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Thread: Academically excellent top skaters

  1. #81
    Zamboni time ranran's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by moriel View Post
    Depends on country.
    In Russia, physical education for athletes is a sort of a "guaranteed" uni thing, where you will very likely enter based on your athletic achievements, and professors will be very forgiving, based on same.
    I see. Do they get an exemption from doing any course work or subjects even? What will they be doing for 4 years until graduation? But yeah it does happen in some of the universities in my country for example where they actually help the students to pass the course work even if you don't have a high sports achievement just to help the university's results performance so imagine if you actually have a notable sports achievement.

  2. #82
    Tripping on the Podium louisa05's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by flipsydoodle View Post
    From my experience, this argument is VERY true, and not just about European schools. I went to 15 schools before high school. After the African school at age 10, I went into American 7th grade (and twiddled my thumbs for 2 years). At 11, my entrance exam for a British school had a Shakespeare question on the English paper, Algebra 2, French, and Latin. At the American 3rd grade I went to (a private Department of Defense school), the kids were still learning to read (in reading groups, even!!!!) and didn't yet know their multiplication tables.

    The standard differential has been there for decades.

    What I'm saying isn't about teacher pay or curriculum at all (American teachers were paid 10 times more than the African and English teachers I had). It's about what is demanded in terms of behavior in the classroom, expectations for homework, and just plain requiring students to do more sophisticated tasks.

    I'm going to guess that American teachers were not paid 10 times more than your UK teachers. Starting salaries are so low in some states that that would have met your UK teachers were making well less than $10,000 a year. Even when I started teaching 24 years ago, no once could have lived on that in the U.S. or U.K. without another income.

    Third graders are indeed learning multiplication tables. But they are 8. That is developmentally appropriate particularly as a huge goal of math curriculum now is not to merely have them memorize multiplication tables but to have them understand how multiplication works because developing that kind of number sense will make higher math easier (they do still memorize multiplication tables--but don't tell the makers of "schools should be teaching..." or "schools don't teach...anymore" memes). As a sub teacher, I have taught basic algebra concepts as early as 1st grade and have taught algebraic equations to fifth graders (who are ten years old). So I don't think our kids are as "behind" as you want to make them out to be.

    As for reading groups, just because it is a small leveled group doesn't mean they are still learning to read. By third grade, reading instruction focuses on developing comprehension skills, expanding vocabulary and learning about genre and basic literary analysis-- not on decoding. Smaller leveled groups allow for more personal instruction and allow teachers to better track individual student progress. The district I sub in most often recently switched their grades 4-5 (roughly ages 9-11) back to smaller leveled groups for those two reasons. It doesn't mean that the kids are still learning basic decoding. It is just a different instructional methodology. That district has very high reading scores with a ton of kids getting the highest possible reading scores on state assessments and was a National Blue Ribbon school in 2015.

  3. #83
    Tripping on the Podium louisa05's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by narcissa View Post
    Not that I know anything about Nathan's GPA, but

    1. More than just the admissions committee has access to your GPA. Teachers, counselors, parents, letter writers, or just friends who've spoken to the student can know this easily...
    2. I don't think people on the admissions committee take a Hippocratic oath of silence/privacy or anything

    TBH, I, too, was surprised that Nathan wasn't a shoo-in for Harvard. His extracurriculars are above average, to say the least.
    As a matter of ethics and due to privacy laws, as a teacher I cannot discuss a student's grades or disciplinary record with ANYONE but that student and a parent or guardian. If I am complaining about a student who is failing due to doing nothing to my husband, I do not divulge his or her name or specific grades. And the school I have worked in most is 25 miles away and he has never laid eyes on a single student there. But there are laws about sharing that information.

    Any and all college staff--which would include the admissions committee-- is held to the same privacy laws that teachers and school staff are. So, no, there is not an oath, but there are serious ethics and federal privacy laws that would mean that an admissions committee member is not allowed to divulge student GPAs. Nor are the teachers or school staff members allowed to. The only people you list here who would not be legally accountable to not reveal that information are friends of the student who s/he may have told that information.

  4. #84
    Bona Fide Member narcissa's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by oatmella View Post
    Do we even really know if Nathan didn’t get into Harvard ?

    Supposedly he was in an online group for admitted Harvard students.
    True, he might have been accepted. I wouldn't be surprised if he did. (I'd be wayyy more surprised if he didn't.) I guess I'm just going off the fact that he said he wanted to attend Harvard, but is now not attending Harvard. But it's possible he decided he liked Yale better after all.

    Quote Originally Posted by louisa05 View Post
    As a matter of ethics and due to privacy laws, as a teacher I cannot discuss a student's grades or disciplinary record with ANYONE but that student and a parent or guardian. If I am complaining about a student who is failing due to doing nothing to my husband, I do not divulge his or her name or specific grades. And the school I have worked in most is 25 miles away and he has never laid eyes on a single student there. But there are laws about sharing that information.

    Any and all college staff--which would include the admissions committee-- is held to the same privacy laws that teachers and school staff are. So, no, there is not an oath, but there are serious ethics and federal privacy laws that would mean that an admissions committee member is not allowed to divulge student GPAs. Nor are the teachers or school staff members allowed to. The only people you list here who would not be legally accountable to not reveal that information are friends of the student who s/he may have told that information.

    So it sounds like there are privacy laws about this sort of stuff, which honestly makes a lot of sense. Not sure how often they're enforced though, because I was under a different impression. My friend was able to look up my file while working part-time in the admissions office doing administration -- with my permission, of course, since I wanted to see what they wrote -- but I didn't have to sign a release or anything.

    And teachers won't know their students' GPAs but they have a general idea and there's a lot of backroom talk. As a student advisor in my undergrad I've seen students' grades too, mostly "accidentally" but they were just lying around on the counselor's desk. Not saying this is the case with Nathan, but word spreads. Of course, if Nathan was homeschooled, that would make it all the more difficult.

  5. #85
    On the Ice
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    Amazed by the amount of effort to try to make sense out of post claiming missing school would contribute to jaw dropping low GPA

  6. #86
    On the Ice heyheyhey's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by bonita View Post
    Amazed by the amount of effort to try to make sense out of post claiming missing school would contribute to jaw dropping low GPA
    So low the kid had to settle for Yale rather than Harvard. So tragic, hope he’s ok and somehow manages to find some success in life 😢

  7. #87
    Tripping on the Podium louisa05's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by narcissa View Post
    True, he might have been accepted. I wouldn't be surprised if he did. (I'd be wayyy more surprised if he didn't.) I guess I'm just going off the fact that he said he wanted to attend Harvard, but is now not attending Harvard. But it's possible he decided he liked Yale better after all.




    So it sounds like there are privacy laws about this sort of stuff, which honestly makes a lot of sense. Not sure how often they're enforced though, because I was under a different impression. My friend was able to look up my file while working part-time in the admissions office doing administration -- with my permission, of course, since I wanted to see what they wrote -- but I didn't have to sign a release or anything.

    And teachers won't know their students' GPAs but they have a general idea and there's a lot of backroom talk. As a student advisor in my undergrad I've seen students' grades too, mostly "accidentally" but they were just lying around on the counselor's desk. Not saying this is the case with Nathan, but word spreads. Of course, if Nathan was homeschooled, that would make it all the more difficult.
    On the gradebook program I used during a recent long term sub assignment, I could click on any student's name and see their current grades in all classes and current GPA. I could do so on the program we used at my last full time job 8 years ago. Prior to online grades, teachers got that info on their advisory group students and could easily access it otherwise any time they wanted by pulling a record. Have you even been in a school lately?

    As for how those laws are enforced? Violating them can result in immediate dismissal from your job and the school getting sued. I don't know any teachers who do not abide by them because we also have ethics.

  8. #88
    Bona Fide Member narcissa's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by louisa05 View Post
    On the gradebook program I used during a recent long term sub assignment, I could click on any student's name and see their current grades in all classes and current GPA. I could do so on the program we used at my last full time job 8 years ago. Prior to online grades, teachers got that info on their advisory group students and could easily access it otherwise any time they wanted by pulling a record. Have you even been in a school lately?

    As for how those laws are enforced? Violating them can result in immediate dismissal from your job and the school getting sued. I don't know any teachers who do not abide by them because we also have ethics.
    Yes. I've been in a school sometime after computerized grading systems were put in place and before printers became extinct.

    Anyway, I know what I saw/heard. As a student advisor, my job as a junior/senior was to co-advise the underclassmen with the counselor, giving them advice on what classes to take and when. But I always felt unqualified for the role because their grades were always much better than mine

  9. #89
    Bona Fide Member iluvtodd's Avatar
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    He didn't continue on to seniors, but Harrison Choate (US Junior men - pewter medalist 2012 - San Jose) - He was honored as one of the academically excellent high school students @ US Nationals, & recently graduated from Harvard.

  10. #90
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    Quote Originally Posted by ranran View Post
    I see. Do they get an exemption from doing any course work or subjects even? What will they be doing for 4 years until graduation? But yeah it does happen in some of the universities in my country for example where they actually help the students to pass the course work even if you don't have a high sports achievement just to help the university's results performance so imagine if you actually have a notable sports achievement.
    As far as I know they have to sit all the exams and write dissertations and diploma projects and such, but they do not have to attend all the lectures, seminars and whatever else might be required on a day-to-day basis. So they basically play catchup at the end of each semester.

  11. #91
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    Quote Originally Posted by moriel View Post
    Depends on country.
    In Russia, physical education for athletes is a sort of a "guaranteed" uni thing, where you will very likely enter based on your athletic achievements, and professors will be very forgiving, based on same.
    Not everybody manages even that so you have to at least have some brains/academic inclination to pull it off.

  12. #92
    avatar credit: @miyan5605 ice coverage's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mrs. P View Post
    There are some good folks on those scholastic honors teams. ...
    Quote Originally Posted by iluvtodd View Post
    He didn't continue on to seniors, but Harrison Choate (US Junior men - pewter medalist 2012 - San Jose) - He was honored as one of the academically excellent high school students @ US Nationals, & recently graduated from Harvard.
    Vanessa Lam is another recent Harvard grad.

    Fun fact:

    No fewer than three skaters who eventually ended up going to Harvard -- Vanessa, Harrison, and Christina -- had been on the 2012 U.S. Figure Skating Scholastic Honors Team.

    http://usfigureskating.org/Story?id=61657&type=news



    If Selena Zhao has not been mentioned yet in the thread, she is in the Class of 2020 at Harvard.

  13. #93
    Rinkside
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    [QUOTE=ice coverage;2134088]
    Christina Gao: Qualified for the GPF during her freshman year at Harvard. She graduated in May 2017.[/INDENT]




    This is BONKERS. Most people can't handle freshman year at Harvard alone, without a full load of competitive figure skating. Absolutely, mind-bogglingly insane that she did this and did not fail out.

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