new article about Yuna and her mom

Morning Glory · Jun 11, 2009

As a mother of two daughters (they are only 4 and 5

), this thread is very helpful.

hongligl said:
One thing I would like to add is that I'm totally against the idea of fullfilling yourself through your children. To me, I just want to help my daughter to be the best she wants to be, she is not me and will never be me. No matter how well or bad she does, it is her business, not a reflection of me. I will never push my child for myself. That IS selfish. I would never ask my child to kill herself or get lost if she didn't do as well as I expected.

After reading hongligl's comment, I think I have to warn myself not to be an education-minded mother( I've already put my one leg into this...).

bellarina said:
It was only when I got older that I realized that, if not for my mom, I would never be where I was now. I would never have gotten in an Ivy League college if not for the way she raised me and stressed the importance of academics. I'm a lazy sort, and sometimes (well, most of the time, really), just working for myself is not enough. If I know that someone will be disappointed and angry if I don't do well, I step it up. And now, I've realized, I do it for myself, but wouldn't have learned to do that if not for my mom. That's not to say that other parenting styles are ineffective, of course, just that for me personally, it brought out the best in me. And, as I realized later, it was all for my well-being, so that I could be happy in the future.

But after reading bellarina's comment, again I think I'm right. Honestly, I'm still wandering though.

shallwedansu said:
All I'm really curious, how would everyone else act in this situation?

Umm... difficult situation, but I can't imagine that I put our resources into only one child even if she has the possibilty to be a world champion. This is my opinion, and I don't think Yuna's mam is wrong.

cosmos · Jun 11, 2009

passion said:
The description of Yu Na's mom is exactly like Mama Leung. It's disturbing to hear that other moms are immulating their obsession with their daughter's success. Despite good intentions, if moms become too involved in the instruction of skating to their daughters they may be damaging their technique or undoing the good the professional coach is doing...amongst a zillion other things.

YuNa's mom has never been known to be involved in the instructions of the Cricket club. She doesn't need to. YuNa is under the world best coaching team.

In Korea, she was just, like other Koreans or Korean moms, a believer of THE MORE THE BETTER. The more practice, the better skater. (Orser pointed out in an interview about YuNa that sometimes the less the better). Other than that, she was and is a wonderful mom. Still, YuNa is spending most of time with her. She herself is a skating fan, especially men's. I heard she is a fan of Johnny, Jeff, and Lambiel just like YuNa.

Mikoto · Jun 11, 2009

AFAIK some of NYT articles are badly biased against Japan and Japanese culture. Maybe same with S.Korea?

janetfan · Jun 11, 2009

Mikoto said:
AFAIK NYT articles are badly biased against Japan and Japanese culture. Maybe same with S.Korea?

I have been reading NY Times for over 20 years and can't say that I have noticed that before. Perhaps others have and can comment further.
The reporter who wrote this article happens to be Korean - so maybe they are not a fan of backstage mothers or Korean mom's who devote so much time and energy into their children. Or maybe they reviewed the book in what they perceived to be a fair manner. I really don't know.

Medusa · Jun 11, 2009

Mikoto said:
AFAIK some of NYT articles are badly biased against Japan and Japanese culture. Maybe same with S.Korea?

It's a freaking newspaper, people! Of course they have opinions, of course there are articles that seem to be very opinionated, of course people disagree and agree with certain world views and opinions stated there. If you can't take it, don't read it. There is perhaps some completely unbiased and objective newsticker somewhere for you.

I collect lots of newspaper articles, paper and online. I have sorted them after regions; there is one category for the colonies (USA & Canada), one for France, one for Russia, one for China, one for rest of Asia etc. And I can go through that stuff and show you articles about problems / phenomenons in other countries (from NYT or other newspapers) that could make you think that the newspaper is very biased. E.g. there was this one piece about the employment situation of women in Germany, it made Germany sound like a third World country, that treats women only a tiny bit better than Saudi Arabia. It's what they do, they report, they state their opinion. It's not like they told outrageous lies in the Yu-Na-article, or in that Germany article.

Are they supposed to report nothing? "June, 12th, 2009 - Seoul, South Korea: everything is perfect. And if everything weren't perfect - we wouldn't report it, because it's possible that we don't get the fine points of South Korean culture / society."

And if you really think that some report is absolutely wrong and disgusting - write letters to the newspaper, write your own report / opinion about this and distribute it over livejournal / twitter / blogs. Freedom of opinion, freedom of speech!

Mathman · Jun 11, 2009

Medusa said:
And if you really think that some report is absolutely wrong and disgusting - write letters to the newspaper, write your own report / opinion about this and distribute it over livejournal / twitter / blogs. Freedom of opinion, freedom of speech!

Or post your opinion here! :biggrin:

Spun Silver · Jun 11, 2009

Mathman said:
Or post your opinion here!

But you have to ask Medusa first. Otherwise you get the Gorgon's glare! :rofl:

Poor Mikoto! FYI, Mikoto: I stopped reading the NYT last summer because of bias. Different bias, but still.

Mikoto · Jun 12, 2009

Yeah, I'll follow your advices not to be stone.

evangeline · Jun 12, 2009

If you think the New York Times is egregiously biased....wait till you watch something by Fox News.

szidon · Jun 12, 2009

passion said:
The description of Yu Na's mom is exactly like Mama Leung. It's disturbing to hear that other moms are immulating their obsession with their daughter's success. Despite good intentions, if moms become too involved in the instruction of skating to their daughters they may be damaging their technique or undoing the good the professional coach is doing...amongst a zillion other things.

Please tell me who talked about Yu-na's mom like that? :frown2:

Come on, she's never appealed to judges like Leung's mom. It is quite offensive to Orser to talk like that given his expertise and reputation.

For sure she's known for having an eye for figure skating, but she's also a typical mom who couldn't even watch her daughter's performances hiding her face in her hands at the GPF.

Medusa · Jun 12, 2009

Spun Silver said:
But you have to ask Medusa first. Otherwise you get the Gorgon's glare!

Mikoto said:
Yeah, I'll follow your advices not to be stone.

I only use the Gorgon's glare in cases of absolute need. You can't use it for petty things, otherwise people aren't scared anymore. :yes:

My point is just that I am a tad allergic to people who think that the world is out there to get them. And imagining that a newspaper is biased towards a certain culture / nation (mostly their own) is certainly a part of that.

Daniel5555 · Jun 12, 2009

This article is clearly not very good. It has very one-sided view of the situation.
You need to understand, that a reporter is just a reporter. He's not an expert in everything, neither he knows Yuna and Yuna's family too close to make any reliable conclusion.

Come on, sometimes journalists make obvious errors. I see it every day in Spanish newspapers. American ones can't be different in that matter

I would like you to pay more attention to what shallwedansu wrote in his post here: http://www.goldenskate.com/forum/showpost.php?p=399911&postcount=24

Yuna's mother was obviously not an obsessive woman who sacrificed her, her family and Yuna's sister to figure skating. This is just not true. They agreed that Yuna's father will stay with Aera (Yuna's sister, and I can bet that this journalist even don't know her name) while Yuna's mother will stay more with Yuna. Of course, when you read that article you focus only on "sister's graduation was skipped" and stuff like that.
But what you want - should Yuna's mom abandon Yuna on her competition or should Yuna do not participate at all?
Come on, that's ridiculous, I bet even Aera herself wouldn't like it.

Ms. Park just did what every good mother would do. Maybe she was pushing it too much sometimes, but what's true is that Yuna never said her mother was too strict. Oh-oh, ok... she said that when she was 14. Well, I hated my mother too sometimes at that age. You never got scolded for something?

Now OK, you're right that there will be like hundreds of mothers who will push their kids to figure skating like crazy just to broke their lives. That's true. I completely agree with Medusa, that this is really bad behavior. But it's not Yuna's case and trust me, Yuna's fans, at least those who I know, would be the first ones to notice something bad and they would never hide it.

janetfan · Jun 12, 2009

Daniel5555 said:
This article is clearly not very good. It has very one-sided view of the situation.
You need to understand, that a reporter is just a reporter. He's not an expert in everything, neither he knows Yuna and Yuna's family too close to make any reliable conclusion.
Come on, sometimes journalists make obvious errors. I see it every day in Spanish newspapers. American ones can't be different in that matter

Yuna's fans, at least those who I know, would be the first ones to notice something bad and they would never hide it.

Thanks for your views.
I do wonder why every post from Yuna fans fails to mention this article is written by a KOREAN reporter.
A problem mentioning that FACT is that it makes complaints on bias and anti-Korean/Asian feeling much less credible. It makes it harder to tell us this reporter knows nothing about Korean culture and doesn't know anything about Yuna or her mother. Frankly, I find that hard to believe.
But I can still recognize it is possible the article is biased or just not a fair representation of Yuna's mother because I have not read the book. I wonder besides Belle, how many of us have actually read the book?
Does anyone - particularly those so offended by this article know anything about the Korean reporter who wrote it? Maybe they are not a reporter but a book reviewer who only read the cliff notes

Daniel5555 · Jun 12, 2009

janetfan

I do wonder why every post from Yuna fans fails to mention this article is written by a KOREAN reporter.

Because that doesn't matter really.
A lot of nasty comments about Yuna come out from Koreans. And the fact that the reporter is Korean doesn't make his article better just because of it.

It makes it harder to tell us this reporter knows nothing about Korean culture and doesn't know anything about Yuna or her mother.

It's written as an essay based on the news and other articles. It doesn't have any original material.
And about Korean culture... You know, actually I'm surprised by the title "Mother's Love Becomes Obsession for Some South Koreans" like it's something new happening because of Yuna. In fact, most Korean parents are investing hard in their kid's education and that's something that was going years before Yuna. The life of Yuna may look very hard, but actually I wonder if it really was that hard comparing to the life of an average Korean teenager. They are, literally, studying all day in school from morning to the late evening and they have their homework after that. It's going beyond this thread whether it's right approach for education or not... But the fact that Yuna was studying more by herself and have avoided all that, actually it's rather good.

So personally I find that article confusing rather than explaining something about Korean culture or Yuna's family.

sillylionlove · Jun 12, 2009

shallwedansu said:
What exactly would happen? Will Yu-Na's mom beat her? Because someone on FSU accused Yu-Na's mom of beating Yu-Na when she was younger! :scowl:

See, this is exactly what I feared would happen. People will read a slanted article and develop the mentality that Yu-Na's mom is some kind of crazy, stage mom. This is what happens when all the facts aren't presented and both sides of the story aren't explained.

After reading further explanations, Yu-Na's mom doesn't seem as bad as how the article makes her out to be. Honestly, I don't think I would have acted otherwise had I been in her shoes. Again, what would you have done if you were in her situation?

After reading Yu-Na's letter to her fans, I don't think it will be the end of the world if Yu-Na doesn't win gold in 2010. I also don't think her mom would ever feel anything less than proud of her daughter if she doesn't win. Let's not make her into the uncaring, monster she's not.

I didn't mean anything bad would happen. I was just saying that there might be some major disappointments by the family and maybe more pressure on her to continue on skating a such a high level.

janetfan · Jun 12, 2009

Daniel5555 said:
Because that doesn't matter really.
A lot of nasty comments about Yuna come out from Koreans. And the fact that the reporter is Korean doesn't make his article better just because of it.

t's written as an essay based on the news and other articles. It doesn't have any original material.
.

Why doesn't it matter? If someone here posts that the NY Times is biased against Asians - but fails to mention the reporter is Korean? That seems relevant to me.

Or if the article is attacked for a lack of understanding of Korean mothers and culture - yet the article is written by a Korean. Somehow that seems to be relevant.

As to how the article is written - one thing is very clear . The article has direct quotes from the book as well as a few quotes from Yuna.
There is most definitely "original material" in this article.

Perhaps the article is biased and unfair. I don't know how any of us can have such strong feelings about this unless we have read the book. Then a more fair judgement could be made. But just saying it is wrong is only your opinion. It doesn't really prove anything except how you feel about the article.

The thought has occurred to me that this review may have intentionally been written in a provocative manner . Nothing can help boost a book's sales like a controversial review - one that gets people talking about it. Publishers have been known to stoop to almost any level when trying to create a buzz about a new book. This book will never be a big seller in the USA so a publisher/distributor looks for any opportunity to create sales wherever and however they can.

babyalligator · Jun 12, 2009

I agree with Daniel5555 about people taking the not attending graduation thing too seriously and it being an indicator of unhealthy obsessiveness on Yuna's mom's part. I have a younger sister and if she was a very talented skater who had an important competition while I had my college graduation (forget high school), I would definitely want her there along with my mom to support her. I would be supporting her during my graduation, and I have full confidence that my sister would be congratulating me from far away. That's why we're family.

And on another note, being Korean/Korean-American (whatever that reporter is) is not a reliable indicator of whether that reporter is biased towards or against Yuna. I know both Koreans and Korean-Americans who are either very critical of Korean society or very forgiving of any faults found in Korean society. Then there is the third group of Koreans who are a mix of both.

I think a negative side affect of this article, is that not only does it propagate the stereotype that Asian parents are more crazy obsessive than their Western counterparts (from my observations, definitely not true--parents from both cultures are equally obsessive and equally caring and equally want their kids to be happy) the article also might mislead certain parents into thinking that success is indeed rooted in only pushing, pushing, pushing their kids without rhyme or reason. There are reasons why Yuna's mom did what she did. It's a pity that the article presents only half the equation.

fairly4 · Jun 12, 2009

janetfan, no i don't think the NYTimes is biased against Asians,
They just printed what Yu-na mom did for Yu-na.
If it seems like her mom pushed Yu-na at the expense/and or overly favored Yu-na over the other daughter, than that is what is her (yu-na mom) implied.
Whether she really did or not. I don't know, but it just goes to show you have to watch how you word things to the media.
It also seem that Yu-na got babied all her life,
on the other hand, Her mom is willing to sacrifice her goals for her daughter.
Hopefully not at the expense of the family. the other daughter,
I just hope Yu-na isn't arrogrant, ungrateful for all the time, attention her mother and family did for her behalf.

evangeline · Jun 12, 2009

babyalligator said:
I think a negative side affect of this article, is that not only does it propagate the stereotype that Asian parents are more crazy obsessive than their Western counterparts (from my observations, definitely not true--parents from both cultures are equally obsessive and equally caring and equally want their kids to be happy) the article also might mislead certain parents into thinking that success is indeed rooted in only pushing, pushing, pushing their kids without rhyme or reason. There are reasons why Yuna's mom did what she did. It's a pity that the article presents only half the equation.

I don't think that the the New York Times really is bent on propagating the crazy-Asian-parent stereotype. As a regular reader of the New York Times, I remember plenty of articles talking about the extremes of parenting in general--last year, I remember this article about Manhattanite parents obsessing and pushing their kids hard to get into the right preschool. And based on the less-than-glowing portrayals, I doubt the New York Times is really misleading parents into thinking that pushing their kids extremely hard is the only way to success. But perhaps the New York Times is against parents in general?

Honestly, I don't know why people are so up in arms about this article. It is undeniable that Yu-Na's mother and family sacrificed a lot to get Yu-Na to where she is right now: this article, along with the excerpts I've seen of Yu-Na's mother's book, makes this clear. This article does not appear to completely endorse the actions of Yu-Na's mother--but so what? Some people disagree with this style of parenting, and others agree. Different strokes for different folks--just because someone disagrees with how Yu-Na's mother handled the situation doesn't mean that they're inherently wrong, completely ignorant about Korean culture, or egregiously biased.

janetfan · Jun 12, 2009

evangeline said:
I don't think that the the New York Times really is bent on propagating the crazy-Asian-parent stereotype. As a regular reader of the New York Times, I remember plenty of articles talking about the extremes of parenting in general--last year, I remember this article about Manhattanite parents obsessing and pushing their kids hard to get into the right preschool. And based on the less-than-glowing portrayals, I doubt the New York Times is really misleading parents into thinking that pushing their kids extremely hard is the only way to success. But perhaps the New York Times is against parents in general?

Honestly, I don't know why people are so up in arms about this article. It is undeniable that Yu-Na's mother and family sacrificed a lot to get Yu-Na to where she is right now: this article, along with the excerpts I've seen of Yu-Na's mother's book, makes this clear. This article does not appear to completely endorse the actions of Yu-Na's mother--but so what? Some people disagree with this style of parenting, and others agree. Different strokes for different folks--just because someone disagrees with how Yu-Na's mother handled the situation doesn't mean that they're inherently wrong, completely ignorant about Korean culture, or egregiously biased.

It is nice to hear a voice of reason about this topic.

new article about Yuna and her mom

Morning Glory

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Mikoto

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szidon

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