2016 NHK Trophy Ladies SP

Raomina said:

Oh I understand and agree with that specific case. I'm just commenting on the overall tendency for people to compare scores just by listing out jumps, as if those are the only elements worth anything.

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In the case of Satoko and Mirai, both are excellent spinners and do well at steps so jumps are what made the difference in their short program scores.

jenaj said:

In the case of Satoko and Mirai, both are excellent spinners and do well at steps so jumps are what made the difference in their short program scores.

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I think someone has already replied in more detail previously comparing both their spins and steps in the SP. Mirai lost points in both spins and steps (level 3 for everything except 1 spin), and they were mostly lower in GOEs as well. These points add up too. Just because Mirai is known to be a good spinner doesn't mean she will automatically get high scores and levels in spins in every program such that only jump differences matter.

Raomina said:

I think someone has already replied in more detail previously comparing both their spins and steps in the SP. Mirai lost points in both spins and steps (level 3 for everything except 1 spin), and they were mostly lower in GOEs as well. These points add up too. Just because Mirai is known to be a good spinner doesn't mean she will automatically get high scores and levels in spins in every program such that only jump differences matter.

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Yes, she got hosed on the spins, too, but the most glaring difference was Satoko's jumps--Satoko fell on the first jump of her 3-3 combo (UR, should have been<<) and only tacked a double onto her planned solo triple. Either the system is flawed or the judging is--or both (my vote). Mirai was also hosed on PCS. One judge gave her scores in the 6's. People Cheat Still.

jenaj said:

Yes, she got hosed on the spins, too, but the most glaring difference was Satoko's jumps--Satoko fell on the first jump of her 3-3 combo (UR, should have been<<) and only tacked a double onto her planned solo triple. Either the system is flawed or the judging is--or both (my vote). Mirai was also hosed on PCS. One judge gave her scores in the 6's. People Cheat Still.

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Personally, I don't have a horse in this race, but comparing Satoko and Mirai, the only contentious part is the 3Lz< by the tech caller that could put her below Mirai, not simply having a fall and no 3-3, which she made up for in terms of points for in other elements while Mirai lost them. Mirai underrotated her 3-3, got -ve GOE and it's in the first half, so it got less points than Satoko with her 3-2 with +ve GOE in the second half, so having a 3-2 doesn't automatically mean less points. You can argue that the entire panel is rigged to give Mirai an overall -ve GOE and Satoko an overall +ve GOE for those combos, but I don't want to go down that rabbit hole. :scard8: Also, YMMV, but I felt that Satoko deserved higher PCS than Mirai. One judge also gave Mirai 9's, which is why they use trimmed mean to calculate the overall scores.