Trusova and Quads | Page 23 | Golden Skate

Trusova and Quads

moriel

Record Breaker
Joined
Mar 18, 2015
Well, she got 0 GOE, a few pluses a few minuses. Still, 11.50 points is 11.50 points. ;) Next up, elevate her 2A to a 3A! :yes:

If we stop to think, 11.50 is what many skaters get for their combos.
For Sasha, that is just one jump.
 

moriel

Record Breaker
Joined
Mar 18, 2015
Also, this leaves just one quad to be mastered by ladies. Who would have thought lets say 2 years ago?
 

Baron Vladimir

Record Breaker
Joined
Dec 18, 2014
If we stop to think, 11.50 is what many skaters get for their combos.
For Sasha, that is just one jump.

She got 14 points twice for her two combos in the second half. I dont think she needs quads to win, but thats her :biggrin:
Edit: Actually, she needs a quad! Cause jumping a quad allows her to jump that amount of triple-triples and score a lot of points with them.
 
Joined
Dec 9, 2017
Also, this leaves just one quad to be mastered by ladies. Who would have thought lets say 2 years ago?

What do you mean? There's the 4F, and the 4Lo, right? Has someone done either even in practice? (I am leaving out the 4A, of course)
 

Shayuki

Record Breaker
Joined
Nov 2, 2013
What do you mean? There's the 4F, and the 4Lo, right? Has someone done either even in practice? (I am leaving out the 4A, of course)
I don't think so. I believe that Trusova has a good chance of getting a 4F, though. Her Flip is quite strong.

The 4Lo I just don't believe in. I think it's the most difficult quad. Mostly because it's tougher to gain height on a Loop than a Flip / Lutz.
 
Joined
Dec 9, 2017
Well, most likely there will be new article on isu.org soon about last jgp event - which usually is doubled as new topic with the same title here. And maybe they put her achievement in the title as well.. I hope? Anyway I was dissapointed with lack of interest to this feat here - whether not creating new topic is justified for now or not.

Oh, well. :shrug:
 

neusw

On the Ice
Joined
Oct 2, 2013
I don't think so. I believe that Trusova has a good chance of getting a 4F, though. Her Flip is quite strong.

The 4Lo I just don't believe in. I think it's the most difficult quad. Mostly because it's tougher to gain height on a Loop than a Flip / Lutz.

Based on the height she's getting on the 3F this season, I'd speculate that's she's already working on the 4F. I don't see any lady doing a 4Lo either. I can't think of anyone whose best/highest jump is the loop. The cross-legged takeoff is so awkward that inevitably you'd have a stronger salchow than loop if your preference is edge jumps.
 

moriel

Record Breaker
Joined
Mar 18, 2015
It makes one wonder why we need men's figure skating at all. ;)

Im fine with men, because we have guys like Hanyu and Nathan and Boyang.
But i think the next ISU congress should think about raising the ladies PCs multiplier to 2, same as men. It is a shady project, you see, it looks like it would benefit the ladies without quads, right? So to balance it out, artistry vs tech, they should also allow quads in SP. Then they find out that actually BOTH things benefit Eteri girls, and we will have ladies scoring over 300 <3
 

tofuetoffee

Rinkside
Joined
Jun 12, 2017
Im fine with men, because we have guys like Hanyu and Nathan and Boyang.
But i think the next ISU congress should think about raising the ladies PCs multiplier to 2, same as men. It is a shady project, you see, it looks like it would benefit the ladies without quads, right? So to balance it out, artistry vs tech, they should also allow quads in SP. Then they find out that actually BOTH things benefit Eteri girls, and we will have ladies scoring over 300 <3

I feel like ladies have to land quads in the senior field first. Can't imagine ISU making changes in PCS factoring for only a handful of ladies in juniors, when ISU didn't make PCS factoring changes for a handful of men in seniors?

So many fans are not giving the men credit because the Russian girls and their quads are the newest thing on the block.

On the men's side, some of the top men (notably Nathan with 6 quads in 2018 and Yuzu even with 4 quads in 2017) are also causing a huge gap in TES and PCS and there have been discussion about artistry vs tech. This has been going on for a season or two already despite men's PCS factor being higher than in ladies, and yet despite fans calling to raise PCS on the men's side to catch up, they instead decided to LIMIT quads for men. LOL



(The quads in ladies SP makes too much sense for the benefit and future of figure skating for ISU to process, doesn't matter which skater or team it benefits.)
 

moriel

Record Breaker
Joined
Mar 18, 2015
I feel like ladies have to land quads in the senior field first. Can't imagine ISU making changes in PCS factoring for only a handful of ladies in juniors, when ISU didn't make PCS factoring changes for a handful of men in seniors?

So many fans are not giving the men credit because the Russian girls and their quads are the newest thing on the block.

On the men's side, some of the top men (notably Nathan with 6 quads in 2018 and Yuzu even with 4 quads in 2017) are also causing a huge gap in TES and PCS and there have been discussion about artistry vs tech. This has been going on for a season or two already despite men's PCS factor being higher than in ladies, and yet despite fans calling to raise PCS on the men's side to catch up, they instead decided to LIMIT quads for men. LOL



(The quads in ladies SP makes too much sense for the benefit and future of figure skating for ISU to process, doesn't matter which skater or team it benefits.)

well, isu wanted to change the age limit literally because of 2-3 girls ^^
 

cohen-esque

Final Flight
Joined
Jan 27, 2014
In regards to the ISU and PCS factoring, look at what they did to Ice Dance this season. And remember their comments about the Men’s field? “The TES and PCS are unbalanced, lowering the time and removing one jump will help correct it, blah blah blah...” when they could have just bumped the PCS factor.

They just seem weirdly resistant to touching the PCS factor.
 

tofuetoffee

Rinkside
Joined
Jun 12, 2017
well, isu wanted to change the age limit literally because of 2-3 girls ^^

Like how they limited quads because of a few men instead of changing PCS, I predict them going to limit quads because of the few junior girls instead of changing PCS as well. (And this probably just means no quads in SP - since that's already a type of limit on quads.)

Maybe Sasha and the Eteri team should actually be careful about her quads? They already pulled the rug from under Alina with backloading. They probably wouldn't mind pulling the card from a junior as well. << Not really serious about this, just throwing it out there.

Waiting to be proven wrong by ISU in the future though.
 

CanadianSkaterGuy

Record Breaker
Joined
Jan 25, 2013
Based on the height she's getting on the 3F this season, I'd speculate that's she's already working on the 4F. I don't see any lady doing a 4Lo either. I can't think of anyone whose best/highest jump is the loop. The cross-legged takeoff is so awkward that inevitably you'd have a stronger salchow than loop if your preference is edge jumps.

I think a 4L is possible in ladies - there are a lot of ladies with high rotational speed especially up and comers. While there isn't assistance from a picking vault, the loop is considered the easier quad than the flip or lutz because the skater can achieve the backspin position easier (it essentially starts in a backspin position). Of course a skater needs a strong springing leg to get the height needed for a quad loop (or strong 3L).

Trusova's 3L is pretty effortless (and a few others have solid XX-3L combos) so I wouldn't be surprised if she goes for the 4L. Certainly other skaters might be inspired by Trusova landing the hardest quad and then trying to check off the other remaining ones.
 

colormyworld240

Medalist
Joined
Dec 9, 2017
This is off topic, but has Sasha ever fallen on a triple in international competition? I do not recall a time she did over two seasons. That's an accomplishment. Perhaps triples are to her are becoming what doubles are to all other female skaters.
 

NymphyNymphy

On the Ice
Joined
Aug 26, 2017
Like how they limited quads because of a few men instead of changing PCS, I predict them going to limit quads because of the few junior girls instead of changing PCS as well. (And this probably just means no quads in SP - since that's already a type of limit on quads.)

Maybe Sasha and the Eteri team should actually be careful about her quads? They already pulled the rug from under Alina with backloading. They probably wouldn't mind pulling the card from a junior as well. << Not really serious about this, just throwing it out there.

Waiting to be proven wrong by ISU in the future though.

If ISU decides to implement mandatory slow motion viewing of the take-offs... You will be seeing a wall of downgrades from all the ladies and many of the men.
 

Sam-Skwantch

“I solemnly swear I’m up to no good”
Record Breaker
Joined
Dec 29, 2013
Country
United-States
If ISU decides to implement mandatory slow motion viewing of the take-offs... You will be seeing a wall of downgrades from all the ladies and many of the men.

That would be the worst possible thing ever. The fans would tune out so quick if the ISU overfocused on such things. They are already walking a thin line that is starting to turn people off over Tech Panels being ridiculous about rotations. Let those always grumpy internet people deal with it on their blogs.
 

tofuetoffee

Rinkside
Joined
Jun 12, 2017
Honestly? I would prefer this if everyone gets called evenly. Makes not just wins but accomplishments and skills much more meaningful. It won't happen.

XYZ people will argue such harsh scoring will cause skaters to backpedal and slow the quad/TES revolution. XYZ people just don't want it for whatever reason (like it'll take away the entertaining factor for whatever reason). XYZ people are against harsh scoring in general because it won't be implemented across the board for all skaters. (In the present, how many times already during a skate have we seen an obviously questionable jump be marked for review, we see the slow motion on our own screen after, and it not get called for what it was? For flutz, lips, URs, too much PR, etc.) [Insert your reason here.]
 

Sam-Skwantch

“I solemnly swear I’m up to no good”
Record Breaker
Joined
Dec 29, 2013
Country
United-States
Honestly? I would prefer this if everyone gets called evenly. Makes not just wins but accomplishments and skills much more meaningful. It won't happen.

XYZ people will argue such harsh scoring will cause skaters to backpedal and slow the quad/TES revolution. XYZ people just don't want it for whatever reason (like it'll take away the entertaining factor for whatever reason). XYZ people are against harsh scoring in general because it won't be implemented across the board for all skaters. (In the present, how many times already during a skate have we seen an obviously questionable jump be marked for review, we see the slow motion on our own screen after, and it not get called for what it was? For flutz, lips, URs, too much PR, etc.) [Insert your reason here.]

I enjoy watching people get all worked up over flutz and stuff like that. It’s always entertaining. I still think they over punish them so I actually root for more lenient tech panels.
 
Top