2016 Rostelecom Cup - Men SP | Page 26 | Golden Skate

2016 Rostelecom Cup - Men SP

StitchMonkey

Record Breaker
Joined
Jul 31, 2014
I feel the same but I have nothing against him. as a newbie fan of FS and I don't know things that the experts know, I am just relying on seeing the skaters do things artistically and make me feel that I am with him just like Hanyu did in his Sochi SP and to his R&J1 LP in WC at Nice.

Ohh he as a person is adorable. I want to like him... but his skating is a bit like a lovely plated meal missing a critical ingredient you can't name.
 

Khoai

Match Penalty
Joined
Apr 3, 2015
Ohh he as a person is adorable. I want to like him... but his skating is a bit like a lovely plated meal missing a critical ingredient you can't name.
Main issue I have with Mr. Uno's skating: crossovers, crossovers, crossovers and crossovers.
And not to mention his bad jumping technique.
 

Procrastinator

On the Ice
Joined
Jan 12, 2014
Okay, how is there not a reference judge on the panel who can look at something like Kolyda's component scores and notify/report flagrant bias??

Trust me, I'm NOT one of the annoying people on here who believe that everytime someone besides Yuna or Mao or Yuzuru get a 9.0+ component there's some "home cooking" or "politics" going on, but look at 3 of the judges' components for Kolyda. Mostly 9.0+ and two of the judges gave him mostly 9.25s and 9.50s! In what world is that excusable? And trust me, I understand that component scores are competition-dependent and shouldn't be compared competition to competition, but even just comparing him to Shoma and Fernandez here I'm not sure HOW scores this flagrantly high don't catch someone's attention? Do they not have a review of the protocols at the end of sessions/competitions??
 

karne

in Emergency Backup Mode
Record Breaker
Joined
Jan 1, 2013
Country
Australia
Okay, how is there not a reference judge on the panel who can look at something like Kolyda's component scores and notify/report flagrant bias??

Trust me, I'm NOT one of the annoying people on here who believe that everytime someone besides Yuna or Mao or Yuzuru get a 9.0+ component there's some "home cooking" or "politics" going on, but look at 3 of the judges' components for Kolyda. Mostly 9.0+ and two of the judges gave him mostly 9.25s and 9.50s! In what world is that excusable? And trust me, I understand that component scores are competition-dependent and shouldn't be compared competition to competition, but even just comparing him to Shoma and Fernandez here I'm not sure HOW scores this flagrantly high don't catch someone's attention? Do they not have a review of the protocols at the end of sessions/competitions??

Because, to be fair, he actually gives a performance. He has fun choreography that he pulls off well and plays to the audience. Every part of his body expresses that program, from his toes to his eyebrows. He's a fine skater in his own right and brings the performance all the way through. I think, given the frankly insane scores for Uno's program and for Javier's, Kolyada's score was actually quite fair.
 

Procrastinator

On the Ice
Joined
Jan 12, 2014
Since when does *attempting* to perform merit giving mediocre skaters high components? Other 7.75-8.00 range skaters (which is where he should be) don't ever get that kind of bump for "performing" and having great choreography.

Plus, you're giving entirely too much credit to his very forced choreographic gestures and lack of interpretative skill/nuance (the so-called "arm-ography" that Fernandez demonstrates, perfectly in time with the music)
 

chairmanmao

Final Flight
Joined
Dec 10, 2013
Because, to be fair, he actually gives a performance. He has fun choreography that he pulls off well and plays to the audience. Every part of his body expresses that program, from his toes to his eyebrows. He's a fine skater in his own right and brings the performance all the way through. I think, given the frankly insane scores for Uno's program and for Javier's, Kolyada's score was actually quite fair.

It's a very basic program if one is actually honest. I see a lot of juniors doing this program in some way or another. No one in this competition should be near Shoma and Javi. Frankly the scores of the top 2 were very reasonable in comparison to Kolyada.
 

Khoai

Match Penalty
Joined
Apr 3, 2015
Okay, how is there not a reference judge on the panel who can look at something like Kolyda's component scores and notify/report flagrant bias??

Trust me, I'm NOT one of the annoying people on here who believe that everytime someone besides Yuna or Mao or Yuzuru get a 9.0+ component there's some "home cooking" or "politics" going on, but look at 3 of the judges' components for Kolyda. Mostly 9.0+ and two of the judges gave him mostly 9.25s and 9.50s! In what world is that excusable? And trust me, I understand that component scores are competition-dependent and shouldn't be compared competition to competition, but even just comparing him to Shoma and Fernandez here I'm not sure HOW scores this flagrantly high don't catch someone's attention? Do they not have a review of the protocols at the end of sessions/competitions??
Because Mr Kolyada actually has more transitions and 1 foot skating than Mr Uno.
 

chairmanmao

Final Flight
Joined
Dec 10, 2013
Since when does *attempting* to perform merit giving mediocre skaters high components? Other 7.75-8.00 range skaters (which is where he should be) don't ever get that kind of bump for "performing" and having great choreography.

Plus, you're giving entirely too much credit to his very forced choreographic gestures and lack of interpretative skill/nuance (the so-called "arm-ography" that Fernandez demonstrates, perfectly in time with the music)

It just shows some people never really think before spouting nonsense. I would like to think they know the absurdity of what they are saying but maybe they are unacquainted of what a certain dance requires in terms of movement. I think calling the choreography of flamenco armography would be high on the ignorant list.
 

DiamondDust

Final Flight
Joined
Sep 25, 2016
It won't. The only skaters who generally get dinged for "no steps" are the little country skaters. (Oh, the number of times I've seen great quads of Brendan's get the -3s in the SP because he doesn't do it out of steps...). And I mean, I could live with that, because rules, except that skaters like Uno or Rippon don't get dinged for it, which is massively frustrating.

I woke up and the men's short had still happened. UGH.

OMG! So sad to know this. :( I think there should be better training to the judges and tech panel.
 
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Skater Boy

Record Breaker
Joined
Feb 24, 2012
98.59! Difficult to beat!

The pcs for these men is ridiculous. These are second and third rate pcers behind Chan behind Hanyu and behind Fernandez but look at this score for Umo. Chan should give up or focus on rotating quads. Very sad for skating.
 

Skater Boy

Record Breaker
Joined
Feb 24, 2012
Yes, that's kind of the problem I talked about last time Shoma skated. As others go after him, the PCS go up and you hit a point where it becomes pointless. There will be no difference soon because there is a limit.

Yep, already with this scoring system you have the skaters so closely packed together. So those worried about say Chan winning with pcs it is unlikely now becuas the judges have no where to go and keep pushing big jumpers pcs up but if they are in the 8's or even9's where do you put Chan???
 

Skater Boy

Record Breaker
Joined
Feb 24, 2012
My immediate thoughts after Shoma's score was, "wow, they really want to give Javier a huge score." I could see no other reason. I love Shoma, but they could've scored him around the low 90s and it would've been a good score. What message does that send as it wasn't even near perfect? I hope Shoma can do better tomorrow. And Javier too. I mean his score was equally as weird.

Message is clear quads are worth so much more even if not perfect. So good bye Chan, good bye Jason Brown - the key is more rotated quads even if not clean. Evan L. would be tarred and feathered because he didn't have the quad and was not a top notch pcs'er.
 

Blades of Passion

Skating is Art, if you let it be
Record Breaker
Joined
Sep 14, 2008
Country
France
Shoma does a single choctaw leading into that Quad Flip, with a fairly long break after it. Should definitely be a deduction.
 

riminin

Rinkside
Joined
May 27, 2014
Looks like the same entry as the one into 4T here:
https://youtu.be/H9l5gKHbPNg?t=88

That one was enough. :devil:


Shoma does a single choctaw leading into that Quad Flip, with a fairly long break after it. Should definitely be a deduction.



Oh, that's interesting. It didn't occur to me to compare Shoma's 4F to Hanyu's 4T. It seems to me that Hanyu doesn't miss the rhythm of the music after choctaw to the three-turn while Shoma does. Does Hanyu still do a chasse in between maybe? Overall Hanyu looks much more dynamic and quick and is certainly not resting at any time. I wouldn't have had the question if Shoma gave me the same impression.
 

Khoai

Match Penalty
Joined
Apr 3, 2015
Oh, that's interesting. It didn't occur to me to compare Shoma's 4F to Hanyu's 4T. It seems to me that Hanyu doesn't miss the rhythm of the music after choctaw to the three-turn while Shoma does. Does Hanyu still do a chasse in between maybe? Overall Hanyu looks much more dynamic and quick and is certainly not resting at any time. I wouldn't have had the question if Shoma gave me the same impression.
Mr. Uno has a pause after that shallow choctaw. That's why it should not be counted. The rules do mention that.
 

Li'Kitsu

Record Breaker
Joined
Dec 29, 2011
*Me, watching Javi and Mika*: Shame you kept your last years SPs, that makes it kinda boring.

*Also me, watching Shoma*: Well, that's a snooze, then I'd rather have last years SP back!

Welp :laugh:


Regarding the scores, the inflation we're seeing by now is just ridiculous. Shoma's 4F should have gotten -3, his PCS are way too high in some parts (mainly transitions, but IMO also SS and CO). Javi's SP doesn't look improved at all compared to last year, and even clean he shouldn't be getting 46+ PCS. Let alone with 2 mistakes and a really subdued performance. I don't even want to think about what kind of new scoring 'heights' we'll be getting at the big events. And it spoils the fun, because I actually thought it was a pretty cool men's event. Shoma and Javi, as much as I complain about their scores, still where okay-good, Mika did really well and I love love love his 3Lz (best jump of the competition! :love: ), Elladj performed beautifully, Alexei did well... and we got to see Stephane :love: I'm sorry for Max and Deniss, but there's still the LP, hopefully they'll come back. Good luck to everyone for the LP!
 
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