At what level does costuming actually matter? | Golden Skate

At what level does costuming actually matter?

SmallAminal

On the Ice
Joined
Jul 26, 2016
Obviously when you are at national and international levels, costuming is really important. Also, when you first start out and are learning programs with bunny hops and two foot spins, the costuming is absolutely NOT important.

So when does it really start to matter? For example, I see some kids at the Pre-Juvenile level and their parents have literally invested thousands of dollars in the costumes that are tailor-made for the programs and then you see some kids who are probably wearing hand-me-downs or costumes that are in the $200 dollar range and potentially used for more than one season or program.

I understand that you'd want to have appropriate attire (e.g. skating dress and tights), but when do the judges start to implicitly or explicitly expect "more" out of your costuming or take it into account in the judging?


Curious what people think about this.
 

mishulyia

On the Ice
Joined
Jun 23, 2018
Nothing wrong with hand-me-downs. Even Eteri’s junior girls trade and wear each other’s costumes all the time. Alina’s famous OGM red tutu was once worn by Evgenia. I would personally not invest heavily in costumes too soon — that money is better spent towards more lessons.
 

vlaurend

Final Flight
Joined
Jan 14, 2008
I think aninvestment in the "perfect" costume becomes appropriate when the skater is making final round at Regionals and/or qualifying for Sectionals, even at the lower levels.
 

likevelvet

#Bless this mess
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Kids at competitions in my area juvenile and up tend to have dripping-with-swarovski costumes, but they will change their programs season to season and re-use them, often with tailoring alterations done. So they may be exceptionally fancy, but they also tend to be classic in shape and color, and preferably useful for more than one style of music. Pre-juv and down, at local comps, the outfits are a little simpler, just cute, age-appropriate, usually off the rack dresses or dance costumes, maybe with a little stoning done by parents if appropriate.

I also agree that it can become important at certain stages of competition more so than the age or level of the skater. Regionals and sectionals are a bigger deal and a bigger platform than events that qualify you for those, and the field is also larger so at that point you really want to start standing out.
 

Spirals for Miles

Anna Shcherbakova is my World Champion
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Aug 25, 2017
Nothing wrong with hand-me-downs. Even Eteri’s junior girls trade and wear each other’s costumes all the time. Alina’s famous OGM red tutu was once worn by Evgenia. I would personally not invest heavily in costumes too soon — that money is better spent towards more lessons.

Small point, but Alina only wore Evgenia's tutu during her junior season. She got a new one for the Olympic season.
And Alina's original POTO costume was just temporary which is why it was Diana Davis' old one.
 

TontoK

Hot Tonto
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Every time one a costume discussion comes up, it just sets my teeth on edge.

A fancy dress does not make a good skater. The right hair style doesn't do it. The right make-up doesn't do it.

Go back and look at Peggy Fleming's dress, which her mother made. Or Dorothy Hamill's. The crystal-wearing wanna-be fashion icons should take a page from their books, and invest in what will make them better skaters.

A costume can be appropriate for a program without crystals and beads and feathers. Part of me leaps with joy every time one of those do-dads falls off during a program, and the skater is hit with a deduction. Because I think, MAYBE, this will be the incentive skaters need to ditch that vapid nonsense.
 

VegMom

On the Ice
Joined
Aug 25, 2017
I love this thread!

As a skate mom for a boy I am lucky that costumes aren’t as big of a deal but I have also wondered when it would make sense to invest in something custom. I was thinking it makes sense at juvenile or even pre-juvenile.

I’m surprised to hear anyone using the same dress season after season simply because these are all children and they are still growing.

My skater grows like a weed. This season I simply bought plain black pants and simple skate/dance type tops around May but he’d already grown out of them by August! So I had to buy all new again!

My challenge each season so far is that we don’t settle on music til the last minute and then there’s not enough time to get a custom costume.
 

likevelvet

#Bless this mess
On the Ice
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Every time one a costume discussion comes up, it just sets my teeth on edge.

A fancy dress does not make a good skater. The right hair style doesn't do it. The right make-up doesn't do it.

Go back and look at Peggy Fleming's dress, which her mother made. Or Dorothy Hamill's. The crystal-wearing wanna-be fashion icons should take a page from their books, and invest in what will make them better skaters.

A costume can be appropriate for a program without crystals and beads and feathers. Part of me leaps with joy every time one of those do-dads falls off during a program, and the skater is hit with a deduction. Because I think, MAYBE, this will be the incentive skaters need to ditch that vapid nonsense.

The fact is the sport is about aesthetics and appearance nearly as much as it is about technical content these days. It’s part of the artistry. It’s not really skaters’ fault the trend has gone this way. They do what they must to keep up. It’s the same as pushing for more advanced program content.
 

gkelly

Record Breaker
Joined
Jul 26, 2003
I think it depends on the judge. Some might be impressed by bling and others might prefer simple and functional. And I think the more conservative ones especially dislike too much appearance of nudity.

There's nothing in the rules to encourage elaborate costumes -- in fact historicalyl the rules have called for clothing to modest, dignified, and appropriate for athletic competition.

If everyone else is going with lots of sparkles, perhaps the way to stand out is by keeping it simple.

I'd say the main thing to avoid would be lots of extra fabric that distracts from showing clean lines or that just looks messy in general.

In any case, the skater has to back it up with good skating.
 

TontoK

Hot Tonto
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The fact is the sport is about aesthetics and appearance nearly as much as it is about technical content these days. It’s part of the artistry. It’s not really skaters’ fault the trend has gone this way. They do what they must to keep up. It’s the same as pushing for more advanced program content.

I'm venting, so don't take this personally...

But how does athletic artistry depend on flashy costumes? I really want someone to explain this to me.

You could dress me up in sequins and feathers head to toe, and I'd still look like a clunky dude.

And you could have put John Curry on ice in solid black practice gear, and he'd still be the most artistic skater in history.

It's bad enough that there is a focus at the elite senior level, but it's horrifying that it's become an issue for children.
 

SmallAminal

On the Ice
Joined
Jul 26, 2016
I'm venting, so don't take this personally...

But how does athletic artistry depend on flashy costumes? I really want someone to explain this to me.

You could dress me up in sequins and feathers head to toe, and I'd still look like a clunky dude.

And you could have put John Curry on ice in solid black practice gear, and he'd still be the most artistic skater in history.

It's bad enough that there is a focus at the elite senior level, but it's horrifying that it's become an issue for children.

I don't disagree with you - but am wondering if this "trend" towards more elaborate, bling-y costumes is driven by expectation of the *judges* or just misguided skaters/parents/coaches? I do think it is important that there isn't complete dissonance between costume and program (e.g. wearing a clown costume for Swan Lake...unless you are Stephan Lambiel and you have some strange interpretation of the music) but I've been perplexed as to the increased "costuming" of the sport over time.

I see it also in gymnastics. Look at Nadia Comaneci in 1976 - it was a very athletic looking leo with no sparkles and athletic stripes down the side. Now you have blinged- out, highly designed leos (example: Jordan Chiles in her crystallized Wonder Woman leo) but it doesn't really change the actual gymnastics.

I'd like to think that I could send my skater out there in something "sensible" or even simply home-sewn and it wouldn't make a difference, but I'm wondering....does it? Do judges actually take the costuming into account in evaluating the artistry of the program? Why are we moving away from the Peggy Fleming days into "designer" $5k costumes?
 

Spinning

On the Ice
Joined
Dec 10, 2015
Liza T won Lombardia's SP today wearing tight and white bf shirt. I don't believe at all on any connections of the spectacular dresses and the good results.

I blame the crazy escalated spending for dresses and equipments on social media. Do we really care how much they spent for their dresses and skates? I don't think not many people do. It is kind of ridiculous to see new learner especially adult showing off their Icefly with Revolution blades.

Many skaters manage to spend reasonable cost on memorable costumes. Kailani did make her owns and her dresses have always been a hit!
 

SmallAminal

On the Ice
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Jul 26, 2016
Go back and look at Peggy Fleming's dress.

Actually, Peggy Flemings iconic chartreuse (sp) Olympics dress was amazing - the color, the cut, the tailoring, the restraint with embellishments...it was an amazing design that would not look out of place today.
 

TontoK

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Actually, Peggy Flemings iconic chartreuse (sp) Olympics dress was amazing - the color, the cut, the tailoring, the restraint with embellishments...it was an amazing design that would not look out of place today.

Yes. That's my point. Her mother made that dress.

Once of the most iconic skaters in history won the Olympic Games in a homemade dress, one that was so understated and classic that it would still be relevant today, 50 years later.

Peggy would not have looked one iota more lovely or artistic had she worn a Vera Wang special design, dripping with rhinestones and feathers, and costing thousands and thousands of dollars.

And, lest anyone think I'm sexist, I much preferred Nathan Chen's SP outfit in early season last year - black pants and a red (or was it blue?) shirt - to the Vera Wang deal he wore at the Olympics.

Although I confess I did like his LP costume that Vera designed, but that one was a masterpiece of understatement.
 

gkelly

Record Breaker
Joined
Jul 26, 2003
I don't disagree with you - but am wondering if this "trend" towards more elaborate, bling-y costumes is driven by expectation of the *judges* or just misguided skaters/parents/coaches?

I think it's driven more by the skaters themselves, and parents, trying to show off for each other. Many enjoy fashion, enjoy the idea of dressing up, and skating gives them an opportunity to indulge that interest.

Even ca. 1930 it seems there was an arms race about which skaters could best incorporate fur trim into their skating dresses, driven by furrier's daughter Sonja Henie, who also pioneered other costume innovations in her time (short skirts, white boots instead of black, then beige boots instead of white so she would still stand out from the crowd).

My understanding is that the trend toward sequins (and later stones) first originated in show skating but became popularized in competitive skating beginning with Linda Fratianne in the 1970s.

I think the judges have gotten used to the kinds of fashions that skaters have been showing. And they each have their own personal preferences. But I don't think they are asking for elaborate costumes. The rules don't ask for it and have sometimes seemed more aimed at toning down excesses. (Or potential safety hazards, especially for synchro skating.)
 

hanyuufan5

✨**:。*
Medalist
Joined
May 19, 2018
Every time one a costume discussion comes up, it just sets my teeth on edge.

A fancy dress does not make a good skater. The right hair style doesn't do it. The right make-up doesn't do it.

Go back and look at Peggy Fleming's dress, which her mother made. Or Dorothy Hamill's. The crystal-wearing wanna-be fashion icons should take a page from their books, and invest in what will make them better skaters.

A costume can be appropriate for a program without crystals and beads and feathers. Part of me leaps with joy every time one of those do-dads falls off during a program, and the skater is hit with a deduction. Because I think, MAYBE, this will be the incentive skaters need to ditch that vapid nonsense.

A lot of skaters love "those do-dads" and "that vapid nonsense" and consider them part of the appeal of skating.

No mediocre skater is going to win because of a fancy costume, and no one who skates clean with 5 quads and level 4 everything is going to lose because of a plain one.
 

Seren

Wakabond Forever
Record Breaker
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Dec 21, 2014
Some of Michelle's later costumes were very simple in that they had no sparkles or embellishments but their design would still be timeless and stylish today.

I think the best case scenario is that a costume inspire confidence in the skater. You like bling? Great! You feel better in simpler clothing? Also great! As long as a skater is confident in what they are wearing then they will look good wearing it. As for judging it shouldn't make a difference but it can make a difference for the skater wearing it.

I am an adult skater and I have had 2 dresses in the past several years made for me- both of which I have used multiple times. I feel much more comfortable in them than any off the rack dress I bought that made me feel like I was playing dress up (while I am a smaller adult I am still not proportioned like a kid). The clothes don't make the skater but they can help the skater feel more confident.
 

concorde

Medalist
Joined
Jul 29, 2013
I think an outfit needs to complement the music but more importantly, it must fit the skater - regardless of level.

At the lower levels, I have seen several dresses that are way too big and I don't think that is beneficial since the entire "package" seems to play into the score.

My taste is more classic with simple lines so I agree that simplier is better. But I think I am the minority of skater moms.
 

vlaurend

Final Flight
Joined
Jan 14, 2008
Some of Michelle's later costumes were very simple in that they had no sparkles or embellishments but their design would still be timeless and stylish today.

I think the best case scenario is that a costume inspire confidence in the skater. You like bling? Great! You feel better in simpler clothing? Also great! As long as a skater is confident in what they are wearing then they will look good wearing it. As for judging it shouldn't make a difference but it can make a difference for the skater wearing it.

I am an adult skater and I have had 2 dresses in the past several years made for me- both of which I have used multiple times. I feel much more comfortable in them than any off the rack dress I bought that made me feel like I was playing dress up (while I am a smaller adult I am still not proportioned like a kid). The clothes don't make the skater but they can help the skater feel more confident.

Same here. Not only do I feel more confident wearing the perfect dress, but it definitely matters that the dress fits the music and helps in the overall interpretation of it. And, since blinged-out dresses are the fashion in figure skating these days, I am going to keep pace with that fashion by putting a tasteful number of crystals on my dress (although it's also true that any dress that looks tasteful close up probably needs more crystals, LOL!).
Personally, I consider the pretty dress my reward for getting out there and subjecting myself to nerves and potential humiliation at every competition. I'm sure I'm not alone in that regard.
 

bunnybarista

If I risk it all, could you break my fall?~
On the Ice
Joined
May 27, 2018
I blame the crazy escalated spending for dresses and equipments on social media. Do we really care how much they spent for their dresses and skates? I don't think not many people do. It is kind of ridiculous to see new learner especially adult showing off their Icefly with Revolution blades.

This is an interesting point/idea. I have quickly grown tired of seeing everyone and their mother fawning over the Iceflys (and other mid/high-level Edeas) as the ultimate "ice-girl aesthetic" - unless Edeas really are the perfect fit for your foot, they're not going to make you skate any better than a more traditional boot would. However, as an adult skater, I'll play devil's advocate for a second and say that some of these folks who just started skating might not be quite as over-booted as one might think - adults weigh more than kids and won't be growing out of their boots. But if you're going to go for a higher-level skate, consider something timelessly classic like Harlicks or Jackson... just my two cents! I hope Edeas will stop being so "trendy" soon.

If you're competing at a lower level, maybe in a large group/fleet (?), perhaps having a unique costume would help you stand out if the judges have seen dozens and dozens of similar programs and costumes and their eyes are glazing over... (hopefully this is a rare occurrence!) A little sparkle never hurts, but the prices for some of these dresses make my jaw drop! (Especially if you're only wearing it once.) It would be nice to just be able to skate amazingly and not have your costume matter, but costume really does seem to be a part of the "package" that judges want to see.

Same here. Not only do I feel more confident wearing the perfect dress, but it definitely matters that the dress fits the music and helps in the overall interpretation of it. And, since blinged-out dresses are the fashion in figure skating these days, I am going to keep pace with that fashion by putting a tasteful number of crystals on my dress (although it's also true that any dress that looks tasteful close up probably needs more crystals, LOL!).
Personally, I consider the pretty dress my reward for getting out there and subjecting myself to nerves and potential humiliation at every competition. I'm sure I'm not alone in that regard.

I like this sentiment a lot! Feeling confident and happy is key.
 
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