2017 Skate Canada Challenge

cathlen said:

Max SD score is 84 and I think judges know that Everybody knows it's inflated, but I'm glad Skate Canada supports G/P. They have brilliant dances this season, it should be rewarded, though it's obvious their PCS won't be as high intenationally as here.

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They skated that tango beautifully. I'm tearing my hair out looking for footage of their SD:gaah:

tinlizzie said:

I'm tearing my hair out looking for footage of their SD:gaah:

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There seems to be reverse prioritization in getting these up....

They finally have some of the junior men's individual SP videos up. But NOT GOGOLEV's. :curse:

They put the videos warm up groups with the top placements cut out yesterday.....

If transparency, and giving skaters and coaches a sense of the standard is the point in getting the videos up, wouldn't one get the top short programs up first and right away?

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editing to add Stephen's fanblog has posted his SP here

http://www.dailymotion.com/video/x5...17-skate-canada-challenge-short-program_sport

and his FS

http://www.dailymotion.com/video/x5...-2017-skate-canada-challenge-free-skate_sport

Not posts by Skate Canada as yet.

tinlizzie said:

They skated that tango beautifully. I'm tearing my hair out looking for footage of their SD:gaah:

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http://www.dailymotion.com/video/x5...-poirier-2017-skate-canada-challenge-sd_sport

olayolay said:

http://www.dailymotion.com/video/x5...-poirier-2017-skate-canada-challenge-sd_sport

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Thank you!!! That looked pretty awesome to me but I'll wait for an expert to weigh in.

tinlizzie said:

Thank you!!! That looked pretty awesome to me but I'll wait for an expert to weigh in.

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That's my take also.

They had the speed and the performance of their last GP outing, but without the error that took the energy out of the performance there. Higher PCS may not just be national event inflation, but rather due to a better performance in a welcoming environment.

Looks as though they started their twizzles a bit further up the ice. Not sure if there has been a slight adjustment or if the ice conditions at the Cup of France kept them out of the corners and put them to close to the end boards on the twizzles.

lots of catching up to do
will do later having a buzz from drinking a tall glass of milk.. need to settle it down first

(i never cow milk... so yeah... first time in years)

Just watched Psquared SD & FD and I think I'm changing into an uber. Pure awesomness I'm so glad they decided to compete here! I also watched Stephen Gogolev's skates and I think this kid is a star! Skating his SP to Live and Let Die is also a bonus for me Skate Canada better takes good care of him.

cathlen said:

Just watched Psquared SD & FD and I think I'm changing into an uber. Pure awesomness I'm so glad they decided to compete here! I also watched Stephen Gogolev's skates and I think this kid is a star! Skating his SP to Live and Let Die is also a bonus for me Skate Canada better takes good care of him.

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as moron I am I've not known anything about this SC Challenge event...

will have to catch up on Piper and Paul, I'm ecstatic as they competed again, and I thought I had to settle to see them next time at Nationals , my favourite set of programs this season, brilliant skaters and foremost - two personalities shining through these programs with such intense and sizzling chemistry, this tango FD is a masterpiece to be remembered for a long time!

cathlen said:

I also watched Stephen Gogolev's skates and I think this kid is a star! Skating his SP to Live and Let Die is also a bonus for me Skate Canada better takes good care of him.

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Glad more folks are tracking Stephen. We are all hopeful that his early achievements will continue as he matures.

He's coached by Brian Orser and the team at Toronto Cricket and has been there for some time. Brian Orser was himself a skating prodigy, landing 3As early as a junior, which was extraordinary for his era. So we are confident that Brian has the long view.


For those interested in tracking Stephen, here is the link to his fan log where more videos are linked. His FS at sectionals was better....

http://gogogogolev.tumblr.com/

He also has a fan fest on GS.

And here is a clip of Stephen training a quad lutz....

https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=PDWcMYy2D3o

Just a few comments this time.

There are people who are unbelieving of that SD mark for Piper & Paul. But the thing is - they hit their levels. Even if they don't get the same PCS and GOEs that they were given at Challenge, they'll still get the marks for their levels. To give a more roughly realistic mark (for those who cannot believe this result) we can do a sum of Virtue/Moir's TES from Autumn Classic (they got straight level 4s in the SD as well) and G/P's PCS from Skate Canada. That would give them 75.98. Which is still not bad at all. They had one level 3 in the FD which is not bad either. If anything, I think Skate Canada knows Virtue/Moir will set all the Canadian records this season so for G/P to have this now is just fine. And I do like the fact that SC is acknowledging them. To SC's credit, they also acknowledged Orford/Hill last season... if you have a good team with good programs then why hold them back because of some perceived hierarchy?

It looks like Soucisse/Firus will be 5th at Nationals. Or perhaps 4th if Paul/Islam aren't back.

Also those BC/YK junior ladies!! The podium was a repeat of BC/YK sectionals but Olivia Gran and Mckenna Colthorp swapped places. Olivia performed much better at Challenge and Mckenna's PCS were not insanely high compared to Olivia and Emily (you could see the bias from the BC/YK judges clearly). Emily's got to be less cautious skating that FS. She's improved the SP, but the FS is still a series of cautious jumps and turns.

Gabby

Stephen...with that FS performance I hope it lowers some crazy expectations and pressure heading into Nationals. It's better to peak there than at Challenge anyways.

What's happened to Conrad Orzel? He's not looking like himself.

Any word on why Liam Firus withdrew?

Liam only planned on doing the short as he is still in recover from severe ankle sprain he acquired on the Thursday practice at Skate Canada International the night before the event

So... I am done with drinking milk and on to a very nice Chardo... (early Xmas present I received)

thought it would be ideal to watch hottie Paul and his gal Piper.

SD : still my favourite SD of the season... skated better than ever. I am no expert but I could see how every move was right dead on the beat. If that is how turns and what not are evaluated to get levels, well ... no surprise there. I still rank this SD 1st from all the ones I have seen this season so why worry about the high score? Can we just take it and enjoy it?

FD : this one looked so easy and comfortable for them. It's how it should feel. I don't know, I think it may have even looked too easy LOL.. but I agree speed was incredible and so on. I had more excitement watching the SC version but perhaps it's also a question of video quality...

I cannot wait to see those dances live. I think I am pretty lucky.



I have grown to like PnP just as much as weapo and vm.... It is so hard to have 3 super teams to love Well, judges will decide which one wins Nationals and how they rank in competitions, while I sit down and just swoon Canada has such a strong ice dance team!

Re the national record? it's okay... it will be beaten again. it's just nice to see that it wasn't "saved" for someone else at another time... A team skated very well and earned it. that's all.

i know i am slow...

but ... hey... better late than never.


i was waiting for a clear link to gabby's skate... but not there really unless you do like me go here and watch 3 hours of skating...

ok.. i didn't do that... i guess that Gabby would be near the end. She's at 2:44 and seconds.

From seeing the scores, but not looking at protocols I was expecting something completely different.

Sure, huge improvement from her other LPs this season. Only two minor step outs on the flip (what a difficult set up) and the loop....

The rest is very good.


However, I thought that it was a bit of a strange vibe Gabby was projecting here. She obviously went there because she felt like she needed another outing. No question about it. I think she made the right decision. However, let me know if you disagree and I hope I am wrong, I thought that all her skating was more subdued compared to earlier this year. It is as if she were trying to jump less high, taking less risks. Her trademark combo was great but less spectacular as in the TDF SP... Her rippon lutz was very good too... Even the 2As were a bit smaller. Was she being cautious? Did she go for a "stay on your feet" kind of skate ? I have no idea if it's just a camera angle thing... that's why I am asking for input from the pros

In any case, if she went for a safe routine to build her confidence back : mission accomplished. I doubt this kind of skate would place her outside the top 2 at Nationals. One thing I find impressive with Gabby is the challenge she gives herself with her jump entries. I even think she is making it too hard at times (on the flip). I think she moves better this year too. She is so much more fluid in her body movements.

My only worry is that she keeps this safer style I love the explosive Gabby. Perhaps it's a question of knowing when she can go for the biggies and when she needs control?

Gabby, you have listened to me before when I said you should go back to the 3t-3t in the short listen to me once more...
1) don't lose your spunk!
2) make the 3F entry easier
3) start training 4T and 3A

Question for the pros

can anyone tell me the difference in BV for these elements

3lz +2t+2t and 3S+2A (seq) VS 3lz+2t and 2A +1/2Lo+3S

Gabby and Liza (if I recall correctly) do not do the loop combos.... both have the 3t-3t and both need a lutz in combo... so they both have a sequence with the axel...i am wondering about these base values since if i am thinking properly, option 2 (the loop combo) is perhaps more rewarding.

In conclusion : solid performance by Gabby but not 100% clean and to me, less exciting than what I have seen her do in the past in terms of power and explosiveness (but again I may be fooled by the camera angle). However, if the goal was to be rewarded for all triples and not fall, then another milestone for Gabby!

Congrats on the Canadian record! I think it will be beaten at Nationals by the one lady who will earn gold...

watched last year's program again for Gabby...

so good improvement in the BV

used to be

3t-3t
3lz
3f
3lz-2t-2l (at worlds she tagged the third jump later on the 3s)
3Lo
3s-2t
2A

8.6 + 6 + 5.3 + 9.1 +5.1 + 5.7 + 3.3 = 43.1
Now, by doing the sequence, she's adding an opportunity for the second 2A.

3t-3t
3Lz (rippon)
3F
3Lo
3Lz-2t-2t
3s+2a sequence
2a

8.6+6 + 5.3 +5.1 +8.6 + 6.16 + 3.3 = 43.06 So it seems here that Gabby even loses BV with this year's layout.... the second 2t in the 3 jump combo is half a point less. The sequence also downgrades her salchow and axel to 80%...




what i'd like her to do if it gives more points (pending on question in earlier post

3t-3t
3lz
3f
3Lo
3lz-2t
2a-1/2l-3S
2a

8.6+6+5.3+5.1+7.3+8.1 + 3.3 =43.7

Okay.. so I guess there's not much of a difference with the last one.. so GOE is the deciding factor and perhaps why she goes for this year's layout as her sequence is very nice and impressive.

I didn't factor 10% bonus as I assume that more or less, she does the same pattern with the first 3 jump passes before half time.

I'd be curious how her BV compares to other ladies (of course without the 10% bonus)

xox thanks for the explanation! I forgot about what happened at SCI. Poor guy.

4everchan perhaps she was trying to control the explosiveness of her jumps? Big jumps are beautiful but hard to control the landings...or so I've been told. Who gave her a carrot?

I noticed Sarah Tamura watching her on the side. That was a trend at this event - skaters watching their peers. Often in the kiss and cry. Drew Wolfe cheering on Kirsten and Michael. Soucisse/Firus watching Piper/Paul. The pre-nov pairs were doing it too.

By the way did anyone see pre-nov ice dance? My eye caught Erica Estepa / Nolen Hickey. Nolen in particular reminds me a lot of Pavel Drozd - the hair, the talent. They did mirroring twizzles towards and away from each other. Such an interesting duo. I can't find their FD on SC's Dailymotion but someone on Twitter put up a clip: https://twitter.com/i/videos/805224388157198336

Mango said:

xox thanks for the explanation! I forgot about what happened at SCI. Poor guy.

4everchan perhaps she was trying to control the explosiveness of her jumps? Big jumps are beautiful but hard to control the landings...or so I've been told. Who gave her a carrot?

I noticed Sarah Tamura watching her on the side. That was a trend at this event - skaters watching their peers. Often in the kiss and cry. Drew Wolfe cheering on Kirsten and Michael. Soucisse/Firus watching Piper/Paul. The pre-nov pairs were doing it too.

By the way did anyone see pre-nov ice dance? My eye caught Erica Estepa / Nolen Hickey. Nolen in particular reminds me a lot of Pavel Drozd - the hair, the talent. They did mirroring twizzles towards and away from each other. Such an interesting duo. I can't find their FD on SC's Dailymotion but someone on Twitter put up a clip: https://twitter.com/i/videos/805224388157198336

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Gabby doesn't eat carrots
At ACI, people were watching each other too... I think that perhaps they hide in bigger events???
Those mirroring twizzles will give a hard time to camera people like the mirroring 2A from P/J at COC a mess for the cameramen

So what's next for Gabby? Aside from replacing one of the 2t jumps by a 2L... to gain .5 she is maxed out now. Her flip gets ! so I don't think she will go repeating it...and lost the opportunity for her money combo. does anyone know if like Alaine, she was training the 3A?

4everchan said:

Gabby doesn't eat carrots
At ACI, people were watching each other too... I think that perhaps they hide in bigger events???
Those mirroring twizzles will give a hard time to camera people like the mirroring 2A from P/J at COC a mess for the cameramen

So what's next for Gabby? Aside from replacing one of the 2t jumps by a 2L... to gain .5 she is maxed out now. Her flip gets ! so I don't think she will go repeating it...and lost the opportunity for her money combo. does anyone know if like Alaine, she was training the 3A?

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Both Alaine and Gabby were reportedly training the 3A two years ago, but only Alaine attempted to bring it to competition last year. And that was not successful for her....

well now it's time Gabby see if it can come handy I remember Alaine trying it last year in her GWTW program... she didn't land it but got credit for rotation once at least but would lose focus afterwards.... it was a wise move for her to take it out of the program... but i hope she is still working on it.

TGee said:

Both Alaine and Gabby were reportedly training the 3A two years ago, but only Alaine attempted to bring it to competition last year. And that was not successful for her....

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Anybody has problems with Daily motion videos? For me sometimes it works, still it keeps restarting, or crashing. I couldn't watch G/P as the video was going back every 2 seconds, advancing little by little. I use Safari...