Jason Brown | Page 775 | Golden Skate

Jason Brown

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If anyone is interested in before 2009-10 ... Jason's USFS bio says:

2008-09 Season Notes
SP Music: "Money" by Pink Floyd
FS Music: Music from Russian cinema performed by the Moscow Symphony Orchestra

2007-08 Season Notes
FS Music: "Storm" by Vivaldi​

Jason was Novice in 2008-09, and Intermediate in 2007-08.


... EDIT:

I was digging around the thread looking for something else and I came across this. The last time these three were photographed together, and one of my all-time favourites.

:luv17:


I made an undignified squeaking panic sound. For the love of all things holy Jason, please don't break any bones.

:agree:

Coach Grant's reaction along the same lines (IMO): https://twitter.com/Grant_Hochstein/status/1246611929403142145 (Apr 4)
 

katmari

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I don't remember ever seeing Appassionata. Anybody else?

From what I can recall, Jason performed Appassionata just once at the Team Challenge Cup which was his first competition after the back injury:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qnme3TO_-oU&t=1s

The original intent was to keep it as his SP the following season. It was decided during Champs Camp that the music was too similar in style to his FS Scent of Love so Kori suggested Writings on the Wall as an alternative which Jason had just debuted as an exhibition program at Sun Valley.

Going back to the 2013-2014 season, it's interesting to watch the evolution of Riverdance as the choreography slightly changed over the course of the season. Here's Jason performing it at Glacier Falls:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KU8144f_01I
 

noskates

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Thanks Katmari. Watched the video and the music was a real snooze-fest. Somehow I can't imagine Rohene choreographing to Imppassionata. Glad they changed it.
 

Bookseller

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So I actually really liked Tristan as a program. I thought it was gorgeous, it gave him a character to play which he did very well, the choreography was nice, and he skated it pretty well.

It was just...that darned dollar-store costume. And I think that was where a lot of people tripped up on this program and why it doesn't get discussed often like a lot of his programs despite being the one he won the National title with. People just couldn't see past the costume to appreciate the program itself.

Once you compare it with the Worlds performance, look at the difference! The costume is so much better and suddenly you can focus on the beauty of his skating: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zTZUmOG1Mnc


EDIT:

I was digging around the thread looking for something else and I came across this. The last time these three were photographed together, and one of my all-time favourites.

I remember that photo! Jason was a big fan of the synchro teams and had fun at that comp.

I liked Tristan also, though didn't love the costume. The pants and boot covers weren't good. But even with the somewhat imprecise skate at 4CCs, Jason made me forget the costume and just watch him. Oh for those days of back loaded jumps!
 

Bookseller

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So I actually really liked Tristan as a program. I thought it was gorgeous, it gave him a character to play which he did very well, the choreography was nice, and he skated it pretty well.

It was just...that darned dollar-store costume. And I think that was where a lot of people tripped up on this program and why it doesn't get discussed often like a lot of his programs despite being the one he won the National title with. People just couldn't see past the costume to appreciate the program itself.

Once you compare it with the Worlds performance, look at the difference! The costume is so much better and suddenly you can focus on the beauty of his skating: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zTZUmOG1Mnc


EDIT:

I was digging around the thread looking for something else and I came across this. The last time these three were photographed together, and one of my all-time favourites.
I remember that skate well. It was really beautiful despite the jump issues. The costume was so much better! The tech score was low, but PCs were high. I remember feeling really happy that Jason moved up to 4th place. That was his first World's. Not bad! The next year he was injured and couldn't skate. 2017 he came in 7th to Nathan's 6th and they won back that 3rd spot. And 2018 he declined. So this is a high point! I've also noticed that the squeezed eyes and peering at the score started after 2014 Nats. It will be interesting to look at the 2014 FS K&C at the Olympics. He clearly developed some lack of confidence during that period.
 

el henry

Go have some cake. And come back with jollity.
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I feel like I've talked about the beetle yellow pants in T&I forever, although not recently, so I'm veering in another direction.

I have not seen Appassionata since I don't know, when Jason last skated it. Violins, sigh. I know, figure skating, violins, get used to it :)

But I can't help comparing this to Schindler's List, slow, violins, dramatic. Now obviously that's an unfair comparison, but there it is. And even though Jason was smooth and seamless transitions and I'm loving some of the backward short spiral move, just not enough oomph. Champ's Camp in this case was right.

And the patchwork colors on the costume. I'm not sure they melded, but I like the idea. :biggrin:
 

karne

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It should be remembered that Apassionata was a stopgap. Jason's original SP that season was a Great Gatsby theme, but it was very twisty and jerky in choreo (because it was very jazzy) and that was the year Jason messed up his back. So he couldn't handle the original SP, and Apassionata was designed to put as little strain on his back as possible. IIRC, the costume was also actually one of Rohene's, re-tailored to fit Jason.

And since we talked about Tristan and Iseult, then we may as well bring in his darned SP from that season as well...Juke.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LeVixnx5D5E

I have spoken long and repeatedly about how much I hated this SP for him and how I felt it compared unfavourably to his Junior programs, so I shall not repeat myself again.
 

noskates

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Hmmm - I guess I never read your objections to Juke. I think it was the first program that I can remember where Jason's personality and dance ability kind of came out. Also I had never heard the story of Jason using Rohene's costume - too funny. I thought Rohene was taller than he actually is so I guess it was possible. Wiki says he's only 5'7" (must be those long legs) and I think Jason is 5'8". When I've been the fortunate recipient of a Jason hug I wasn't thinking much about how tall he is :drama:

This thought has been recurring in my old mind......see if anyone feels the same. Jason went through some "interesting" challenges with music and costumes over the years until he found his way to Toronto. I think part of it was Kori wasn't a mainstream figure skating coach and therefore maybe wasn't as "in the know" as she might have been. Rohene has a very clear style and mojo (for lack of a better word!) Jason was pretty much a blank canvas and they bounced all over the place with him. I don't think Rohene does a stellar job of choreographing classical music and Jason's costumes showed an extreme lack of taste on someone's part. For a junior skater that was probably okay. But for a burgeoning elite skater...,,.,not so much. Anyway - just my thoughts.

p.s. Karne, thanks for the explanation about Appassionata. I literally did not remember it at all.
 

Bookseller

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It should be remembered that Apassionata was a stopgap. Jason's original SP that season was a Great Gatsby theme, but it was very twisty and jerky in choreo (because it was very jazzy) and that was the year Jason messed up his back. So he couldn't handle the original SP, and Apassionata was designed to put as little strain on his back as possible. IIRC, the costume was also actually one of Rohene's, re-tailored to fit Jason.

And since we talked about Tristan and Iseult, then we may as well bring in his darned SP from that season as well...Juke.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LeVixnx5D5E

I have spoken long and repeatedly about how much I hated this SP for him and how I felt it compared unfavourably to his Junior programs, so I shall not repeat myself again.

I had totally forgotten about Gatsby, and that they dropped it because of the strain on his back. That was a tough year for Jason! Expectations were so high after Riverdance and then all the changes of programs, the back issues, costume issues etc. No wonder he developed those mannerisms in the K&C. His confidence was shaky and his sense of what was expected was hard to manage. I still want to look back at 2013/14 and watch his progress, but the 2014/15 season was pivotal in the development of Jason's competitive career. While he had the high of National Champion and coming in a respectable 4th at World's, the cracks in the management decisions on the part of his coaching team are really starting to show. It explains a lot!
 

Bookseller

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Hmmm - I guess I never read your objections to Juke. I think it was the first program that I can remember where Jason's personality and dance ability kind of came out. Also I had never heard the story of Jason using Rohene's costume - too funny. I thought Rohene was taller than he actually is so I guess it was possible. Wiki says he's only 5'7" (must be those long legs) and I think Jason is 5'8". When I've been the fortunate recipient of a Jason hug I wasn't thinking much about how tall he is :drama:

This thought has been recurring in my old mind......see if anyone feels the same. Jason went through some "interesting" challenges with music and costumes over the years until he found his way to Toronto. I think part of it was Kori wasn't a mainstream figure skating coach and therefore maybe wasn't as "in the know" as she might have been. Rohene has a very clear style and mojo (for lack of a better word!) Jason was pretty much a blank canvas and they bounced all over the place with him. I don't think Rohene does a stellar job of choreographing classical music and Jason's costumes showed an extreme lack of taste on someone's part. For a junior skater that was probably okay. But for a burgeoning elite skater...,,.,not so much. Anyway - just my thoughts.

p.s. Karne, thanks for the explanation about Appassionata. I literally did not remember it at all.

I have liked Ro's choreo for Jason, but not always the music choices. I do remember being sort of relieved after the 14/15 season that there would be new programs. It was a roller coaster year. I was not a fan of Juke, but don't remember hating it. I haven't seen it for a long time. I didn't care for Gatsby. I felt like Jason was chasing it. Tristan was fine, other than the costumer issues. But I loved The Piano, Scent of Love and especially Writing on the Wall. Hamilton got better as the season progressed, but Inner Love never jelled. I wanted to love it. I tried to love it. I didn't love it and neither did Jason. But he tried really hard. Kori made a remark after Jason had so much success with Riverdance, that she felt that it didn't highlight what was best about Jason's skating. I remember feeling sort of shocked by this, because I had never seen any of his junior programs. Ro and Jason both said they wanted to do something dramatic for 14/15. I think that there was a fundamental divide between Ro's vision for Jason and Kori's vision for Jason and he was sort of caught between the two. Ro's short programs since the coaching change have been good. David's long programs were a mixed bag, but Schindler has been really good for Jason. But maybe it's time to go back to what made Riverdance so special and iconic for Jason and incorporate more of that into his competition programs now.
 

noskates

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Nice thoughts Book. Hadn't heard that comment of Kori's but that really tells me that in some ways she didn't have a clue. Riverdance was, and always will be, an iconic program for Jason. He told a story, he skated a story, and he was living it. And it made his mark in the senior ranks. I think Simon & Garfunkel was a major misfire and most likely because David Wilson was "learning" Jason. And possibly, Jason wasn't at the top of his list that first year. I just always consider that a transition year where Jason was adjusting to new technique, Brian was still on the fence about taking him on (and consumed with Yuzu and Javi), Tracy clearly saw the possibilities, and David threw a program together for him. I also think - but have no facts to back it up, that maybe now Jason has the encouragement to get involved in his music and his career. Mommy Kore wasn't driving the car anymore. Please do not take this as a slam against her. I think she was an excellent coach for beginners with her nurturing attitude and family-like style. But once Jason climbed to that rare air of elitism, she was out of her comfort zone and therefore his comfort zone was floundering.
 

Bookseller

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Nice thoughts Book. Hadn't heard that comment of Kori's but that really tells me that in some ways she didn't have a clue. Riverdance was, and always will be, an iconic program for Jason. He told a story, he skated a story, and he was living it. And it made his mark in the senior ranks. I think Simon & Garfunkel was a major misfire and most likely because David Wilson was "learning" Jason. And possibly, Jason wasn't at the top of his list that first year. I just always consider that a transition year where Jason was adjusting to new technique, Brian was still on the fence about taking him on (and consumed with Yuzu and Javi), Tracy clearly saw the possibilities, and David threw a program together for him. I also think - but have no facts to back it up, that maybe now Jason has the encouragement to get involved in his music and his career. Mommy Kore wasn't driving the car anymore. Please do not take this as a slam against her. I think she was an excellent coach for beginners with her nurturing attitude and family-like style. But once Jason climbed to that rare air of elitism, she was out of her comfort zone and therefore his comfort zone was floundering.

Agreed! Kori was over her head at that point. When Jason moved from Colorado to TCC, after making the coaching change decision and spending the spring coach hunting, he was not yet recovered from the Olympics disappointment, the trauma of leaving his coach of nearly 20 years and he was basically still depressed. He moved to another country, a new training environment with incredible competition, and all new skills to learn. He was sad, hopeful and probably lonely. Along comes Zhenya feeling pretty much the same way and they bonded and supported each other. But I think what the coaches responded to in suggesting S&G was literal. He left behind his old friends and was trying to look forward to a new spring, a new life and a new competitive career, but with pulls in both directions. That's what those songs were about. They knew that he wasn't going to be at the top of his game and they wanted to give him something to latch on to while he transitioned. Jason would never have selected it, because feeling sad and lost was really new to him. So I think they chose that piece to allow him to work out his emotional issues and make the transition in a calm and measured way. Working with Ro on Love is a B***h was the familiar, working on S&G was the unfamiliar. It helped to draw that pensive emotion out and let him work it out on the ice. And it allowed the new coaches to get to know him by filling in the blank slate of the program. The 19 year old who skated Riverdance went through a lot after that, and he needed time to regain his exuberance and joy. And it's coming! The silly instagram with Jason jumping on his skates that he just posted is a Jason who is happier with himself and his life, because they gave him time to achieve that. But those programs in between Riverdance and S&G were all over the place, and not all of them showed the best of Jason. We didn't know who he was anymore and he didn't either.

If I had to choose a coach to take my child to, I would choose Kori in a heartbeat. She did get Jason to the Olympics. But once he was there, there was no collective experience to get him through the high pressure situation and then through the years of expectation and disappointment. Jason outgrew his coach, but stayed with her. That's partly Kori's fault, and partly Jason's. Hard decisions have to be made in competitive sport. But on the whole, I think he gained a lot by having to struggle through the hard years and now he can focus on doing what he loves the best possible way that he can and as Tracy said, "be in control of his own destiny." S&G took Jason out of his comfort zone and forced him to open up to other possibilities. It accomplished it's purpose.
 

noskates

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Very good summation. Never thought of S&G that way.

The one piece both of us left out was Jason's parents. Such a close family and Kori and her family - from my perspective - were part of that family. I've always thought that Mr and Mrs Brown were very aware of their son's talents but wanted him to grow up as normal as possible under the circumstances. Staying with Kori had to have been part of their decision as well. I always mention I raised a rugby player. That involved bandages and stitches, trips to the orthopedist, a few concussions, travel, and a lot of fun. I can't even imagine what a parent goes through with an elite figure skater. All those dollars and hours of practice and personal sacrifice that culminates in a do or die situation that takes place in minutes.
 

Ruthypegs

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It should be remembered that Apassionata was a stopgap. Jason's original SP that season was a Great Gatsby theme, but it was very twisty and jerky in choreo (because it was very jazzy) and that was the year Jason messed up his back. So he couldn't handle the original SP, and Apassionata was designed to put as little strain on his back as possible. IIRC, the costume was also actually one of Rohene's, re-tailored to fit Jason.

And since we talked about Tristan and Iseult, then we may as well bring in his darned SP from that season as well...Juke.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LeVixnx5D5E

I have spoken long and repeatedly about how much I hated this SP for him and how I felt it compared unfavourably to his Junior programs, so I shall not repeat myself again.

I'm with you on this - the program does Jason no favours at all - so cheesy, and awful flaccid music. What a shame - when there was so much other music out there to showcase Jason's amazing skating and performce skills.
 

Bookseller

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Very good summation. Never thought of S&G that way.

The one piece both of us left out was Jason's parents. Such a close family and Kori and her family - from my perspective - were part of that family. I've always thought that Mr and Mrs Brown were very aware of their son's talents but wanted him to grow up as normal as possible under the circumstances. Staying with Kori had to have been part of their decision as well. I always mention I raised a rugby player. That involved bandages and stitches, trips to the orthopedist, a few concussions, travel, and a lot of fun. I can't even imagine what a parent goes through with an elite figure skater. All those dollars and hours of practice and personal sacrifice that culminates in a do or die situation that takes place in minutes.

Kori talked a little about that also in an interview. Jason had been taking lessons before school twice a week until he was about 8. Then Kori suggested that he should take 3 lessons a week. Jason's dad fielded this one and questioned Kori about how important this was. She described him as saying "it's not like he's going to the Olympics or anything like that, is he?" And she said "Well, I can't guarantee that, but I would say that we could be talking about that." Steve was kind of stunned, but they talked it over and agreed. I believe that the suggestion to switch Jason to a higher level coach was made when he was about 10 or 11. The Browns decided that he was really happy with Kori and school and all the things in his life and they didn't want to rock the boat. So they decided against any changes at that point. And it was clearly the right decision. They always look toward Jason's life after skating, knowing full well that so many skaters have a really difficult adjustment. The time for change came later and by then Jason was pretty much an adult. He said that he knew that he wanted to move on, but didn't want to make the change during the run up to the Olympics. But he had decided that the change was needed. I don't think leaving Kori was the most difficult part of his decision after the failure to make the team. I think that telling Kori was a really difficult thing that he had to do. That and deciding whether he should continue to skate. But Jason knew before 2018 Nationals, maybe even before the season began, that he needed a coaching change. He talked openly about that in the period after Nationals and 4CCs in 2018/19. But he didn't talk about it until he told Kori he was leaving her. At that point, it was his decision. He was an adult. Look how long it took Shoma to make that decision. His coach had to kick him out of the nest. It's hard to make changes. I think that the Browns absolutely made the right decision when he was 10 or so to leave him where he was. Even the decision to move to Colorado was the right one at the time. After the Olympics probably was the time to make the change, but they didn't. Whether Jason's parents were involved in that, or whether it was Jason's choice is hard to know. He had done so well, it may not have seemed necessary at the time.
 

Bookseller

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I had totally forgotten about Gatsby, and that they dropped it because of the strain on his back. That was a tough year for Jason! Expectations were so high after Riverdance and then all the changes of programs, the back issues, costume issues etc. No wonder he developed those mannerisms in the K&C. His confidence was shaky and his sense of what was expected was hard to manage. I still want to look back at 2013/14 and watch his progress, but the 2014/15 season was pivotal in the development of Jason's competitive career. While he had the high of National Champion and coming in a respectable 4th at World's, the cracks in the management decisions on the part of his coaching team are really starting to show. It explains a lot!

I didn't and don't hate this. He skated it well and it did suit his personality. It's not the best SP he's ever done, but it was ok. And that SP score was good! Jumps looked good. It was meant to be an upbeat counterpoint to the drama of Tristan once you get past the pants. After we get through 2013/14 and Riverdance, it will be good to look at all his comps in 2014/15 and compare.
 

el henry

Go have some cake. And come back with jollity.
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No time for a great deal of detail now, but I will always jump into this fray.:laugh:

Juke was great.
A fine example of 40s and 50s African-American jazz and blues inspired music and dance moves, incorporated into skating.
Suspenderology works great in that circumstance. (a little less sparkly, maybe)
Jason slayed it and I rewatch the Nats performance often.

That is all:biggrin:
 

karne

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Very well, since noskates has not yet heard my brutal appraisal of Juke:

I found it juvenile. His Hey Pachuco! short program from his Junior years was so much better! The music of Juke was predominantly flat and one-note, repetitive in its refrains, and over the speakers of a rink just sounded like braying. Jason performed the choreography well of course, because he is Jason, that's what he does. But I find it beneath the dignity of the Senior National Champion to be doing the sprinkler in his SP; the costuming was ridiculous with all those stones and only served to make it look even more juvenile.

If Kori and Rohene were still intent on making Jason look "more mature", then in 2014-2015 they failed spectacularly.


I guess our next stop on the program chain is Gatsby and the first rendition of The Scent of Love.
 

noskates

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Whew - that was brutal. :palmf: I didn't think it was all that bad. But to each his own.

I've looked everywhere and can't find a video of Great Gatsby. Saw a Rohene instagram where he showed about 20 seconds of it and kind of announced it as the SP but it wasn't even long enough to identify the music. Anyone?
 

Bookseller

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Can anyone find any videos of pre Nats 2014 of Jason's programs before we go on to the following year? What comps did he do before Nats?
 
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