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Thread: Pairs skating

  1. #61
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    Quote Originally Posted by MGstyle View Post
    To me the main reason is the lack of marketing from the media, the PR department of ISU, or whatever the source that help generate the public attention.
    I don't think the ISU does much marketing, it's the individual federations. Other than that, agree.

    The US is in a kind of negative feedback: their pairs don't win as much as singles, so don't get as much publicity, so don't attract as many skaters, so don't win as much, so don't... The same seems to be true in Japan. In Canada, all the disciplines are more equal both in terms of publicity and success.

    I would expect the popularity of pairs in the US to increase if they have more success, but has that happened for ice dance? Maybe it takes a long time for the popularity to come? Or maybe it would work better for pairs because it is more similar to singles, with its big tricks.

    Not having any pairs in Stars on Ice is certainly not helping pairs in the US.

  2. #62
    Gazing at a Glorious Great Lakes sunset skylark's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Alifyre View Post
    tend to have more breathing room for performance.
    The reason I'm so over the moon about Savchenko and Massot is that I connect with them emotionally because they connect with each other and with their music emotionally. I don't think performance qualities are about time for breathing room, as much as paying exquisite attention to small details that make such a difference emotionally to the audience, to the quality of the performance. Some details I notice are hand and finger placement; and especially eyes ... notice how they look at each other and how much emotional harmony is communicated by those looks.

    There's also the thing that's huge for me ... they are both listening to the music and creating their movement in relationship to it, and to each other. This sort of emotional commitment and harmony is what first attracted me to pairs, with G&G. It reaches another pinnacle with Aljona and Bruno. It's also interesting that during their triple-double-double, you can see Bruno watching Aljona, to make sure they're together in their timing. It's just all so delicate and delicious.





    Quote Originally Posted by GrandmaCC View Post
    Another thing, although it is obviously their aim to make their difficult moves look easy, for a viewer, some of the hardest moves can simply look cool or pretty.
    That's exactly why technical excellence isn't enough in pairs skating.... All of figure skating, IMO, needs emotional resonance to elevate it to something more than a display of strength and technique. Excellent technique is only the starting point for an excellent pair.



    Quote Originally Posted by chapis View Post
    My point was they are not in the tour and people are angry about it, and I don´t understand it, because they are not a great pair. .
    Because people want to see a pair at SOI. It's a good way to impress and pull in people who aren't already fs fans. I personally think SOI ought to have 2 pairs as part of the tour. I'd be as happy to see Ashley Cain and Timothy LeDuc as Alexa/Chris .... because Ashley and Tim have such unusual qualities as a pair, with their lines, their height, their jumping ability, and the sheer momentum they create, with their joy in performance and attention to it.

    Deanna/Nate, Tarah/Danny, Haven/Brandon would also be welcome additions. My enjoyment has NOTHING to do with their international placement or results.

  3. #63
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    I don't care if Americans are not any good at it. That is not why I watch anyway. I loved pairs since I started watching fs. Some pair teams are special like G&G and Sui/Han are one of those pairs. I have loved their programs except for last season's LP.

  4. #64
    Bona Fide Member LRK's Avatar
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    Well, speaking as a non-American - there are American pairs I enjoy; of course, as with any other pair (or any skater in fact) their nationality doesn't matter to me, other than I love to see the pairs discipline be developed and thrive in many countries, and I'd love for US pairs to do well, and what's more, get more appreciation. Two of my favourite performances by American pairs:

    Scimeca/Knierim
    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hn_u9RL4Mgk

    Denney/Frazier
    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SqKOiA3mU4g

  5. #65
    NIKU - NIKU - NIKU Arriba627's Avatar
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    ^^^I can't help but feel a twinge of sadness when I see this Denney / Frazier video. It's just such a shame about her injury. They showed so much promise, and (unlike many U.S. pairs) have been together since forever! I remember they did a Lion King program at Sk Amer 2014, and it was so well-received by the audience. They even took the silver medal...I hope they can get back to where they are comfortable with their jumps and Haven's landings on the throws.

  6. #66
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    New pairs fan here! The following is just my personal experience; I think pairs is easy to appreciate if you just take some time to watch it because the twists and throws are amazing and can't be seen anywhere else, and because the addition of one more person to the mix opens up so many exquisite artistic possibilities. Now that I've started to follow it, I find I need a couple minutes of mental readjustment when I go back to watching singles after pairs because the ice feels like it's missing something..

    However if you really want to go deep into it, it gets a little harder because there's not as much information out there (in English). I was trying to do a crash-course in pairs right before the Olympics because I'd managed to get tickets to the pairs SP. I didn't even know the names of any of the top pairs, that's how unfamiliar I was, so I started by looking for media reports about recent competitions and found that most of them focused on singles. A typical media report about a FS competition would usually start with introducing the men's and ladies' medalists, describe a bit about the how the singles competitions unfolded, and then at the very bottom of the story they would mention the names of the pairs winners with almost no details about _how_ they won. What about profiles that focus on a single athlete (or both of them)? I always found that type of story to be interesting. However, not much luck here either.

    Since the media wasn't helping me much and I wasn't able to sit through hours of competition videos on Youtube, I found this forum and took the plunge (I normally stay away from online forums even on topics that I'm interested in because I can't stand seeing all the flame wars.. though I am currently enjoying a bit of a honeymoon with Golden Skate!). Wow here was the treasure trove of information I was looking for. However, I found that even the forum was a bit hard to get into because everyone called the athletes by just their initials!! like S/M, V/T... for someone who didn't know a single name this was actually a big hurdle at first. Singles skaters are referred to by their names or nicknames and so the name of an entirely new skater will stick to the mind fairly quickly; also you can often guess the nationality of a skater by their name. Initials don't tell you anything and are harder to keep straight in your mind.

    So I waded through that alphabet soup with the thought that I'd spent good money on those Olympic tickets and was determined to get the most out of them! Finally I felt myself getting familiar with it, the initials no longer sent me off to another page every time to check names, and yes I enjoyed watching the Olympics. Was it worth it? Absolutely. But to answer the question in the OP, why does pairs skating seem less popular, I would say that based on my own experience there's just less information out there (in English at least) that's presented in an interesting and approachable fashion. (As for the question, but why is that so? I agree with the other posters here that the biggest reason is probably that the English-speaking countries aren't strong in this discipline)

  7. #67
    Bona Fide Member LRK's Avatar
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    Thanks, Pchykeen - that was a truly illuminating post; I'm so glad you stuck with it and persevered, and I hope you will be rewarded by lots of great pairs skating in the future.

  8. #68
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    Quote Originally Posted by perspicuosity View Post
    Speaking of terrifying pairs falls: here's Morozov dropping Tarasova about 8 feet: https://youtu.be/Y9p1gUU7olw?t=4m33s (She was fine! I have no idea how.)
    The fall is terrible. And one more thing.

  9. #69
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    Quote Originally Posted by Pchykeen View Post
    New pairs fan here! The following is just my personal experience; I think pairs is easy to appreciate if you just take some time to watch it because the twists and throws are amazing and can't be seen anywhere else, and because the addition of one more person to the mix opens up so many exquisite artistic possibilities. Now that I've started to follow it, I find I need a couple minutes of mental readjustment when I go back to watching singles after pairs because the ice feels like it's missing something..

    However if you really want to go deep into it, it gets a little harder because there's not as much information out there (in English). I was trying to do a crash-course in pairs right before the Olympics because I'd managed to get tickets to the pairs SP. I didn't even know the names of any of the top pairs, that's how unfamiliar I was, so I started by looking for media reports about recent competitions and found that most of them focused on singles. A typical media report about a FS competition would usually start with introducing the men's and ladies' medalists, describe a bit about the how the singles competitions unfolded, and then at the very bottom of the story they would mention the names of the pairs winners with almost no details about _how_ they won. What about profiles that focus on a single athlete (or both of them)? I always found that type of story to be interesting. However, not much luck here either.

    Since the media wasn't helping me much and I wasn't able to sit through hours of competition videos on Youtube, I found this forum and took the plunge (I normally stay away from online forums even on topics that I'm interested in because I can't stand seeing all the flame wars.. though I am currently enjoying a bit of a honeymoon with Golden Skate!). Wow here was the treasure trove of information I was looking for. However, I found that even the forum was a bit hard to get into because everyone called the athletes by just their initials!! like S/M, V/T... for someone who didn't know a single name this was actually a big hurdle at first. Singles skaters are referred to by their names or nicknames and so the name of an entirely new skater will stick to the mind fairly quickly; also you can often guess the nationality of a skater by their name. Initials don't tell you anything and are harder to keep straight in your mind.

    So I waded through that alphabet soup with the thought that I'd spent good money on those Olympic tickets and was determined to get the most out of them! Finally I felt myself getting familiar with it, the initials no longer sent me off to another page every time to check names, and yes I enjoyed watching the Olympics. Was it worth it? Absolutely. But to answer the question in the OP, why does pairs skating seem less popular, I would say that based on my own experience there's just less information out there (in English at least) that's presented in an interesting and approachable fashion. (As for the question, but why is that so? I agree with the other posters here that the biggest reason is probably that the English-speaking countries aren't strong in this discipline)
    Thanks for this!

  10. #70
    Piper and Paul are made of magic dust and unicorns Lester's Avatar
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    There was an Incredibles 2 ad with Mr. Incredible and Mrs. Incredible doing some "pairs moves", and then there are movies like Cutting Edge [and its million sequels], etc so pairs are probably more in the public consciousness than ice dance.

    The reason I don't follow pairs as religiously is because with such technical difficulty now, clean performances are rare, and the obligatory falls on SBS jumps really ruin the performances. Also Russian pairs really seem washed out in the last couple of years. Like zero personality from any of the teams. On the other hand, many teams really showed up at the Olympic and Worlds, even to that extent that a good performance was not certain to qualify you for the free program, so I'd say the discipline may become more fashionable once again.

  11. #71
    Medalist LadyB's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by TryMeLater View Post
    That's the reason Nina Mozer gave for taking a break from figure skating.
    She said that the pressure of constantly worrying for her pair girls was getting to her (and even affecting her health).
    That's interesting. She never said that in her recent interviews (at least the ones that I've read). She had a major operation after Olys (and possibly even one in January, she was waiting on the date during Nationals and missed a few events after) from which she has to recover. She said she needs to look after her health until October, then she'll return to skating. Possibly rather as an adviser than as a coach. She once said that she would love to help putting in place better training facilities for youngsters across the country, so that talented children don't always have to be send off to Moscow or Petersburg.
    Not only does she worry about the girls, she was very concerned when Fedor had problems with his arm and muscles and it took so long to find out what it was before he was operated on, while he could hardly move his arm.

  12. #72
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    First of all it takes a lot of guts to be a pair skater, especially for the women. They're really putting trust in their partner that all the throws and pair moves are being done safely. Also for the men, it takes a lot of strength to do the lifts and throw jumps. I don't think pair skating has lost its popularity, we've just had a bit of a decline in the numbers of pair skaters these last few years. A lot of great pair teams have moved on. Canada is starting to rebuild its team and I heard we're increasing in our pair skaters coming out of the Novice and Jr ranks, which is good. Part of the problem with broadcasting figure skating competitions, the pairs discipline is the first to be shown on TV and more times than not we only get to see the top flight when the rest of the disciplines are shown. It's great if you can catch it on your computer, like CBC. They show all the skaters.

  13. #73
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    Quote Originally Posted by Rina Rin View Post
    The fall is terrible. And one more thing.
    OUCH! This is what scares me about pairs skating - I find I get so nervous and worried for the teams that sometimes I'm just getting stressed out watching it. I do love the discipline, but I feel the same way when I'm watching gymnastics and sometimes its more exhausting than enjoyable.

    Kudos to all the athletes who take this on though - I don't think I would have the nerves for it!

  14. #74
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    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FpN4rnzvUvg&t=3m18s

    My earliest Ingo Steuer memory.

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