2018-19 U.S. Ladies' figure skating | Page 211 | Golden Skate

2018-19 U.S. Ladies' figure skating

tosca

On the Ice
Joined
Aug 28, 2017
You're comparing Mirai, a veteran of US skating, to Bradie, a newbie in her first major international event.

As the senior member of the US team, Mirai should have been a standout in all phases of the Olympics, but she turned in her best performance right off the bat at the team event and then phoned it in her performances in the individual segments.

As the most junior member of the team, Bradie skated well in the team event, and did better than Mirai and Karen in the individual FS event.

She was 0.14 points behind Karen in her FS. I don’t think she “phoned it in”. I wish I had links to her interviews in the media zone post SP - she was crying uncontrollably saying how she felt she “let [her] country down”. I am sure everyone has their own perception of the matter but anyone that upset surely did not go through the motions.
 
Joined
Jun 21, 2003
As the senior member of the US team, Mirai should have been a standout in all phases of the Olympics, ...

I don't get what this discussion is all about. Nathan Chen "should have" skated better in the short program. But he didn't. (?) Stuff happens.
 
Joined
Jun 21, 2003
Why was she mad? She was not good that year. One competition doesn’t send you to the Olympics. But enough on the subject.

Mirai and her supporters were mad in 2014, or at least disappointed, because those were the years when the USFSA was gradually moving from "Nationals placement is everything" to "Entire season (or two) results." For better or for worse, past Olympic and World teams pretty much just went down the list of placement at Nationals, except for the occasional "dominant athlete who couldn't compete at Nationals because of injury," like Michelle Kwan in 2006.

So when Mirai grabbed third place, she had every reason to hope momentarily that she had snatched victory from the jaws of an otherwise disappointing season. It didn't work out that way. Instead the USFSA actually applied its new formula (as they had been threatening to do for the previous couple of years) for choosing teams based on last year's worlds, 4 continents, grand prix, etc., and Mirai was out of luck. (Even Polina Edmunds got credit for making the junior grand prix final, as I recall) It was a fair decision given the selection rules. But it still stung.

(But enough on the subject. :) :yes: )
 
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labgoat

I have no words
Record Breaker
Joined
Jan 3, 2007
Country
United-States
I don't get what this discussion is all about. Nathan Chen "should have" skated better in the short program. But he didn't. (?) Stuff happens.

I agree, ice is slippery. The risk is part of the appeal of the sport. Chances can slip away in an instant creating opportunities for others. Even the best slip sometimes. There is a who's who list of skaters who had stuff happen including Kurt Browning, Mao Asada, Brian Boitano, Julia Lipnitskaya.
 

frida80

Record Breaker
Joined
Feb 13, 2014
I agree, ice is slippery. The risk is part of the appeal of the sport. Chances can slip away in an instant creating opportunities for others. Even the best slip sometimes. There is a who's who list of skaters who had stuff happen including Kurt Browning, Mao Asada, Brian Boitano, Julia Lipnitskaya.

Exactly. I have no idea why so many people are coming down on her when the sometimes things just don't work out. I guess it's a lot easier to be judgemental when you've never been put in that position.
 

rnois13

On the Ice
Joined
Oct 4, 2017
I always watch Google's Year In Search every new year, I cried when I saw Mirai. She also made Vox 2018 Look Back. She's made her mark.
 

bobbob

Medalist
Joined
Feb 7, 2014
You're comparing Mirai, a veteran of US skating, to Bradie, a newbie in her first major international event.

As the senior member of the US team, Mirai should have been a standout in all phases of the Olympics, but she turned in her best performance right off the bat at the team event and then phoned it in her performances in the individual segments.

As the most junior member of the team, Bradie skated well in the team event, and did better than Mirai and Karen in the individual FS event.

Prior to the Olympics, you very clearly said Mirai was the least likely of the US ladies to succeed. Now you are saying that she was expected to be a standout. Huh?

None of the three US ladies skated very well. I personally think Ashley would have been easily able to outscore Mirai and Karen in the individual event. But Mirai's moment in the team event was definitely a standout on a sentimental and historical level (though competition wise it wasn't particularly important).
 

frida80

Record Breaker
Joined
Feb 13, 2014
Prior to the Olympics, you very clearly said Mirai was the least likely of the US ladies to succeed. Now you are saying that she was expected to be a standout. Huh?

None of the three US ladies skated very well. I personally think Ashley would have been easily able to outscore Mirai and Karen in the individual event. But Mirai's moment in the team event was definitely a standout on a sentimental and historical level (though competition wise it wasn't particularly important).

This poster has had a bone to pick with Mirai for years. It’s why I don’t take most of criticism seriously. It’s from her detractors that have existed long before the Olympics.

As for Ashley, I have a lot of doubts that she’s score higher than any of the ladies because she was set on debuting a new SP. historically Ashley doesn’t do well in SPs, she’s a FS girl. Plus her Loop and combo where getting called everytime. I do think she would’ve had a fantastic FS. But it would’ve been better if it was MR and not La La Land. MR brings out the fighter in her.

It also would’ve taken the pressure off of Mirai and Bradie. Instead, there would’ve been a mini rivalry going on, which is easier for athletes than trying to meet unrealistic expectations from an entire nation.
 

kwanatic

Check out my YT channel, Bare Ice!
Record Breaker
Joined
May 19, 2011
Rachel Flatt and Tom Z got lots of negative publicity when Rachel skated at Worlds with an undisclosed injury. Now we find out Mirai went to the Olympics with an undisclosed serious injury.

Aaahh...Tibia-Gate. I remember it well.:biggrin:

Flatt's injury caused such a firestorm for a few reasons. Her performances were unusually poor and she blamed her it on a stress fracture after the fact. No one outside of Rachael and Tom Z knew she was injured at that time. They disclosed it to the media after the competition. This was back when the US had been down to 2 spots at worlds since 2009 and fans were desperate for that 3rd spot. That season Alissa Czisny had found her stride, won the GPF and backed it up with a convincing win at nationals. Rachael skated decently and placed 2nd. With Alissa's stronger skating and Rachael likely to deliver everyone expected they would regain that 3rd spot.

Alissa skated decently and placed 5th; Rachael bombed and ended up 12th. People were disappointed in Rachael's performances but it turned into anger when she revealed she was in pain due to a stress fracture that she'd learned about prior to worlds. Most felt that Mirai could have/should have been called in as the alternate if Rachael was injured to the point it affected her that badly. It was fueled by the fact that Mirai had just beaten both Alissa and Rachael at 4CC and placed 3rd. The speculation was that even if she didn't repeat the brilliance of 4CC, Mirai's skating had been trending upward all season long and she could have managed a stronger performance than what Rachael delivered. No one knows for sure if she would have but based on the way she'd been skating, there was a good chance she'd at least have placed higher than Rachael.

Skaters compete injured all the time. Mirai is a good case of that with what she competed through in Pyeongchang. Judging from her great performances at nationals, her historic clean 8 triple program in the team event, and even her strong effort at worlds that year, the injury wasn't affecting her to the point she couldn't perform well. Rachael OTOH was clearly hampered by her injury in 2011 and it affected her performance (she said as much). For that reason she gets a lot of flack from fans about that. Interestingly enough I remember that following year Alissa competed injured and placed very badly at worlds (22nd). The main difference in that case was Alissa was not aware she was injured at the time. She found out she had a torn labrum in her hip several months later and said she would not have competed if she'd known she was injured.

Knowing you're injured to the point it could hurt your performance and not disclosing it versus knowing you're injured but can still perform versus not even knowing you're injured.
 

evasorange

Final Flight
Joined
Jan 22, 2015
This poster has had a bone to pick with Mirai for years. It’s why I don’t take most of criticism seriously. It’s from her detractors that have existed long before the Olympics.

As for Ashley, I have a lot of doubts that she’s score higher than any of the ladies because she was set on debuting a new SP. historically Ashley doesn’t do well in SPs, she’s a FS girl. Plus her Loop and combo where getting called everytime. I do think she would’ve had a fantastic FS. But it would’ve been better if it was MR and not La La Land. MR brings out the fighter in her.

It also would’ve taken the pressure off of Mirai and Bradie. Instead, there would’ve been a mini rivalry going on, which is easier for athletes than trying to meet unrealistic expectations from an entire nation.

Ashley only ever made one off the hand remark about a new sp, after the sp at nationals in an interview where she said “maybe work on a new short” she never had mentioned it once before or after that season. I think it was said in a moment of panic and if she had made the team, I have no doubt that she would have stuck with hip hip
 

chuckm

Record Breaker
Joined
Aug 31, 2003
Country
United-States
Before Alissa Czisny placed 22nd at Worlds 2012, there were signs earlier that year that something was not right with her. She had made it to the GPF, but her skate at the GPF was unusually poor (she had won the GPF the year before).

She fell on the lutz in the SP, but her FS was a complete disaster: 3z<, 3t↓, 2a<-so, 3z<+2t, 2a↓, 3lo-saved, 3lo<-low. Alissa finished last.

A few weeks later, she was able to perform well at US Nationals (silver). But her Worlds performance was an echo of the GPF, only worse.
 

StitchMonkey

Record Breaker
Joined
Jul 31, 2014
Aaahh...Tibia-Gate. I remember it well.:biggrin:

Flatt's injury caused such a firestorm for a few reasons. Her performances were unusually poor and she blamed her it on a stress fracture after the fact. No one outside of Rachael and Tom Z knew she was injured at that time. They disclosed it to the media after the competition.

I seem to recall that TomZ maintains that they did tell USFS and that he felt they were informed.

So who knows really who knew what and when they knew it. I suspect USFS knew somethings but were not told other things.
 

sheetz

Record Breaker
Joined
Jan 10, 2015
Media calls are now being conducted ahead of Nationals.

According to Lynn Rutherford, Bradie "says she's feeling good heading into the U.S. Championships, with no major changes to training or programs: 'I'm really just cranking away on my programs & the daily grind.' Elements will be same as Golden Spin: triple Lutz-triple loop in FS only"

https://twitter.com/LynnRutherford/status/1082734256386920448
 

drivingmissdaisy

Record Breaker
Joined
Feb 17, 2010
Media calls are now being conducted ahead of Nationals.

According to Lynn Rutherford, Bradie "says she's feeling good heading into the U.S. Championships, with no major changes to training or programs: 'I'm really just cranking away on my programs & the daily grind.' Elements will be same as Golden Spin: triple Lutz-triple loop in FS only"

https://twitter.com/LynnRutherford/status/1082734256386920448

Good news! It's too much risk for the SP.
 

kwanatic

Check out my YT channel, Bare Ice!
Record Breaker
Joined
May 19, 2011
Media calls are now being conducted ahead of Nationals.

According to Lynn Rutherford, Bradie "says she's feeling good heading into the U.S. Championships, with no major changes to training or programs: 'I'm really just cranking away on my programs & the daily grind.' Elements will be same as Golden Spin: triple Lutz-triple loop in FS only"

https://twitter.com/LynnRutherford/status/1082734256386920448

Very smart. The 3Lz-3T is a much more stable combo for her. In terms of the Bradie vs. Mariah battle, Bradie definitely has the technical advantage in the SP simply b/c she's more consistent there. Mariah's SP is much better overall than Bradie's IMO but she struggles to get that 3Lz-3T landed cleanly.

I really want to see everyone go out and throw down cleanly a la Russian nationals. SO many of their skaters are capable of hitting all of their content and it makes the competition much more interesting. I hope we get a good competition like that this year.
 

jenaj

Record Breaker
Joined
Aug 17, 2003
Country
United-States
This poster has had a bone to pick with Mirai for years. It’s why I don’t take most of criticism seriously. It’s from her detractors that have existed long before the Olympics.

As for Ashley, I have a lot of doubts that she’s score higher than any of the ladies because she was set on debuting a new SP. historically Ashley doesn’t do well in SPs, she’s a FS girl. Plus her Loop and combo where getting called everytime. I do think she would’ve had a fantastic FS. But it would’ve been better if it was MR and not La La Land. MR brings out the fighter in her.

It also would’ve taken the pressure off of Mirai and Bradie. Instead, there would’ve been a mini rivalry going on, which is easier for athletes than trying to meet unrealistic expectations from an entire nation.

Agree. Thank goodness for the Ignore list. (But sometimes the ignored post shows up in a reply.)
 
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