2017-18 State of U.S. Ladies Skating | Page 200 | Golden Skate

2017-18 State of U.S. Ladies Skating

apgold

Record Breaker
Joined
Jan 10, 2014
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United-States
It’s a weird time for us ladies. Gracie has the skills but lost herself after worlds in 2016, and without her closest competitor, and with other factors, ashley lost her fire, I can’t say for sure that it was linked to the breakdown of gracie, but it’s also easy to make a link. Karen can skate beautifully, but she’s so inconsistent. Mariah is good, but hasn’t found great. Polina could shock everyone at nationals, but that’s just a dream. Mirai is also good but her programs have a tendency to lack performance and are plagued with ur. Then there is Bradie who is making a name for herself, but she’s not been tested enough to know how she will do under the pressure of the olympics. And Courtney And then there are the ones that could spoil for placement - Caroline, Angela,

And then there are the up and comers who don’t seem ready yet- STARR, Amber, Tessa, Emmy

And even younger that can’t factor into seniors yet - Hanna, alysa, kaitlyn.

I hope the ladies can find their way out of their rut, we'll see. Of some of those mentioned, I'd love to see Emmy Ma make a splash in the next few years. She's a gorgeous skater with lots of charisma. She just needs higher tech content and a bit more polish.
 
Joined
Nov 5, 2017
yes thanks to karen, mariah & ashley.

However i am personally disappointed in their performances this year.

I did expect them to skate better being an olympic years, claiming i am national champ, silver and bronze medalist we aren't going to give up our
olympic spots without a fight.

To say lackluster performances by all 3 been understatement. To be honest.

Yes i am sorry about ashley injury, karens boots, but the top two u.s. ladies been there done that throughout the years from tenley, carol, peggy, dorothy, julie ann holmes, janet, linda, elaine-roz, tiffany, deb,
jill, michelle, nicole, tara, sarah, angela.

heard all before but it matter the olympic years. They came out strong , showing the up-comers they had to get through them to do--usually didn't happen.

i am just disappointed.

i do hope all skate well at nationals and strong.
 

flipsydoodle

On the Ice
Joined
Mar 19, 2004
I will say this about Mirai, she wants it and she works hard. You can really tell she wants it.

Mirai never looks remotely inspired to me. She always looks as though she just wants to get her programs over with. She never sinks into the music or moves with feeling. No evidence whatever that "you can really tell she wants it."
 

drivingmissdaisy

Record Breaker
Joined
Feb 17, 2010
Mirai never looks remotely inspired to me. She always looks as though she just wants to get her programs over with. She never sinks into the music or moves with feeling. No evidence whatever that "you can really tell she wants it."


I think Mirai does train hard, and that she isn't a good competitor isn't necessarily indicative of not wanting it. She has nice, expressive exhibition programs, so I think lack of feeling in competitive programs is just a situation in which she freezes up when nervous.
 

sinnerspinner

On the Ice
Joined
May 4, 2017
Bradie might the only US lady who is capable of this.

Thanks largely to Karen Chen pulling out two decent performances at Worlds last year, the US has three spots that, for better or worse, could probably instead belong to stronger skaters from other countries. But the rules are what they are, and our spots were undeniably earned.

And we kind of just have to resign ourselves to the fact that we will be sending women who are not up to the competitive standard the US ladies have set in the past. Meanwhile, USFS has to figure out how to make sure that this doesn't happen again.

Yes, other countries could easily fill 4 or 5 olympic spots with their rosters. A lot will have to change for usa to be competitve starting from the bottom up.
 

skylark

Gazing at a Glorious Great Lakes sunset
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You are right (and I am wrong) about what she meant. In several stories about her withdrawal, I saw this quote: "I'm a competitor through and through and to just not be the competitor that I want to be, it's really tough, and it breaks my heart," Wagner said.

BUT I just searched for it again (when you asked for a link), and found this more complete quote: "I'm a competitor through and through and to just not be the competitor that I want to be, it's really tough, and it breaks my heart. But I'm not in that position right now because I'm in pain and I just have to accept that, and I have to go home and get better first, and then I can start working towards nationals," Wagner said.

So the last phrase obviously changes the context and meaning.

Yes. That's the jist of what I recall her saying, and that sounds much more like the Ashley we know. :thank: for looking it up.

A number of people have said in the past 10 or 20 pages of this thread that Ashley seems to have lost her motivation, or drive, or desire or something. I just don't see it that way, although I do agree that not having Gracie as her main competitor left her a little off balance. (I can relate ... I remember competing in track; my friend and I always came in first and second and finished the race within a couple of inches of each other.)

I think people think of Ashley as being such a strong, sassy, assertive woman that it throws them off a bit when she shows some vulnerability or emotion. But I've always felt that it's her emotions paired with her competitive fire that gives her performance and artistry something unique to her. That, plus her ice presence.

I'm very happy to see it reported on this thread that she's back on the ice training for Nationals! :yay: :hap10: :hap93:
 

skylark

Gazing at a Glorious Great Lakes sunset
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Can someone please educate me on how to find Ashley's instagram stories ... or anyone's, for that matter? thanks in advance. :)
 

Tavi...

Record Breaker
Joined
Feb 10, 2014
Can someone please educate me on how to find Ashley's instagram stories ... or anyone's, for that matter? thanks in advance. :)

If you follow Ashley on Instagram, her stories should appear automatically at the top of your screen whenever she makes one. They only last for 24 hours, though. I don’t know if you can see stories if you don’t have an Instagram account.
 

skylark

Gazing at a Glorious Great Lakes sunset
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Maybe in 2012 she did, but after that, Gracie Gold did just as much. It was the team of both of them that got the 3rd spot back, and kept it.

Which is what I said in my follow-up post:

I guess it depends on which "lot of people" you're talking about. Hard to predict, of course. I've never thought of Ashley as a Grand Dame, but I stand by my statement that she's carried US ladies figure skating. She's had help, but she's been the main one and the one who's shown the greatest consistency over time and, I'd say, competitive spirit and nerve. Also, I say she's loaded with natural figure skating talent ... but again, that depends on what a viewer's emphasis and taste run to.
 

Icey

Record Breaker
Joined
Nov 28, 2012
Can you provide a link to these studies? If muscle memory (procedural memory) did not exist then things like playing the piano or tying your shoes would be impossible. The cerebellum is instrumental in these functions.

As an example of this, Clive Wearing, a man with herpes encephalitis, was unable to form new memories but retained the ability to play the piano.

I should written new research indicates muscle memory may not exist. Link follows:
https://www.livescience.com/56218-muscles-have-no-strength-memory.html
 

skylark

Gazing at a Glorious Great Lakes sunset
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Aug 12, 2014
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United-States
If you follow Ashley on Instagram, her stories should appear automatically at the top of your screen whenever she makes one. They only last for 24 hours, though. I don’t know if you can see stories if you don’t have an Instagram account.

:thank: Tavi. I am a social media naif....
 

SkaterX

On the Ice
Joined
Dec 5, 2016
I should written new research indicates muscle memory may not exist. Link follows:
https://www.livescience.com/56218-muscles-have-no-strength-memory.html


Aha, ok. This article is talking about memory within the muscle tissue itself. That is a separate issue from brain control of movement. In the case of Mirai, her brain has been trained to do that jump following a specific setup. That was the point I was trying to make.

Later in the article they mention this distinction:

Although new results suggest that the muscle cells themselves do not retain a "memory" from exercise, the same is not true for the nerves that thread through the muscles, or the brain regions that control movement, Lindholm said.

"Your nerves have learned in which order to activate your muscles in order to perform a certain movement," she said.

Riding a bike, serving a tennis ball and learning how to walk when you're a really small child, are things that you can't really forget, Lindholm said.
 

R.D.

Record Breaker
Joined
Jul 26, 2003
Which is what I said in my follow-up post:

Thanks for clarifying - although, we'll agree to disagree on Wagner being the "main one". Personally feel it doesn't give Gold quite enough credit, considering she placed above Wagner at both 2014 and 2015 Worlds.
 

skylark

Gazing at a Glorious Great Lakes sunset
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Thanks for clarifying - although, we'll agree to disagree on Wagner being the "main one". Personally feel it doesn't give Gold quite enough credit, considering she placed above Wagner at both 2014 and 2015 Worlds.

Well, when I said "main one," I was counting all of 2011-2012 and even 2008 through 2010, when Ashley was one of the top women. So if we consider the 10 years that she's been a senior, it adds up cumulatively. And then Ashley did place above Gracie in 2013, 2016 and 2017. :) But I agree that Ashley and Gracie were definitely a force together. Some symbiotic relationship going there. Ashley has acknowledged it repeatedly herself, saying that Gracie has been "a blessing" to her, competitively.
 

flipsydoodle

On the Ice
Joined
Mar 19, 2004
The bar was high this year. You needed over 200 to medal at every event except Canada (where Ashley medaled). The one woman who scored over 200 did medal at Skate America, but that score would not have medaled at any GP event outside North America. To put that all in perspective, Karen score 199.29 to finish 4th at Worlds. The women from Russia and Japan came ready to compete for Olympic spots this GP season, and the Americans did not.

The bar was always high. There was always plenty of competition from other nations. It's just that this year the US wasn't up to it. Not only that, they looked out of shape, distracted, and unfocused. This does not make fun viewing, either.
 

skatefan17

On the Ice
Joined
Feb 9, 2014
Ashley alone kept the US competitive in the last 10 years, and that to me is undisputable. She has been able to accomplish so much and with technical flaws. I just hope one day her legacy is elevated and that she's remembered for being fierce for the US.
 
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