Medal Winners Open

Blades of Passion said:

Um? Takahashi only overshadowed him in 2006. Honda was the best male skater in Japan for an entire decade before that...

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I think she means in the grand scheme of things, not in the moment... Honda's rarely talked about Dai is talked about quite a bit like he was a breakthrough (which in some ways he is).

At least that's how I took that comment. :yes:

Macassar88 said:

The little sticking out of the tongue after the triple flip was pretty funny.

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Yeah, like "look what I can do!" And she is a mother of two kids. Still did better than ice princesses. Good work, Ira! :thumbsup:

let`s talk said:

Buttle skated his average routine. I assume it's some kind of conveyer job for him. Seriously, do something, man! It's getting boring to see the same stuff over and over again, just with a different music and in new cheap pants. Too many repetitive moves, false emotions and absolutely no idea and/or character in the prog. What exactly did he interprete to get that score?

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Eww, I missed this earlier. Do you understand what the concept of having an abstract style is? Either way, fake emotions? That would be Takeshi Honda's program here, not Buttle's.

Blades of Passion said:

Either way, fake emotions? That would be Takeshi Honda's program here, not Buttle's.

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I didn't feel "fake" when I was watching Takeshi in the arena. Pardon if youtube doesn't inspire you. Honda is not the super best artistic performer but definitely not more "fake" than Buttle.

Takeshi half-heartedly grabbed his face twice during that Tosca performance. Such cliche choreography and, yes, fake emotion. That quality ran through most of the performance, with movements being performed seemingly because he had to do it and not because he felt it. Buttle's performance was definitely the opposite of that; it was raw and real and open. I think you did not connect with the music and/or concept, thus your unfairly dismissive assessment.

Blades of Passion said:

with movements being performed seemingly because he had to do it and not because he felt it.

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How can you know what he felt? Honda presents a more masculine and powerful style. It might be not your cup of tea, that's fine. In any case as I said already Takeshi is not the best performer on the ice. He is more reserved and cool. But I trust this honestly way more than some cheesy fake emotions that I have to see in all progroms of Buttle over and over again. I have seen him a lot live in Japan and I don't even remember any of his show progs as some feature ones because they are all the same. At MWO he showed it again.

let`s talk said:

Honda presents a more masculine and powerful style.

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Which has nothing to do with anything. Those are simply adjectives and there are hundreds of others that define excellence. I find your definition of "masculine" to be a bit ignorant as well. It seems the word you were searching for was "stoic", which that is an extremely outdated definer of masculinity. I wouldn't really call his performance more powerful either, with his slow speed and lack of difficult edgework. Just because he did a shaky Triple Axel his performance was more powerful than everything else Buttle did on the ice?

Blades of Passion said:

I find your definition of "masculine" to be a bit ignorant as well.

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I see it's some kind of fashion to argue the poster and not the argument. So, when someone says things you disagree with, you just say the person is this and that and you are the one who knows better than anyone else what "masculine" stands for. No need to be so defensive. It looks weak and speaks about poor debating skills. Don't tell me how stupid I am and how smart you are. Give me your reasons. Because without the reasons your statement has no accountability.

Just because he did a shaky Triple Axel his performance was more powerful than everything else Buttle did on the ice?

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Then why Buttle didn't even try to do some shaky Tripe Axel if it was not such a big deal? Because he can't?

Hmm, you ignored everything I said. Your praise of "masculine" doesn't at all speak to how someone should score. That is the point. As for Buttle not trying a Triple Axel, he did a beautiful Triple Lutz, a good 3Toe-3Toe combo, and a good 2Axel. Honda had a 3Flip-2Toe combo, a non-clean Triple Axel, and a solo Double Toeloop. Honda's jump content was in fact lesser than Buttle's, but you seem to be blinded by him simply attempting the 3Axel.

Blades of Passion said:

Your praise of "masculine" doesn't at all speak to how someone should score. That is the point.

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No, there is none. The only "point" you keep saying is how smart you are and how ignorant I am. And give no reasons. I don't know what meaning is implied in the word "masculine" in your post, I used it in the definitiion given in the dictionary, as having qualities traditionally ascribed to men, as strength and boldness. Yes, Honda's skating can be described as that, though he lacks the expression as I said already. Since masculinity is about possessing certain qualities and characteristics, so like any other feature it reflects in style, therefore in presentation and interpretation, i.e. a program components score. A few eligible skaters are still considered as representatives of this dying style on ice: Plu, Joubert. In pro- Kulik, Yag, Honda.

he did a beautiful Triple Lutz, a good 3Toe-3Toe combo, and a good 2Axel.

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There are junior girls who can do the same stuff. If a non-clean Triple Axel is not a big deal, why didn't Buttle even try to jump it. Not that I wonder much.

I watched the MWO and it is just great to see a Pro competition back!!, let's hope it is the start of things to come, a great competition I felt, I will summarise.

Men's

jeff buttle a deserved winner,I will go with the judges there, technically sound and steps and sequences very good, good flow around the ice, and a good choreographic program to the "shirt"

Kurt browning, just have to say WOW, the best artistic program out on the ice, debating whether this should have been first, but the jumps were not there tonight, but the score should have been close to Jeff.

yagudin and Honda, one of those for me should have been third, preferably Honda, a nice program to tosca, yagudin displayed good footwork as we should expect by yagudin very close.

Kulik, nothing in between the skating for me and the program just did not click and gel like the others.

candeloro, I like the guy but I reckon he got a phone call at the last moment, a disaster for me, maybe he should have stayed at home but I know the Japanese love him and he did not want to let them down.

Ladies

Shizu, she looked lovely out there, I love the swan program but lacked speed and flow, but the jumps and spins and footwork worked in her favour. I would have had Shizu second.

Joannie for me was the best tonight, good program, nice concept, good flow and linking moves, technically sound. Excellent.

A lot of people might disagree with me, but I thought Laura's program to flamenco was pure class, every nuance of the music used and she played the part, yes the jumps let Laura down but artistically the best of the night and on this basis third for me ahead of irina. Good to see Laura back!!

Irina, her jumps were very good tonight, not sure on her program choice, did not connect with me, but a nice flow on the ice, debating for third, but fourth for me.

sarah, lovely choice of music enjoyed the program, choreographically very good, technique let her down, but I enjoy her skating so much, great spinner! Fifth for me.

Kimmie, like Laura good to see her back, program good but the program again for me did not gel, agree with the 6th place.