Counterclockwise jumps and clockwise spins | Golden Skate

Counterclockwise jumps and clockwise spins

thesoundofice

Rinkside
Joined
May 15, 2018
Hi everyone,
I'm glad I finally decided to sign in and join this wonderful community.
I started skating when I was 5, just for fun, and I didn't learn anything serious until I was 10. Figure skating isn't that popular in Italy, so it's quite difficult to practise and learn, plus there aren't enough rinks( even here where I live:The Alps). Anyway, when I skated I had a coach. We were just 5 girls in the group, so it was like having a private coach.This allowed me to progress rapidly from basic stroking to landing a quite consistent single axel in just 3 years. Sadly, I had to quit skating for multiple reasons but I've never stopped loving it. Now I'm 30 and after having some problems with my back I tried to skate again because It makes me feel good and alive. But... I have a big problem( that I also had as a teen) and I can't find a solution.
When learning jumps, I quickly realized that I could easily jump and land in both directions. My coach suggested me to choose between clockwise or counterclockwise direction and I picked counterclockwise because I found it easier to land the axel in that direction. While I was able to handle the problem with jumps, I couldn't do the same with spins.In fact, spinning clockwise comes more natural to me. No matter how hard I try( even with a coach yelling "concentrate!" like a madman) I always end up spinning that way. I just wanted to ask if there's someone who struggles with a similar problem and how does he/she deal with it.
I'm sorry If I made some mistakes, but I'm not a native speaker.
 

Ristique

Rinkside
Joined
Mar 29, 2017
It seems like you're doing skating recreationally/as a hobby so I really don't think you need to worry about it? There have been competitive skaters in the past who spin and jump in different directions too so it isn't a problem. I see no reason why your coach should force you into doing both in the same direction. When I first started jumps & spins I did both jumps and spins in both directions. Eventually I leaned more towards clockwise for my jumps and just decided to do clockwise for my spins too because why not lol and I was also lazy to practice doing both ways hahaha.

TL;DR
Don't worry about it, just jump & spin in any direction feels good to you.
 

Sk8DSmom

Rinkside
Joined
Nov 13, 2012
Most skaters in North America are taught to jump and spin in their 'natural' direction. Some coaches will do this without the skater knowing is have them back towards the coach. Then call them, and watch which way they turn towards the coach -counterclockwise or clockwise.
My skater started waltz jumping and spinning both ways but was more natural one way.

Spin direction is important if you are looking to do double jumps because it is the backspin position you get into for air position. It makes a difference when a program is getting put together on patterns going in/out of jumps in/out of spins.

There are skaters that can do up to double axel both ways but competed as counterclockwise skaters.

If you are skating for fun, enjoyment and recreationally -don't worry, but if you are looking to do adult competitions you may want to talk to your coach about it.

Good luck!
 

thesoundofice

Rinkside
Joined
May 15, 2018
Thank you so much for your advice.. I'd really like to compete again but It's probably just a dream that won't come true. Italy is completely different from North America and as far as I know adult competitions don't exist..Maybe I could try something "amatoriale" which is something between recreational and professional figure skating. Anyway my coach didn't exactly push me to spin counterclockwise. He was strict with me and another girl because he wanted us to achieve something ..and I must say that I've always been quite rebellious and stubborn. Definetely not so easy to handle with. Years later he told me he saw a good potential in me and was disappointed when I decided to quit.
But this is the past, so I think I'll jeep skating just because I really enjoy it.
 

thesoundofice

Rinkside
Joined
May 15, 2018
Sk8DSmom, thank your for your tip. I promise I'll think about it.. Even if I know that going back to competion would mean moving to Milano ( about 3 hours drive ) where I could practise easily.. Because here figure skating isn't taken into account now. At my rink they only offer short track (Arianna Fontana,2018 Olympic gold medalist in this discipline trained here as a kid) and hockey classes.
 

vlaurend

Final Flight
Joined
Jan 14, 2008
Welcome to the forum and welcome back to the ice! If you jump CCW but spin CW, then you have a rare talent! If I had that gift, I would keep practicing spinning in both directions because spinning one direction and then stepping immediately into a spin in the other direction counts as a difficult feature in a combination spin under the current judging system!
 

Ristique

Rinkside
Joined
Mar 29, 2017
Most skaters in North America are taught to jump and spin in their 'natural' direction. Some coaches will do this without the skater knowing is have them back towards the coach. Then call them, and watch which way they turn towards the coach -counterclockwise or clockwise.
My skater started waltz jumping and spinning both ways but was more natural one way.

This is really interesting to me! It sounds a bit like what someone did to me when I first snowboarded to find out which foot I should have in front. They had us stand back towards them and shoved us and whichever foot we moved forwards first to catch ourselves was our 'dominant' foot. If I remember for me it was left because I balance better on my left.

But if I were to do what you mentioned, gliding away and stepping back towards someone behind me, I would step CW (so right foot first) to turn, which is the opposite direction! I wonder if it's weird that I still feel my left foot is the more stable but practicing CW jumps & spins made me more used to turning CW first? Hmm...
 

SmallAminal

On the Ice
Joined
Jul 26, 2016
Ristique - I'm just like you!
Also, my skater and I are both right handed, but like to jump and spin Clockwise. My skater and I also do certain things lefty, like I can only open jars with my left hand - I absolutely cannot do it with my right hand.
I also did hurdles in track during high school and jumped over with my left as the lead leg, which was apparently uncommon, especially for a right-handed person.

To the OP - I think its kind of cool that you can have both directions! I hope that you can find a suitable place to train and that you enjoy getting back into skating.
 

thesoundofice

Rinkside
Joined
May 15, 2018
Ristique and SmallAnimal: I think you might be ambidextrous as I am. It means that someone can use both hands equally. This peculiarity standed out a lot when I was a kid. I could write with both hands equally when I was at school.. It was really confusing in skating. You know, kids are big dreamer.When I watched competions on TV I noticed that the majority of figure skaters jumped CCW( thank you vlaurend for teaching me contractions)so I went to my coach crying because I thought that there was something wrong with me. He told me that I was 100% ok and supported me. Growing up I realized I wasn't alone and that there are elite skaters who jump and spin CW like Carolina Kostner, Ashley Wagner ...
Thank you guys for your replyies.
I'll take it easy for a while and continue skating as a hobby .. Then maybe I'll look around and ask if a competitive careeer is something doable for me (considering age, work schedule ..)
 

thesoundofice

Rinkside
Joined
May 15, 2018
Icebethy, I know the existance of this trophy in Val Gardena(Carolina Kostner hometown), but all this is quite recent for Italy.. Let me explain one thing..TheAlpine region of Italy is a nice place to live for nature and stunning landscapes. Anyway it is not that easy place to live in terms of logistics and possibilities .When I wrote that my country is different I meant that here is really difficult to make it in this sport.. There aren't enough facilities and most of all it is difficult to have access to rinks and expertise. Carolina, for example, had to move to Germany in her teens to continue training because an avalanche destroyed her rink. The option were Milan or Germany and she picked Germany even if Milan is just 3 or 4 drive from Ortisei. That's because reaching Germany was easier to her than reaching Milan. I don't live in Tyrol, but in another unlucky place in nothern Lombardy. Which is very beautiful indeed but offers 0 possibilities for a figure skater. In fact I trained in Switzerland..
 

Icebethy

Rinkside
Joined
May 29, 2014
Country
Wales
Icebethy, I know the existance of this trophy in Val Gardena(Carolina Kostner hometown), but all this is quite recent for Italy.. Let me explain one thing..TheAlpine region of Italy is a nice place to live for nature and stunning landscapes. Anyway it is not that easy place to live in terms of logistics and possibilities .When I wrote that my country is different I meant that here is really difficult to make it in this sport.. There aren't enough facilities and most of all it is difficult to have access to rinks and expertise. Carolina, for example, had to move to Germany in her teens to continue training because an avalanche destroyed her rink. The option were Milan or Germany and she picked Germany even if Milan is just 3 or 4 drive from Ortisei. That's because reaching Germany was easier to her than reaching Milan. I don't live in Tyrol, but in another unlucky place in nothern Lombardy. Which is very beautiful indeed but offers 0 possibilities for a figure skater. In fact I trained in Switzerland..

I get this, I was just saying there are a few adult international comps in Italy, and your facilities seem very similar to some other countries including the UK. There is a big world of adult skating that's worth trying to find, I know that there are many adult skaters from Italy, although I am not sure where all train, but I have met a lot whilst competing. Also I have met a few Swiss adult skaters also, so maybe you will be able to find something. I know Milan and Bergamo have rinks although this is a distance from Lombardy as you address. It is perhaps worth trying the adult figure skating group to see other training centers in Italy?

On the other hand I would try and spin same direction as you jump, or change jumping so you can do jump back spin to help get the harder jumps. Although I know its not easy, I learnt to spin and jump both ways, but I chose CCW over CW now I regret it!
 

thesoundofice

Rinkside
Joined
May 15, 2018
Icebethy, I didn't imagine that there were so many adult skaters here in Italy.. I'll definitely explore that world! Thank you for your advice.. I must admit that I've been apart from the "real"skating world for a long time, so I suppose I just let my ignorance write these posts .. I regret I had to quit so early, but I couldn't have done anything else. Now my life has changed so much and I don't know if I can catch up and compete again. I surely have a lot of work to do. Maybe I should start from fixing the CCW and CW problem and then take some time to clear my mind.
 

Ic3Rabbit

Former Elite, now Pro. ⛸️
Record Breaker
Joined
Jan 9, 2017
Country
Olympics
I'm ambidextrous, and can spin both ways, when I was younger and learning jumps I was able to do singles both ways but my coach made me decide going forward so I jump one way now, but can still spin both.

It's not going to be a big of a deal for you if you aren't looking to compete at a high level or anything, but you should pick one way for jumps that is the most natural and go that way from now on.

Good luck! :)
 

treesprite

Final Flight
Joined
Feb 16, 2010
I'm also ambidextrous, and initially was doing waltz jumps and two foot spins both ways. The coach made me jump alternating directions, until one side tired out before the other. The side that took longer to wear out ended up being clockwise.. After that, I learned everything clockwise. I did scratch spins both directions, but unfortunatly that was all I bothered doing both ways. Now I regret not doing spins both directions, because this messed up ankle/foot is ticking me off because of involuntary edge changes. I need a cast on my foot,

My childhood coach and my current coach, are both clockwise skaters. There are a lot of clockwise skaters at my rink, which s strange, because when I was young, there was only me, my coach, and one other person. I mentioned my surprise at the number of lefty skaters to a coach one day (wasn't my coach), and she said it is because coaches aren't as insistent that skaters skate in the same direction as the coaches.

My problem now is that I don't want to spin on my right foot anymore, but doing both forward spins and back spins on the same foot would keep me from doing a lot of combinations (I actually have a post on the other popular forum, if anyone cares to go there)
 

thesoundofice

Rinkside
Joined
May 15, 2018
I'm glad to see I'm not alone.. I've never had the occasion to meet a lefty skater, let alone ambidextrous. My coach and the girls were all right handed and CCW jumpers/spinner. Until I won't compete, I think I'll try to develop the ability to spin both ways and see what happens.
I'm curios about one thing about lefty/ambidextrous people. In Italy leftys at school and in sports were thoroughly discouraged to use their dominant hand or leg in the past( I'm talking about my mother's generation not mine) and forced to use the right hand. Is it the same in your country?
Thank you for everything, I really appreciate your help.
 

Ristique

Rinkside
Joined
Mar 29, 2017
Actually I'm not even ambidextrous though? I am completely right-handed and my left is pretty useless. The only thing I can think of that I can use my left hand reasonably well is to pick up mugs but that may be because I found it a hassle to have to let go of my mouse to take a drink when I was on the computer. The only other CW skater I know is a lefty though. Not sure what happened with me that I'm right-handed but do both CW...

I'm curios about one thing about lefty/ambidextrous people. In Italy leftys at school and in sports were thoroughly discouraged to use their dominant hand or leg in the past( I'm talking about my mother's generation not mine) and forced to use the right hand. Is it the same in your country?
Thank you for everything, I really appreciate your help.

In Malaysia we had the same. My brother is naturally left-handed but schools didn't cater to them at the time and forced all kids to write with their right hand. My brother writes with his right hand now but its very messy and he can't write at all with his left anymore either lol so that sucks. But anyway that was way back like almost 30 years ago. My generation didn't have this discrimination. I have lefty friends who still wrote with their left hands when we were in school (about 20 years ago). For Chinese, I think the belief was that it was bad luck to have a lefty in the family/it was 'unnatural', that's why they forced them to use their right hands.
 

Ic3Rabbit

Former Elite, now Pro. ⛸️
Record Breaker
Joined
Jan 9, 2017
Country
Olympics
I'm glad to see I'm not alone.. I've never had the occasion to meet a lefty skater, let alone ambidextrous. My coach and the girls were all right handed and CCW jumpers/spinner. Until I won't compete, I think I'll try to develop the ability to spin both ways and see what happens.
I'm curios about one thing about lefty/ambidextrous people. In Italy leftys at school and in sports were thoroughly discouraged to use their dominant hand or leg in the past( I'm talking about my mother's generation not mine) and forced to use the right hand. Is it the same in your country?
Thank you for everything, I really appreciate your help.

Yes, when I was small I was more of a lefty but my parents “broke” (not literally) that so I was right handed dominantly. They were still very influenced by what they knew and customs in the areas their families were from in Europe. I do everything right handed now but I was/am a lefty jumper. ;)
 

treesprite

Final Flight
Joined
Feb 16, 2010
My aunt once told me that she was lefty but used her right hand to write because in school they wouldn't let her use her left hand. I can write two different phrases simultaneously, and do mirror writing in every direction; those things are statistically unusual, but because the mirror writing is just something some of the brainy kids in high school used to, my guess is a lot more people could do those things if they tried hard enough and practiced it. Some of us wrote our notes backwards (in cursive) so no one would know what we were writing.
 
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