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Thread: US Ladies, Hall of Fame- Post Kwan, Cohen

  1. #71
    Tripping on the Podium
    Join Date
    Nov 2011
    Posts
    972
    Country: United States of America

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    Quote Originally Posted by b-man View Post
    Hi Jammers, I remember you as a Gold fan from at least 2013. If Mirai doesn't return, I may join you on the Gracie bandwagon.

    Mirai has been a senior for 11 years, has 7 medals which means she was on the 4 person USFS podium 7 times, or if looking at a 3 person podium, she would be a 5 time podium winner.
    Mirai was able to break into senior ranks at age 14, which Gold was not. I also note Mirai, as winner of Nationals in 2008, was entitled to go to worlds, but she was age limited.

    Gracie has 2 Golds and 2 silvers in 5 Nationals, a terrific record, and Gold also has a better record at worlds, and I am of the opinion both belong in the HOF.


    The reason for starting this thread was to introduce the possibility of ladies post Kwan/Cohen to be eligible for the HOF. My research showed most Ladies HOF members 1990-2005, with a few exception have Olympic Gold or World Gold. And those exceptions have multiple world silvers. Skaters post Kwan/Cohen are doing higher tech content, but due to increased international competition are not winning OGM or WGM. Poster Mathman advised me some disciplines have HOF members with far less international results than in Ladies.
    if you look at the numbers, Gold's 5-year senior career is already more accomplished than Mirai's 11-year senior career. if you look at the numbers from what i posted earlier in the thread, Gracie has been 1st or 2nd 4 out of 5 trips to US nationals. She has one more gold over Mirai. She has 2 more Grand Prix medals and has won 2 golds, where Mirai has never won a GP. She's qualified to the GPF twice, Mirai has never. Gracie was on the world team 4 years in a row. Mirai has gone to the world championships less times in a career that is over two times longer, and Gracie has placed higher. Mirai has another olympics over her where she landed a 3A, but if you look at the bigger picture, Gracie has had more success in less than half the amount of time of Mirai's senior career. Gracie came on the senior circuit at an older age than Mirai, but if anything that only brightens what she's accomplished.

    Mirai Nagasu, senior career 2007-present (break 2018-2019 or retired)
    7 national medals, 1 is gold
    4 Grand Prix medals
    0 trips to GPF
    3 trips to Worlds, highest placement is 7th
    4 trips to 4CC, 3 medals
    2 trips to Olympics, 3rd place team (2018, no team event in 2010), highest placement is 4th

    Gracie Gold, senior career 2013-present (break from 2017-2018)

    4 national medals, 2 are gold
    6 GP medals, 2 are gold
    1 trip to GPF, placed 5th (qualified in 2014 but WD)
    3 trips to 4CC, highest placement is 4th
    4 trips to Worlds, highest placement is 4th (2015 & 2016)
    1 Olympics, 3rd place team, 4th place individual

    I still think Mirai's 3A performed at the olympics may be grounds for USFS to at least consider her for HOF, but outside of that i don't think she meets enough of the criteria. That's not to say her other accomplishments don't matter (she's been a huge star for US figure skating), but when you look at the numbers, Gracie 100% has it over her.

  2. #72
    Tripping on the Podium
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    Quote Originally Posted by macy View Post
    if you look at the numbers, Gold's 5-year senior career is already more accomplished than Mirai's 11-year senior career. if you look at the numbers from what i posted earlier in the thread, Gracie has been 1st or 2nd 4 out of 5 trips to US nationals. She has one more gold over Mirai. She has 2 more Grand Prix medals and has won 2 golds, where Mirai has never won a GP. She's qualified to the GPF twice, Mirai has never. Gracie was on the world team 4 years in a row. Mirai has gone to the world championships less times in a career that is over two times longer, and Gracie has placed higher. Mirai has another olympics over her where she landed a 3A, but if you look at the bigger picture, Gracie has had more success in less than half the amount of time of Mirai's senior career. Gracie came on the senior circuit at an older age than Mirai, but if anything that only brightens what she's accomplished.

    Mirai Nagasu, senior career 2007-present (break 2018-2019 or retired)
    7 national medals, 1 is gold
    4 Grand Prix medals
    0 trips to GPF
    3 trips to Worlds, highest placement is 7th
    4 trips to 4CC, 3 medals
    2 trips to Olympics, 3rd place team (2018, no team event in 2010), highest placement is 4th

    Gracie Gold, senior career 2013-present (break from 2017-2018)

    4 national medals, 2 are gold
    6 GP medals, 2 are gold
    1 trip to GPF, placed 5th (qualified in 2014 but WD)
    3 trips to 4CC, highest placement is 4th
    4 trips to Worlds, highest placement is 4th (2015 & 2016)
    1 Olympics, 3rd place team, 4th place individual

    I still think Mirai's 3A performed at the olympics may be grounds for USFS to at least consider her for HOF, but outside of that i don't think she meets enough of the criteria. That's not to say her other accomplishments don't matter (she's been a huge star for US figure skating), but when you look at the numbers, Gracie 100% has it over her.
    I see a lot of parallels in their careers. Both have a 4th place in the Olympics. What is fascinating, both won a short program in a World's competition against skaters considered the best at the time, Mirai over Mao and Yuna in 2010 and Gracie over Medvedeva in 2016. Another parallel is in Olympic team competition. Gracie finished a strong 2nd in the team FS in 2014, and Mirai had an incredible 2nd in the team FS in 2018, both helping their teams to a bronze.

    You say Mirai hasn't met the HOF criteria. As Mathman pointed out, we don't really know the criteria.

    Yes Mirai was only in 3 World's teams. She didn't get to go to world's as national champion in 2008, nor did she go in 2014 when finishing 3rd at Nationals with 3 spots available. If you want to say Gracies career is better, fine.

    My point being they are both among the best US skaters of their era, along with Wagner, maybe Meisner. Winning OGM or WGM no longer seems attainable like it was 20 years ago, although the skaters are doing content beyond that done 20 years Ago. The best skaters of every generation have been added to the HOF. Why not now?

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