2017 CS Lombardia Trophy Ladies SP

I don't think Alina's dress adds any effects to the program. I'd prefer more black and a more fierce looking dress. The bottom part should be a more regular flowy skater, since her LP dress has tutu, a bit too much.

I feel she does not feel comfortable in this dress. And we didn't see a costume change in the program, right? Something is not completely ready. The 2A entry just too crazy. I thought she did the same entry in last year's sp, but when I checked, it is less difficult. I am glad she is testing her programs at a B event.

Osmond4gold said:

My own scores from what I viewed today;

WH 69 given the UR 3T
CK 67 as no 3/3
AZ 65 2a fall, cautiously skated and behind her music

The tech panel must have had wine with dinner last evening.

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Carolina made up for her tech with her PCS. Right now, she is the gold standard on components.

Totally forgot about this competition :con3:. Scores are getting more incomprehensible for simpletons like me. It's like waking up from a coma, seeing the scores and then wanting to fall back into coma again
Quick impression:
* Wakaba is lovely, although the program is not interesting for me.
* Caro is a superb artist. If she can skate to that music, she can skate to anything.
* Alina... I've always been partial to her because I think she has a spitfire and certainly not a jumping bean if developed the right way. But that Swan Lake looks like a gymnastics floor routine with multitudes of movements which don't make any sense.

But does Carolina really deserve to be in second right now without a 3-3? And over 70 for that? I don't think so...

Spirals for Miles said:

But does Carolina really deserve to be in second right now without a 3-3? And over 70 for that? I don't think so...

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lol i LOVE Carolina, i'm so happy and thankful we still have her competing but ita. overscored on name recognition sigh....any chance videos will pop up on youtube?

evasorange said:

lol i LOVE Carolina, i'm so happy and thankful we still have her competing but ita. overscored on name recognition sigh....any chance videos will pop up on youtube?

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Here's Carolina's. Several of the other ladies' skates should pop up at the side.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=moWaaipN-ms

4everchan said:

omg... fall right away... before even a jump

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"I'm Alive!"

thoakun said:

* Caro is a superb artist. If she can skate to that music, she can skate to anything.

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Spirals for Miles said:

But does Carolina really deserve to be in second right now without a 3-3?

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Caro can skate so superbly to that music because she feels it in her soul. With her movement, her expression, and her devotion to the performance, she transfers that emotion and beauty directly to audience members. In that respect, she's like Ashley Wagner, Jason Brown, G&G. Such a performance makes one more or less triple irrelevant. fs is more than scores.

sequinsgalore said:

35 Alina ZAGITOVA (RUS)

Music: Black Swan; Moonlight

White/black long-sleeve dress with tulle tutu

FCSp
StSq
3Lz+3Lo
3F
2A - stepout, knee down (fall?)
LSp
CCoSp

Problems on that 2A again, maybe entry too hard?

SP: 40.65+31.64-1.00 = 71.29 (PB), 3/35

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Eeek... personal best with a fall?!?

I get that Zagitova has improved since WJC/JGPF. But at WJC with a clean program she scored 29.17, and here, with a fall, her PCS is 31.64. That is absolutely crazy. I like her program too, but it's still not as refined at this point as her SP was at Worlds last year. Yes, "senior PCS bump" and all, but skaters shouldn't be getting PCS that's 2+ points higher than your personal best, with a fall. The program is lovely, and has a lot of potential.

Then again, the top 3 skaters' PCS here were all crazy high. And Wakaba was gifted on the 3T landing -- her PCS was a personal best but at least she had no major mistake, so it wasn't egregious.

Spirals for Miles said:

Am I the only one that things that Alya should have had higher PCS??
Very sad for Alya today, she must redeem herself in the FS tomorrow so that the Fed doesn't stop hyping her...

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Did you not see the part where she fell? And scored almost 2 points higher in PCS than she ever has previously?

And you bring up a good point -- hype is great but if the skater doesn't deliver, even that can't save them (even though somehow Alina scored a PB with a fall).

Spirals for Miles said:

But does Carolina really deserve to be in second right now without a 3-3? And over 70 for that? I don't think so...

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Yes she does deserve to be in second. Her score is too high, but so was Alina's and Wakaba's. The standings are exactly where they should be, albeit about 2-3 points higher than they should be.

CanadianSkaterGuy said:

Eeek... personal best with a fall?!?

I get that Zagitova has improved since WJC/JGPF. But at WJC with a clean program she scored 29.17, and here, with a fall, her PCS is 31.64. That is absolutely crazy. I like her program too, but it's still not as refined at this point as her SP was at Worlds last year. Yes, "senior PCS bump" and all, but skaters shouldn't be getting PCS that's 2+ points higher than your personal best, with a fall. The program is lovely, and has a lot of potential.

Then again, the top 3 skaters' PCS here were all crazy high. And Wakaba was gifted on the 3T landing -- her PCS was a personal best but at least she had no major mistake, so it wasn't egregious.

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These lower tier competitions will have inflated scoring, that's only natural. In addition, seniors tend to have higher scoring than juniors - Even the most impressive junior programs tend to have extremely low PCS.

PCS of 31.64 really shouldn't even be considered too high for her at all...


Though, I'll be honest, I don't like her costume for this at all.

Spirals for Miles said:

But does Carolina really deserve to be in second right now without a 3-3? And over 70 for that? I don't think so...

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Honestly, the scores look weird.
She got 9 for transitions for example - I mean, if thats a 9, Zagitova should have gotten 17, not 7.

as a junior Alina did in SP // 3lz-3t, 3lo, 2a
right now she is doing // 3lz3lo, 3f, 2a

Alina's BV 34.97
Caro's BV 27.63
Wakaba's BV 33.76

don't forget Alina's crazy and extremely difficult transitions in/out... compare to others....

Just watched the whole SP although I skipped everybody after Laurine except for ZAGITOVA.

Laurine LECAVELIER - My favorite skater I guess ever. I dunno, I feel disappointed with this program and the presentation. But that makes sense since her SP last year was my favorite program of all time. It just grabbed me and was unlike anything I've ever seen. Skating looked beautiful, but I wonder if the combination will ever come together? Hoping she'll regroup and have a good season. I really think she is top 10 in the world quality, but wonder if she'll ever get there? Also, the costume ... ??? ... ???

Alina ZAGITOVA - I loved everything about this. Think she might rival Medvedeva this year. Great costume and amazing program. Everything about her skating is pure fire and technically mindblowing.

Wakaba HIGUCHI - She was so very wow. I loved it. Hasn't lost anything since last year.

Anastasia GALUSTYAN - Another big favorite of mine. She's a woman now. Must be going through a lot of adjustments with her body changing. Loved that SP at World's last year. Hope she can get the technical side together. Seems like she and KUCHVALSKA are running on parallel tracks.

I also really liked Alisson PERTICHETO, thought she had a lot of attack and finesse. Matilda ALGOTTSON was impressive too. I love that she's using the same song from ZIEGLER/KIEFER, "Turn to Stone." That's such a moving song. Yura MATSUDA seemed better than last year, but I'm wondering if she'll have consistency. This program suits her better -- it was very soft and playful -- but it seems like she's holding back. Micol CRISTINA was really graceful. Did she only do a 3-2 combination? I hope she can upgrade it. If she or Giada Russia could take that second spot so that I don't have to watch RODEGHIERO anymore, that would be perfect for me. (Sorry.) Anne-Line GJERSEM's program is really pretty. I liked DUBININA's dress. GOLOVKINA did pretty good too!

Tired of "Yo Soy Maria," tired of MOULIN ROUGE!... it's a hard life, yes.

Hope Ivett TOTH gets well soon.

I really loved the energy of the girl who skated to Celine Dion's "I'm Alive"... she was so adorable. And the odd and lost in the wilderness tone of the announcer who kept saying "Thank you"...strange and perfect...

Haha, I shouldn't rewatch figure skating programs hours after I watched them live. Now I think that not only was Higuchi's 3T< but also Zagitova's 3F<. Of course, the video quality is poor and both of them should get the benefit of the doubt (especially in a not very important competition).
Anyway, historically a clean program always gets a PCS boost. Carolina only did a 3-2 combo (but it was a very nice 3-2, that wasn't mentioned yet) and she lost levels on her last spin but apart from that it was a very good performance. I enjoyed the step sequence immensely. Better a 3-2 than an error in one of the jumping passes.

Spirals for Miles said:

But does Carolina really deserve to be in second right now without a 3-3? And over 70 for that? I don't think so...

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Yes, I do think that Carolina deserves to be 2nd with that performance. I want to point out to you that she is a superior technician. She might seem boring to you because she is only doing a 3-2 but don't forget that she's already 30 years old. That's twice as old as Alina. And I have no doubt that she'll go for the 3F-3T again at the Olympics. She can't waste energy or risk her health in unimportant competitions. I must say, I didn't expect her to look this promising this season ... I'm impressed. She's still improving her overall skating.

moriel said:

Honestly, the scores look weird.
She got 9 for transitions for example - I mean, if thats a 9, Zagitova should have gotten 17, not 7.

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You're joking, right? :dev2:
If not, then you should educate yourself on what the ISU considers to be good transitions (you can find a video on youtube where the ISU is using Carolina as an example for body movement transitions). Then you can decide whether you agree with the ISU or not.
My opinion is that f.e. Alina's body movement transitions aren't that good, can't be that good because she's lacking skating skills. You just can't do certain things of you don't have full control, balance and good glide. That's why she isn't holding positions and swinging with her free leg to gain speed. And she's getting good points for her jumps in/out transitions - that's boosting her technical score already. But when you look at the PCS, the judges also have to judge the quality of those transitions and the quality very often just isn't good.

By the way - the in/out of the 2A that Carolina did was quite the nicest in/out of a 2A she ever did. I liked that a lot. https://youtu.be/moWaaipN-ms?t=95

Looking forward to watching the videos tonight. Missed everything because I was busy today at work! Based on watching a few seconds of Carolina's SP without music:

1. That dress is the classiest I've seen in the entire Olympic quad. Simple, elegant, with a POW of color. A+++++++. Only you, Carolina, the classiest of us all.

2. Have any of the usual suspects who critique Evgenia's miming complained about Carolina's? There was some definite miming in the beginning of that program. (That said, it was beautiful miming. Maybe in a few years Evgenia will mime as beautifully. Those limbs. )

i watched a few girls, among them Alina and Carolina. In my book there is no way Caro can be placed ahead Alina even with that 2A fluke. Caro did 3F2T vs Alina 3Lz3L, then single jumps were Loop vs Tano Flip. 2A are the first element that favour Caro. Transitions and spins were better in the Black Swan program. I agree Aliina's program is overcrowded. By comparison, Caro's program looks empty. Honestly Alina coaches should rethink this rollercoaster madness program. I love the black Swan theme, but some moderation is needed.

CanadianSkaterGuy said:

Eeek... personal best with a fall?!?

I get that Zagitova has improved since WJC/JGPF. But at WJC with a clean program she scored 29.17, and here, with a fall, her PCS is 31.64. That is absolutely crazy. I like her program too, but it's still not as refined at this point as her SP was at Worlds last year. Yes, "senior PCS bump" and all, but skaters shouldn't be getting PCS that's 2+ points higher than your personal best, with a fall. The program is lovely, and has a lot of potential.
Then again, the top 3 skaters' PCS here were all crazy high. And Wakaba was gifted on the 3T landing -- her PCS was a personal best but at least she had no major mistake, so it wasn't egregious.

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You should not compare scores between juniors and seniors. Junior level have shorter programs, thus, lower scores as they mis at least one element.

CanadianSkaterGuy said:

Eeek... personal best with a fall?!?

I get that Zagitova has improved since WJC/JGPF. But at WJC with a clean program she scored 29.17, and here, with a fall, her PCS is 31.64. That is absolutely crazy. I like her program too, but it's still not as refined at this point as her SP was at Worlds last year. Yes, "senior PCS bump" and all, but skaters shouldn't be getting PCS that's 2+ points higher than your personal best, with a fall. The program is lovely, and has a lot of potential.

Then again, the top 3 skaters' PCS here were all crazy high. And Wakaba was gifted on the 3T landing -- her PCS was a personal best but at least she had no major mistake, so it wasn't egregious.

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As for pcs, Zagitova had 29.17 at JWC, Wakaba had 29.03 at WC. There is an expected bump for getting senior. What kind of bump did Wakaba enjoy to get to 33 now? All three leaders have inflated pcs - there is absolutey no need to single out Zagitova.