2015 Golden Spin of Zagreb Ice Dance | Page 5 | Golden Skate

2015 Golden Spin of Zagreb Ice Dance

caitie

Medalist
Joined
Sep 14, 2013
I think Hawayek and Baker skated pretty well in the SP. I'm surprised their scores weren't a bit higher. I looked at the protocols and didn't notice any big hits on levels, and so forth. They got 4 of the 6 RW keypoints. Judge #5 lowballed them in PCS, I think.

In addition to their high PCS, G/F got level 4 on both RW sections and Ys on all keypoints. Are they usually this strong on the pattern dance?

IKR! I actually thought they must have made a mistake and had some bad levels something when I saw the score, but this looks like their strongest outing of the SD so far to me, and their levels were their best since entering seniors. So I'm very surprised they didn't receive any of the Golden Spin inflation G/F got. Their PCS actually went down from CoC. Weird. :/
 

blancanieves

On the Ice
Joined
Mar 3, 2012
According to the detail results, Guinard and Fabberi earned 36 TES the Short Dance. That's the highest TES of the entire dance field by two points! :laugh: That's also compared to 29 TES at Rostelecom Cup and 30.40 at Skate Canada. Also 34.36 at Warsaw Cup, which was last week.

Also looking at the technical panel:

Technical Controller Ms. Michela CESARO ITA
Technical Specialist Mr. Tomas KIKA SVK
Assistant Technical Specialist Mr. Sergei BARANOV UKR

Yeah, no conflict at all here. :laugh:

2014 Golden Spin panel:
Technical Controller Mr. Walter Zuccaro ITA
Technical Specialist Mr. Tomas KIKA SVK
Assistant Technical Specialist Mr. Sergei BARANOV UKR

Add to that one Italian judge and no USA judge. Hubbell/Donohue won over Gurnard/Fabbri by the skin of their teeth, .28 points.
 

blancanieves

On the Ice
Joined
Mar 3, 2012
Doing the math . . .

Six teams in the GPF. (Most of these teams defeated G&F already. H&D being the possible question mark), P&C if they come back, Probably S&K (or whoever grabs Russia's second spot). Probably G&P. That would put G&F tenth. They may have a crack at H&D and G&P. (I wouldn't predict this in North America). Or, as we saw at CoR, a Russian team with an implosion.

H&D beat G&F at the 2015 Worlds by 2.72 points, without the benefit of making an appearance at 4CC. I think it's very likely that they'll continue to rank ahead of G&F this season. Not only are their scores growing from event to event, making the GPF is a big plus.
 

Snow63

Pray one day we'll open our eyes.
Record Breaker
Joined
Mar 26, 2014
I don't remember Hawayek/Baker receiving such low PCS last couple of seasons, even in Juniors :scratch2: Is there a video of their skate? Was it that bad?
 

caitie

Medalist
Joined
Sep 14, 2013
I don't remember Hawayek/Baker receiving such low PCS last couple of seasons, even in Juniors :scratch2: Is there a video of their skate? Was it that bad?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NXKxp8hlviI

I actually think it was pretty good?

H/B's TES was 27.02, 27.15, and 27.83 at their previous events. The tech panel here was generous (see G/F's perfect levels), so their base value alone was already 27. They got a 31.20 TES score.

But their PCS here was a 27.56. That's a three point drop from their PCS at Cup of China (30.52) and the lowest they've received all season. It's pretty weird to me, especially looking at the score sheet and seeing so many 6s when the lowest mark they received for PCS at CoC was 7.25. It probably wouldn't phase me as much if G/F's PCS wasn't so inflated from their GP showing. Weirdness.
 
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Snow63

Pray one day we'll open our eyes.
Record Breaker
Joined
Mar 26, 2014
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NXKxp8hlviI

I actually think it was pretty good?

H/B's TES was 27.02, 27.15, and 27.83 at their previous events. The tech panel here was generous (see G/F's perfect levels), so their base value alone was already 27. They got a 31.20 TES score.

But their PCS here was a 27.56. That's a three point drop from their PCS at Cup of China (30.52) and the lowest they've received all season. It's pretty weird to me, especially looking at the score sheet and seeing so many 6s when the lowest mark they received for PCS at CoC was 7.25. It probably wouldn't phase me as much if G/F's PCS wasn't so inflated from their GP showing. Weirdness.

US Fed decided to drop them after Hubbel/Donohue success? What's going on? I mean, 6s for components, really?
 

tulosai

Record Breaker
Joined
Dec 21, 2011
US Fed decided to drop them after Hubbel/Donohue success? What's going on? I mean, 6s for components, really?

I doubt the Fed has much to do with it. I don't know. I was disappointed that they'd made no changes to the program. Honestly it's clear international judges don't love it but this is indeed a step down...
 

dorispulaski

Wicked Yankee Girl
Joined
Jul 26, 2003
Country
United-States
According to the detail results, Guinard and Fabberi earned 36 TES the Short Dance. That's the highest TES of the entire dance field by two points! :laugh: That's also compared to 29 TES at Rostelecom Cup and 30.40 at Skate Canada. Also 34.36 at Warsaw Cup, which was last week.

Also looking at the technical panel:

Technical Controller Ms. Michela CESARO ITA
Technical Specialist Mr. Tomas KIKA SVK
Assistant Technical Specialist Mr. Sergei BARANOV UKR

Yeah, no conflict at all here. :laugh:

surprise, surprise, surprise. :laugh2:
 

YesWay

四年もかけて&#
Record Breaker
Joined
Sep 28, 2013
2014 Golden Spin panel:
Technical Controller Mr. Walter Zuccaro ITA
Technical Specialist Mr. Tomas KIKA SVK
Assistant Technical Specialist Mr. Sergei BARANOV UKR

Add to that one Italian judge and no USA judge. Hubbell/Donohue won over Gurnard/Fabbri by the skin of their teeth, .28 points.
Haven't looked at the protocols for this, or compared with their other competitions this season... but are their high tech scores due to:

- suspiciously high levels vs their other recent competitions (which are awarded by tech panel),
- or due to suspiciously high GoE vs their other recent competitions (which are not awarded by tech panel)?
- or both? Or what?

Just urging a little caution before jumping to conclusions about tech panel bias...
 
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Snow63

Pray one day we'll open our eyes.
Record Breaker
Joined
Mar 26, 2014
Haven't looked at the protocols for this, or compared with their other competitions this season... but are their high tech scores due to unusually high levels (awarded by tech panel), or due to high GoE (not awarded by tech panel)? Or both? Or what?

Just urging a little caution before jumping to conclusions about tech panel bias...

Mostly because of tech panel. They're the first teams so far this season (from Seniors) who got level 4 for their Partial Step Sequence, level 4s for both RW patterns, and they had highest Base Value possible for short dance (29.7 points). So, yeah, tech panel mostly did the job done.
GOE was high, but now exrtaordinarily high, same for PCS.
 

YesWay

四年もかけて&#
Record Breaker
Joined
Sep 28, 2013
Mostly because of tech panel. They're the first teams so far this season (from Seniors) who got level 4 for their Partial Step Sequence, level 4s for both RW patterns, and they had highest Base Value possible for short dance (29.7 points). So, yeah, tech panel mostly did the job done.
GOE was high, but now exrtaordinarily high, same for PCS.
And they didn't deserve levels 4's?

(Haven't even seen it for myself, and I can't spot levels in Ice Dance anyway ^_^; )
 

Snow63

Pray one day we'll open our eyes.
Record Breaker
Joined
Mar 26, 2014
And they didn't deserve levels 4's?

(Haven't even seen it for myself, and I can't spot levels in Ice Dance anyway ^_^;)

I can't say about pattern, because I haven't looked very closely. But level 4 for their Partial Step Sequence is totally undeserved. To receive level 4 for Partial Step Sequence ALL steps and turns (difficult or simple) included in PSt should be clean (not jumped, scratched, on correct edges, no flat turns, equal depth of entry and exit curves etc.), correct number of dance holds and change of holds. I definitely saw not clean steps there, without even looking too deep.
 

Ice Dance

Record Breaker
Joined
Jan 26, 2014
H&D beat G&F at the 2015 Worlds by 2.72 points, without the benefit of making an appearance at 4CC. I think it's very likely that they'll continue to rank ahead of G&F this season. Not only are their scores growing from event to event, making the GPF is a big plus.

I agree. I really enjoy both of G&F's programs; but seeing them live at Skate Canada, G&F were the slowest team in the field outside Paradis & Ouellette. They have more intricacy than the teams they defeated there and lots of original elements this season; but at some point that balance is going to be outweighed by speed+difficulty. I'd say they have a great shot at top five at Europeans this season though.
 

cathlen

Team Gorgeous Cacti!
Record Breaker
Joined
May 2, 2015
Country
Poland
Free Dance has ended and G/F got another huge score. TES BV :eek:
 

slider11

Medalist
Joined
Jan 12, 2014
Thank you very much for including these clips -they are hard to find. I, too, am disappointed in the scores of Hawayek and Baker. I REALLY like that FD and I think, with the other inflation seen at this Challenger event, it deserved closer to 100. The music and their expression are wonderful. If I were their coaches I would put time into the next month to strengthen that FD as much as possible. The SD is another matter. Either their coaches choose to turn a blind eye to the judges scores all season long or really think it will evolve into something better. But I can't fault the judges here. This SD was not a good choice to showcase Kaitlin and Jean-Luc's strengths. It's a good exercise to get Kaitlin, in particular, to explore new styles but in competition it more accentuates her weaknesses and has set them back as an up and coming team. It is disappointing in this Challenger event, that their SD score was about the same as the Cup of China SD when Kaitlin had food poisoning. At least find another dress for Kaitlin then that long, hair- net looking tutu! If they have any chance to surpass Hubbell and Donahue, they need to rework that SD and polish the FD and hope the two will be enough.
Charlene GUIGNARD / Marco FABBRI 172.28

Kaitlin HAWAYEK / Jean Luc BAKER 153.06 https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5rE7M9OZ-9o&feature=youtu.be

Tina GARABEDIAN / Simon PROULX-SENECAL 127.92 https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aPk1LbeuOZc&feature=youtu.be

Emi HIRAI / Marien DE LA ASUNCION 127.92 https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=InPN18MqBac&feature=youtu.be
 
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