music production (recording, mixing, mastering, etc). You're most likely not going to read a lot about figure skating per se, but you can read about related areas to get a sense of how it works. I particularly like Tape Op, Sound On Sound, and Transom.org. I come from a background in music and radio, so this is not too far out of my wheelhouse; I have recorded, mixed, and mastered my own program music in the past.

Another engineer a lot of skaters use is The Skating Music Guy; I know a lot of skaters from all levels work with him: http://theskatingmusicguy.com/
 

Ender

Match Penalty
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May 17, 2017
Have we ever had composers writing music for some specific skaters before?
 

gravy

¿No ven quién soy yo?
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Mar 28, 2014
Have we ever had composers writing music for some specific skaters before?

Maxime Rodriguez has composed a lot of music for skaters over the years. Off the top of my head, I know the last part of Pechalat & Bourzat's Little Prince free dance music was created by him because they couldn't find the appropriate music.
 

cl2

Final Flight
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Nov 9, 2014
Have we ever had composers writing music for some specific skaters before?

Why is it even necessary to have newly composed music for skating? The composed music still requires hiring musicians to play it. Would it be easier to just hire musicians to play your exact "cuts" of existing music, I wonder?

ETA: Maybe only applicable to non-copyrighted music such as classical music or jazz standards.
 

gkelly

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Jul 26, 2003
Mark Militano

Dmitri Dmitrenko also reportedly composed some of the music he skated to.

Maxim Rodriguez is the only non-skater composer I know of offhand who has made a practice of composing music for skating.

Some skaters -- Torvill & Dean and Katarina Witt come to mind -- have worked directly with musicians to arrange and record skating-appropriate versions of existing compositions.
 

mrrice

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Jul 9, 2014
I have always wondered if Armin Mahbanoozadeh or Beatrisa Liang had considered writing music. I have never seen Armin play piano except on video. However, I used to see Bebe at CSUN when I was working with their Marching Band. Like so many other skaters, she is absolutely tiny. I just looked at her Bio and it says that she is only 5' tall and I say that's a very accurate number. Now that they allow vocals, maybe someone will use one of Yuna's songs. She sings quite well.
 

Ic3Rabbit

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So i'm curious if there's been any on-the-record information regarding music cuts/editing.

I know that Charlie White has a generally good reputation for music cutting; that's something Meryl said has been valuable in their dance career. Are there examples of others saying the same about their choreographers/music editors?

Abbott has cut many of his own pieces of music, if not all, I think Exogenesis was one of the exceptions.
 

Mrs. P

Uno, Dos, twizzle!
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Dec 27, 2009
Thanks everyone for their thoughts!

It's really interesting to see the range of options regarding music, especially regarding DIY vs. hiring out. Modifications made to the music to fit a competition program, etc.
 
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