Random Figure Skating Questions | Page 175 | Golden Skate

Random Figure Skating Questions

freeman21

On the Ice
Joined
May 17, 2017
Thanks a lot for the answers

2)With the 4th day being about 9 hours, I'm assuming that is for 2 separate events(?).
If so, I'd think that you'll need a ticket for each event. You'll have to vacate the arena once the first event is complete as someone else may have your seat for the next event.

You may be right, but I'm still not sure. When I got the ticket, that was the only one available for that day. Here's a screenshot of it. Maybe someone who actually understands Russian can clarify this.

A rough google translation reads "AN ARBITRARY PROGRAM" on it and there are 2 free programs that day (Ladies and Dance), so maybe it actually is for a single event (either Ladies or Dance).
 

sarama

Medalist
Joined
Apr 23, 2014
Never attended a figure skating event, planing to go to the European Championships next week, so here come some probably stupid questions:

1) How early do you have to arrive at the skating rink before the competition actually starts? Whenever I'm attending a football game, I usually arrive at the stadium 30-40 mins earlier. No idea what's "normal" in figure skating.

2) If a certain competition day is longer (for example the 4th day of the Europeans scheduled from 13:40 to about 22:00) is it ok to leave and return to the arena several times? Or do you lose the right to re-enter the arena once you're in?

My 2cents: You can basically do as you please, there really is no rule and nobody expects you to stay there the whole event or to attend from the start or to arrive early. The only thing is ALWAYS be respectful of the people watching and beware that they might not let you in only between programs or between warm-up groups. Even if they let you in between two programs, I usually wait for the group to change just to annoy people less. You can usually watch standing on the stairs anyway while you wait. Due to the many breaks a figure skating competition leaves you way more freedom than a football match
 

Frenchie

I'm gonna customize the CRAP out of this title!
Medalist
Joined
May 4, 2013
Thank you for those 2 links, I'll definitely save them for the future!! :)

Correct me if I'm wrong: no matter how many awesome "+ features" you have for an element, it can never go beyond +3 before you start deducting for "- features", right?
I mean: If you do an awesome element with so many great features that it could, in theory, get you a +4, but then you also have a mistake on it with a mandatory "-2" GOE, then according to the rules, you're not allowed to get a +2 or +3, right?
So, just as an example: Stolbova/Klimov, in tonight's Euros FS, did a 3T3T for her, and 3T2T for him. According to the "GOE Guidelines",
"PAIR SKATING: REDUCTIONS FOR ERRORS: Unequal number of revolutions by partners: -2"
So, how come 3 judges gave them a GOE of +2 for this element? (Judges Scores pdf)
I was really pumped to see Ksenia do an amazing 3T3T, and I'd have loved to give her a big bonus for that, but... there still are rules, aren't there?
 

gkelly

Record Breaker
Joined
Jul 26, 2003
Thank you for those 2 links, I'll definitely save them for the future!! :)

Correct me if I'm wrong: no matter how many awesome "+ features" you have for an element, it can never go beyond +3 before you start deducting for "- features", right?

Yes, that's correct.
Except that the word "features" has a specific meaning referring to the extra difficulty that the technical panel awards to call levels on non-jump elements. So to avoid confusion it would be more accurate to refer to "[positive GOE] bullet points" when referring to the qualitiy assessments and other enhancements that the judges use to award positive GOE.

I mean: If you do an awesome element with so many great features that it could, in theory, get you a +4, but then you also have a mistake on it with a mandatory "-2" GOE, then according to the rules, you're not allowed to get a +2 or +3, right?

Right.

So, just as an example: Stolbova/Klimov, in tonight's Euros FS, did a 3T3T for her, and 3T2T for him. According to the "GOE Guidelines",
"PAIR SKATING: REDUCTIONS FOR ERRORS: Unequal number of revolutions by partners: -2"
So, how come 3 judges gave them a GOE of +2 for this element? (Judges Scores pdf)
I was really pumped to see Ksenia do an amazing 3T3T, and I'd have loved to give her a big bonus for that, but... there still are rules, aren't there?

That would be a mistake by those judges. However, it's easy to understand how it would happen.

During the program, from the angle they were watching, a judge didn't see the difference in number of revolutions in real time -- they just saw a good element with 4-5 positive bullet points. So they award the +2 and don't make any note to rewatch video after the performance.

(If one partner is directly between the judge and the other partner, that could block their view of some details of what the further partner does. Or if the two skaters are far apart, especially if one is to the left of the judge's line of sight and the other to the right, it can be difficult to keep both partners in view at the same time. That's why the technical panel has one person watch the man and one person watch the lady. But each judge only has one set of eyes to use in real time. Being far apart would be a negative in terms of GOE, so it wouldn't apply in this case, but it could explain why a judge doesn't see both partners clearly in real time.)

After the program the technical panel will review all elements for which there is the slightest question, sometimes more than once if the first rewatch doesn't answer their question satisfactorily.

Meanwhile the judges confirm their scores for the elements and enter their program component scores. I understand that they can rewatch elements they had questions about, but I'm not sure of the mechanics of how they do so and they're not required to.

They should check the technical panel calls on their screen and adjust their GOEs if the calls reflect a need to do so, e.g., if there's a < or or << or e call on a jump.

There's no symbol on the screen for "unequal number of revolutions" -- the tech panel just calls the lower number of revolutions.

In this case the call from the tech panel was 3T+2T in real time, so there was no need for the tech panel to review the element.

The judge might have
*believed in real time that both skaters did 3T+2T
*believed in real time that both skaters did 3T+3T and not noticed that the tech panel called something different
*thought in real time that both did 3T+3T, then noticed the 3T+2T on the screen and thought "Oh, that was only a double? It looked triple to me. Anyway, the unison and xx, xx, and xx all looked great to me. Great triple-double."

The only way to make sure that judges are aware that the two skaters did different numbers of revolutions would be for the tech panel to add a code symbol of some sort (e.g., ≠) to the call. The base value would be the same whether both skaters do double or one does triple and the other double, so the code wouldn't affect the base value. It would just be an alert to the judges that they're supposed to subtract -2 from whatever GOE they would give otherwise.
 

Frenchie

I'm gonna customize the CRAP out of this title!
Medalist
Joined
May 4, 2013
gkelly, thanks for your very precise and well worded explanation! :thumbsup:
:bow::bow::bow:
 

LiamForeman

William/Uilyam
Medalist
Joined
Nov 24, 2006
Costuming question?

I was just wondering if there is a rule against wearing a costume that flares out at the skate like a bell bottom so it pretty much disguises a person's blade? Med is not getting the E on her flutz because she 'cleverly' disguised it by positioning the jump in such a way that judges cannot be sure on which edge she's taking off. So why not wear a costume that can REALLY disguise her edge like I described? It could also be helpful for URs too.
 

VegMom

On the Ice
Joined
Aug 25, 2017
I think that would actually be dangerous. Toe picks can easily get caught in loose pants and cause the skater to fall.
 

millie

Medalist
Joined
Nov 1, 2004
I was just wondering if there is a rule against wearing a costume that flares out at the skate like a bell bottom so it pretty much disguises a person's blade? Med is not getting the E on her flutz because she 'cleverly' disguised it by positioning the jump in such a way that judges cannot be sure on which edge she's taking off. So why not wear a costume that can REALLY disguise her edge like I described? It could also be helpful for URs too.









Isn't this another way of cheating the system?
 

Ic3Rabbit

Former Elite, now Pro. ⛸️
Record Breaker
Joined
Jan 9, 2017
Country
Olympics
Flared out and/or loose bottoms were against the rules last time I checked bc of safety reasons.
 

freeman21

On the Ice
Joined
May 17, 2017
Do popular/good skaters skip Worlds during an Olympic year?

Like this year, do you think skaters like Osmond, Medvedeva, Yuzuru, etc would skip the World Championships in Milano?
 

gkelly

Record Breaker
Joined
Jul 26, 2003
Do popular/good skaters skip Worlds during an Olympic year?

Yes, sometimes.

Like this year, do you think skaters like Osmond, Medvedeva, Yuzuru, etc would skip the World Championships in Milano?

For each individual, it will probably depend on how they do at the Olympics -- are they suddenly getting lots of offers that interfere with training full time and that offer income or other benefits? did they have a disappointing Olympics and feel they have unfinished business they want to accomplish at Worlds? -- and also the status of any injuries, etc.
 

somelikeitpink

On the Ice
Joined
Mar 21, 2017
Can anyone here maybe give me a quick rundown on the actual difference between a normal blade and the parabolic ones?

I'm considering different blades and I mean I get the quite obvious difference and a few of the advantages of the revolution ones over the regular ones.
But in terms of the actual blade, I'm not quite sure what the difference/advantage of normal vs. parabolic is?
 

Ic3Rabbit

Former Elite, now Pro. ⛸️
Record Breaker
Joined
Jan 9, 2017
Country
Olympics
Can anyone here maybe give me a quick rundown on the actual difference between a normal blade and the parabolic ones?

I'm considering different blades and I mean I get the quite obvious difference and a few of the advantages of the revolution ones over the regular ones.
But in terms of the actual blade, I'm not quite sure what the difference/advantage of normal vs. parabolic is?

They use carbon fiber tech to make the blades lighter and more streamlined. The midline of the blade is tapered which cuts down on drag and also allows for more precise movement.

Weight is centered better on them as well and it allows for better sharper movement, edge quality and centered, smoother, faster spins.

They are also easier to sharpen and require less sharpening.


The only downside I found to my old Pattern 99 revs was that I hated doing catch foot spins in them. Hence my switch back to traditional P99’s which are less awkward in that manner. Plus, I’d skated on traditional blades for a very long time before trying the new technology. I wanted my comfortable blades! :laugh:
 

rmsxvi

Rinkside
Joined
Jan 30, 2018
Can anyone recommend good skates for beginners like me that are cheap and good quality? Also, just curious, but what are the skates Nathan Chen used in his 2018 US National Championship FS?
 

Mussique

On the Ice
Joined
Aug 30, 2017
Hello again :hap10:
Sadly this a sport where "cheap" and "good quality" coincide very little, if ever... At least when it comes to your skates. But if you plan to skate for a bit (say, at least one or two years) it's worth it to invest in good skates. They'll last you, but, more importantly, they'll keep your ankles safe. And it will be much easier to learn moves in them.

A bit of personal experience here on "why should you get the expensive ones": I didn't. I bought the cheap ones. A month later I had to buy me new ones because I wanted to start jumping :laugh: So that's 70€ I lost!

—My own boots (Risport Antares, and I'm very very happy with them) are second hand so they turned to be as cheap as the first ones. But this is a risk. Mine were almost new (I have very small feet so I can get boots that children have used and then didn't like the sport or quit or grew too quickly), and so I was actually the one to break them down. But that's rare... Usually it won't be the same as having your own boots. They will be adapted to someone's foot. It could be an option, of course, and even more to just try the sport but be very careful.

—If you don't plan to learn "figure skating" per se, if you want to skate only recreationally doing laps around the rink and make friends (and this is an option as well) you can do with whatever skates you choose, even the cheap ones o hockey ones. You can get those from 50-70€ easily, blade included.
—If you want to learn a bit, start tentatively jumping and spins, maybe take a class or two, learn-to-skate in general, then get a boot rated for singles, they'll last you and won't be too stiff. A boot rated for half-jumps will work as well and won't be as expensive but you'll have to change it sooner (but it could be an option as well if your ice time and budget is limited). This would be around 150-200€. You should also buy hard and soft guards to keep your blades safe.

—Have you got the option to go to a skate shop in your area? If they could measure your feet it'd be very useful. Each brand has its adventage for different types of foot... Some people are more comfortable with Jackson, some prefer Edeas, etc.
https://www.kinziescloset.com/skate-comparison-guide.html
That link above is just for reference. I would ignore what it says about "skill level" (if you get Risport Venus, don't worry, you don't need to change them when you learn crossovers :laugh:), but it's still useful. Any skate under the second or third group could work for you, probably.
—Measure your feet properly. It's better if you can go to a skate pro shop, but if that's impossible for you get someone to help you and follow the different guidelines for each brand.
—Try them on first!

Good luck —and don't hesitate to ask if you have more questions!
(Skipping the Nathan question because I don't know :scratch2:)
 

rmsxvi

Rinkside
Joined
Jan 30, 2018
Thank you very much for the information! I'll keep these in mind. Sadly, there arent much ice skating shops here where i live so selection is really minimal, im planning on ordering online but i have no idea which brand is good and where to order.
 

Ic3Rabbit

Former Elite, now Pro. ⛸️
Record Breaker
Joined
Jan 9, 2017
Country
Olympics
Can anyone recommend good skates for beginners like me that are cheap and good quality? Also, just curious, but what are the skates Nathan Chen used in his 2018 US National Championship FS?
Nathan wears Jackson boots with John Wilson Gold Seal Revolution (in custom black color) blades.
 
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