2017-18 State of Japanese Ladies skating | Page 2 | Golden Skate

2017-18 State of Japanese Ladies skating

Li'Kitsu

Record Breaker
Joined
Dec 29, 2011
I think Hamada's students all have very small jumps. Even Rika Hihira. I just don't think it's coincident. Thought maybe Yamada/Higuchi can work on their jump height, While Hamada can help Yamada's students artistry and musicality.

So are Yamada/Higuchis jump height training methods - whatever they may be - sexist that they just don't work for Shoma? :rolleye:

And Rika Kihira doesn't have "very small jumps". Yuna Shiraiwa doesn't either.
 

yume

🍉
Record Breaker
Joined
Mar 11, 2016
I don't understand why people were surprised by Mako's performances. The girl has good jumps and is consistent. She had already scored 65+ anď 120+ Internationally.
 

russianfan

Match Penalty
Joined
Feb 4, 2017
I don't understand why people were surprised by Mako's performances. The girl has good jumps and is consistent. She had already scored 65+ anď 120+ Internationally.

and also judging by that statistics from russian guy she has the biggest height on her jumps among all juniors
 

Bluediamonds09

Medalist
Joined
Sep 8, 2016
So it’s just Satoko and Wakaba representing Japan next week? And all the big names will be there, no one has pulled out?
 

yume

🍉
Record Breaker
Joined
Mar 11, 2016
I just can't see beating the russian girls unless Japan makes a drastic change.

Eteri's girls, not russians. All o ther russians are beatables. It's Eteri's girls who are difficult to beat. They are the ones who won all major titles these past 3 seasons. At this rate is not Russia but Eteria.
 

Grin

Medalist
Joined
May 17, 2017
Eteri's girls, not russians. All o ther russians are beatables. It's Eteri's girls who are difficult to beat. They are the ones who won all major titles these past 3 seasons. At this rate is not Russia but Eteria.

Actually, Panova's junior ladies are also tough cookies who are fighting hard with Eteri grils to get GP spots and qualify to next senior nationals. They left Panenkova out of senior nationals recently :sad21:
You will probably see some of them next season if you follow JGP events. I have no doubts that Japanese ladies can compete with Panova's girls, but it won't be easy
 

charlotte14

Medalist
Joined
Aug 16, 2017
It's time for the Japanese Federation to make one ice rink the national training center and bring in all the talented young girls from all over Japan to train together all year long, like Russians. Have Machiko Yamada and Mihoko Higuchi in charge of the Jump(height only), Tsuzuki in charge of jump technique, and have Mie Hamada in charge of overall packaging and Nobuo Sato in charge of skating skills.
I just can't see beating the russian girls unless Japan makes a drastic change.
Drastic change is to have more domestic competitions like Russia. And change the packages for their girls.
 

Ballade88

On the Ice
Joined
Apr 19, 2017
Eh, so what? That's not a reasoning - a good part about jump height is natural predisposition, so congrats for team Yamada/Machiko for getting the right talents. That has nothing to do with what they are teaching though, if you look at the bad technique they have. And the other part that helps getting good height on your jumps is.... good technique... how do you think you train jump height?

Yea I agree... why would you send a skater to a coach just to get jump height and another one for the technique. :confused: It will just confuse the skater. Yamada is a very old-school coach but she seems to be a pretty good talent spotter. I also agree that her skaters having big jumps may have little to do with her actual coaching and more because the talented jumpers sought her out as a coach, because she was after all Midori Ito's coach. As for Hamada's students, only Satoko has really small jumps and that has more to do with her physique. Marin has average height jumps and Rika's jumps are pretty good in height. Japan not beating Russia in the ladies field has nothing to do with their training. There is not much you can do if a skater lands two quads and a system heavily rewards technical elements over artistic qualities.
 

Grin

Medalist
Joined
May 17, 2017
Yea I agree... why would you send a skater to a coach just to get jump height and another one for the technique. :confused: It will just confuse the skater. Yamada is a very old-school coach but she seems to be a pretty good talent spotter. I also agree that her skaters having big jumps may have little to do with her actual coaching and more because the talented jumpers sought her out as a coach, because she was after all Midori Ito's coach. As for Hamada's students, only Satoko has really small jumps and that has more to do with her physique. Marin has average height jumps and Rika's jumps are pretty good in height. Japan not beating Russia in the ladies field has nothing to do with their training. There is not much you can do if a skater lands two quads and a system heavily rewards technical elements over artistic qualities.
But if the system revards artistic qualities over technical elements, another Eteri's girl will prevail.
I think first of all Japanese ladies should improve consistency. Rika could have a medal at jwc, she has all the goods
 

Shayuki

Record Breaker
Joined
Nov 2, 2013
But if the system revards artistic qualities over technical elements, another Eteri's girl will prevail.
I think first of all Japanese ladies should improve consistency. Rika could have a medal at jwc, she has all the goods
To me, the big thing is how good of a competitor the skater is. Take Wakaba Higuchi - great potential but often fails to deliver under pressure. How about Rika Kihira - Even higher potential but struggles a ton with consistency. When the stakes are the highest, that's when she's very likely going to have a meltdown. The Russian skaters for example seem to really deliver when the pressure is on, Trusova being an extreme example. She doesn't land a clean quad all season, then during the most important competition of her season lands two. For Rika it's the exact opposite effect.

The only one without this issue seems to be Satoko.

My solution to this isn't really a coaching change or anything, it'd just be having more competition experience from an early age. The current crop of Russian skaters have been competing in all sorts of competitions from a very early age and I don't think there's any other way to get used to the pressure than constant exposure to it - Except in the very special cases where a skater naturally thrives under pressure. But those sorts of people are very rare.

Still, I really hope that especially Rika can do some soul searching and reach an answer to her struggles because she'd be much too great a talent to waste on nerve issues.
 

Grin

Medalist
Joined
May 17, 2017
To me, the big thing is how good of a competitor the skater is. Take Wakaba Higuchi - great potential but often fails to deliver under pressure. How about Rika Kihira - Even higher potential but struggles a ton with consistency. When the stakes are the highest, that's when she's very likely going to have a meltdown. The Russian skaters for example seem to really deliver when the pressure is on, Trusova being an extreme example. She doesn't land a clean quad all season, then during the most important competition of her season lands two. For Rika it's the exact opposite effect.

The only one without this issue seems to be Satoko.

Satoko should hold lessons to team Yamada then
 

hippomoomin

Record Breaker
Joined
Oct 30, 2012
Not sure what's going on with Rika. Isn't this her 3rd junior season? I think her first junior season was the best, and she has not improved that much since then, except for the 3A.

I also think her coach tries to package her the way as Marin Honda, or Mia, which is a bad strategy. Her style did not look like anyone in her first season, but now her movements just remind me of Marin, and they don't have the same choreographer.

Also they way she approached her 3A: it didn't look like she was going for it; it looked like she was planning to skate a 1A. Her other jumps also looked sketchy, I don't think nerve can explain all of this.

Also Marin seems to be struggling with her jumps lately, which is quite worrisome. She is not a power jumper like Wakaba; she is not as tiny as Satoko. I think she needs to improve her techniques to survive puberty. But even with that, her BV was not very good in her best days. I was one of the many "predicting" she would be the #1 Japanese lady this season but it has been the opposite.
 

yume

🍉
Record Breaker
Joined
Mar 11, 2016
Not sure what's going on with Rika. Isn't this her 3rd junior season?

2nd.

For current seniors they have just to find a way to increase GOEs and PCS. And i'm not sure that tanos/rippons and consistency is enough in their case.
 

FCSSp4

Rinkside
Joined
Aug 10, 2017
isn't rika's ring finger fractured? she had a cast on it or something. don't know much about skating but maybe that was bothering her? i also thought it was weird that she was doing 3lz3t in warm up but anyway she says she wants to stabilize her 3A and add a quad so i think there's something good to be gained out of a bad outing. she can fully rotate 4S and her 4T isn't so bad. 3A in SP and 4S 3A 3A3T in FS would be cool and can get big points. she's already a very complete skater.
 

ReasonOFF

On the Ice
Joined
Oct 5, 2017
what happened with the thread? they just delete the whole previous thread??? just like that?? lol
 

yume

🍉
Record Breaker
Joined
Mar 11, 2016
Next week, Coupe du printemps with Mai, Kaori and Yuna. Hope a good end of season for everyone.
 

yume

🍉
Record Breaker
Joined
Mar 11, 2016
Maybe admins thought that there should be a russian domination on the forum too :sarcasm:
 
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