Madison Chock & Evan Bates | Page 8 | Golden Skate

Madison Chock & Evan Bates

tulosai

Record Breaker
Joined
Dec 21, 2011
It was barely noticeable. She just lightly touched him and calmly did the last twizzle. Maybe there other issues that they'd like to keep under wraps. But knowing them, they will regroup.

On my stream I thought it was very noticeable- not actually the touch of him but how she was whirling frantically and off center toward him before it, in fact tilting sideways. I actually did think she was going to go down. It is possible the judge's angle was different than the camera angle I was watching from, but many +2 for twizzles where a skater visibly did not have control during one set is baffling to me.
 

dorispulaski

Wicked Yankee Girl
Joined
Jul 26, 2003
Country
United-States
I liked the Nebelhorn FD better. But they have got to have had a crazy couple of weeks, both getting a new SD and redoing some of the FD. I do wonder whether Evan was ill, too.
 

bramweld

Record Breaker
Joined
Nov 12, 2012
I liked the Nebelhorn FD better. But they have got to have had a crazy couple of weeks, both getting a new SD and redoing some of the FD. I do wonder whether Evan was ill, too.

Did they actually make changes to the FD? Or is it that this performance was more low key. I can't quite figure it out.
 

Snow63

Pray one day we'll open our eyes.
Record Breaker
Joined
Mar 26, 2014
On my stream I thought it was very noticeable- not actually the touch of him but how she was whirling frantically and off center toward him before it, in fact tilting sideways. I actually did think she was going to go down. It is possible the judge's angle was different than the camera angle I was watching from, but many +2 for twizzles where a skater visibly did not have control during one set is baffling to me.

She even touched him if I remember correctly. I can't watch videos at work, so maybe I'm wrong. But even if they didn't touch, the +2 GOE seems too generous.
One of the requirements to have +2 GOE twizzles is 'consistent and close spacing between partners'. Besides, if execution of twizzles is not simultaneous for one set, GOE mark should be reduced by 1 grade.

HOWEVER, this rule doesn't work here. IF a couple performs a third Twizzle as Additional Feature, and there is a mistake by one or both partners in performing these third Twizzles, the Judges will consider this mistake as a poor exit and not as a mistake on one of the required Twizzles. While establishing their GOE, they should lower the characteristics “entry/exit” like for any other type of poor exit.

If the third set is considered as exit feature the best description of her mistake would be 'hesitant/lacks control' on the exit from the element (which means -2 GOE for one of the characteristics of the element). The other characteristics are 'Connecting steps/footwork' and 'Spacing between partners' (for the first two required sets ONLY!). So, in thess characteristics their twizzles deserve +2 GOE mark for each ('very good and stylish connecting steps' and 'consisting and close spacing between partners'). So, by averaging -2, +2 and +2 we get GOE for the twizzles we see in Protocols.

In my opinion, the GOE for what they performed in their FD should be 0/+1 (closer to +1). -1 GOE seems too harsh, and +2 is too generous. :shrug:
 
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mylifeback

On the Ice
Joined
May 27, 2014
Country
United-States
I liked the Nebelhorn FD better. But they have got to have had a crazy couple of weeks, both getting a new SD and redoing some of the FD. I do wonder whether Evan was ill, too.

I loved the Nebelhorn FD, this not as much. I'm puzzled why they eliminated the first move in the opening, I thought it was just lovely. Also, this new ending is bizarre as opposed to the ending I loved in Nebelhorn. I really hope they go back to the Nebelhorn opening and do something different with the new ending. I thought it ended a lovely FD on a down note.

Doris, in an interview afterward Evan said he'd had a cold which is one reason it had been such a trying 2-3 weeks since Nebelhorn. I didn't think he looked well, either. He definitely is sweatier than Madison (who inexplicably never sweats!), but it looked to me like the sweats when you're getting over something. I'm glad they pulled it off, though, and they'll be stronger for it.

Still can't stop watching the new SD, I absolutely love it, it is so elegant! And that EX is so hot, I didn't know they had it in them!
 

Astrid56

Final Flight
Joined
Oct 24, 2014
I loved the Nebelhorn FD, this not as much. I'm puzzled why they eliminated the first move in the opening, I thought it was just lovely. Also, this new ending is bizarre as opposed to the ending I loved in Nebelhorn. I really hope they go back to the Nebelhorn opening and do something different with the new ending. I thought it ended a lovely FD on a down note.

Doris, in an interview afterward Evan said he'd had a cold which is one reason it had been such a trying 2-3 weeks since Nebelhorn. I didn't think he looked well, either. He definitely is sweatier than Madison (who inexplicably never sweats!), but it looked to me like the sweats when you're getting over something. I'm glad they pulled it off, though, and they'll be stronger for it.

Still can't stop watching the new SD, I absolutely love it, it is so elegant! And that EX is so hot, I didn't know they had it in them!

I don't like the ending but if they are indeed following the sentiments that prompted the composition, then it makes sense. I am not going to discuss the 'whats' and 'whys' ... I have been blasted for expressing my opinion. However, I do wish they change the ending showing 'more triumphant'. I think the ending somehow deflates the overall 'look'. The performance is beautiful and it will be more enhanced if the ending supports it. Of course, if I were the dancer, I would have some parts more accentuated. The success of D/W's Scheherazade was due to the very elemental expressions of the supposed mindsets of the characters through movements. As it is - the last lift - was too pragmatic but lessened the entertainment/enjoyment value of the program.

I love, love their SD: it is their best SD so far the best SD in this season - it's coherent, cohesive and very entertaining.
 
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tvuckic16

Final Flight
Joined
Mar 29, 2014
It is possible they were just having an off day. It happens. It is possible they were so focused on the SD which they had to revamp that they didn't get to practice their FD as much. But, I wasn't thrilled by their performance at Nebelhorn either. I guess, I just liked their FD better last year, and this one is OK... it is just sufficient, but not exciting... at least to me. I think they have a bit of time to pull their acts together and polish their FD. I don't love their SD either, but it is good, and obviously scored very well, so maybe don't mess with that one...lol. It seems to me they are undergoing a creative crisis, which is never a good thing, look at BS, who had a creative crisis in an Olympic year... They just need to make a decision and get it together.
 

icekiwi

On the Ice
Joined
Jan 10, 2007
I don't like the ending but if they are indeed following the sentiments that prompted the composition, then it makes sense. I am not going to discuss the 'whats' and 'whys' ... I have been blasted for expressing my opinion. However, I do wish they change the ending showing 'more triumphant'. I think the ending somehow deflates the overall 'look'. The performance is beautiful and it will be more enhanced if the ending supports it. Of course, if I were the dancer, I would have some parts more accentuated. The success of D/W's Scheherazade was due to the very elemental expressions of the supposed mindsets of the characters through movements. As it is - the last lift - was too pragmatic but lessened the entertainment/enjoyment value of the program.

I love, love their SD: it is the best SD so far this season - it's coherent, cohesive and very entertaining.

Agree. Had been busy, so only just have the free time to visit this page to see how the thread is going for my favorite couple in ice dance.

My opinion:

SP = This Foxtrot suits them so divinely and they danced it to 'perfection'. Foxtrot has a 'flirtatious' and 'teasing' element to it and they both took on the character so well. You can tell it is not 'forced', they both seemed to act out the dance so naturally. I love the costumes as well. Evan, so smart and handsome in the tux and Maddison, not like she won't look good in anything but this 'ocean blue' colour just sparkles on her and very 'Foxtrot' indeed. This is a winning SP, both technically and choreographyically.

FD = I have watched this 3 times from 3 separate competitions now and each, over and over again a couple of times. To me, the 'Nebelhohn Trophy' outing is my favorite - my favorite parts are the beginning and the ending. Evan touched Maddie quite sensually at the beginning as the music is indeed 'romantic' and it builds on from there to a triumphant finish, the joyous ending with the lifts and then Maddie looking to Evan with arms open - a glorious ending and pose - Maddies' lovely soft flexible back.

However, I didn't like the chages made at Skate America. I do agree with others here that Evan didn't look well, sweating excessively and Maddie's movements have changed to be quite sharp and staccatoic. I was really concerned knowing how much I have liked it back at Nebelhohn. At Cup of China, I saw a bit more fluidity and less Staccato movements. Rachmaninov's music is very rich on its own, soft fluid movements which they did back at Nebelhohn so expresses the tone and style of Rachmaninov. The movements themselves should tell the story.

Conclusion, I hope they will go back to Antonio Najarro to enhance this program and up some technical elements (W/P and C/L are getting quite high on the technicals).

Others, feel free to comment.
 

dorispulaski

Wicked Yankee Girl
Joined
Jul 26, 2003
Country
United-States
I hope they will. Getting jerked around over their SD has to have made this a difficult fall season for them.
 

humbaba

Final Flight
Joined
Jan 12, 2004
Getting jerked around over their SD has to have made this a difficult fall season for them.

When I learned C/B had to get a new short dance, I was concerned for them because of their schedule. They were assigned to two of the earlier GPs, which must have magnified the disruption from redoing the SD. In the space of six weeks they had to set a new short dance and compete in both their Grand Prixs. Plus the second GP was in China, a notoriously difficult commute for North American skaters. In the week before, COC, they probably spent as much time traveling and adjusting to jet lag as they did training their programs.

Given the circumstances, I was relieved C/B made it through their GPs with a gold and silver and an almost certain berth in the GPF. They have a chance now to catch their breath and get in an extended stretch of training. I wish them all the best for the rest of the season.
 
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icekiwi

On the Ice
Joined
Jan 10, 2007
Agree with you 'humbaba'.

They have now earned their berth at the GPF despite the disruptions. Now, they can concentrate a bit more on the FD. The FD carries more points. Costume wise, to be honest, I prefer the one that Maddie wore at Nebelhohn, minus the pink brief. I prefer to let the dance and music speak for themselves. I am not keen on the extra sparkles on the dress, the one she wore at both SA and COC. I know there are others who like the extra sparkles.

Anyway, they do have a good team behind them. If they could come up with such a strong FD last year, costumes and all, they can do it again. All the best Maddie and Evan.
 

VIETgrlTerifa

Record Breaker
Joined
Jul 26, 2003
The more I watch their SD, the more I realize I really seriously enjoy it. Their connection has grown, and I really do think Evan is one of the best male ice dancers out there right now and Madison gives it her all. I want them, the Shibs, and Hubbell/Donahue to have excellent outings they can be proud of at the GPF leading into Nationals and 4CC. The audiences will be the winners if that happens.
 

Winnie_20

Record Breaker
Joined
Feb 24, 2013
I saw their FS practice today at the GPF. I wanted to give them that gold medal right there and then. So beautiful...
 

mylifeback

On the Ice
Joined
May 27, 2014
Country
United-States
I saw their FS practice today at the GPF. I wanted to give them that gold medal right there and then. So beautiful...

Could you tell what changes were made, especially to the diagonal step sequence or lift positions?
 
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