Scraping noises

bunnybarista · Oct 29, 2018

I recently bought some gently-used Coronation Aces, freshly sharpened, and tried them on the ice for the first time today. I heard a horrible scraping sound every time I moved, and it was really hard to get onto my outside edges. It seems likely that I need a realignment to fix the over-pronation (not usually a problem for me), but any ideas as to what is causing this noise? I tried googling it and it seems that some people get weird noises from blades that are sharpened unevenly. Others suggest that it's not the blades being unevenly sharpened, but instead unevenly mounted - that is, one side is screwed in further than the other, causing the blade to tilt, so that even on a "flat," one edge would be higher off the ice, and when on an edge, the side with the edge that was slightly longer could brush against the ice, causing scraping?

I saw a recent thread about blade misalignment where the poster said they were accumulating a lot of snow on the blades - this is happening to me, too, much more than ever happened on my previous blades. It's also a deeper hollow than I'm used to, but it doesn't make sense for that to be causing this ugly noise. (It's not a toepick noise, and not a good "crunch/rip" of an edge, but instead a loud and continuous scraping sound.)

Would love feedback if anyone has experienced this! I will return to my skate sharpener and see if he can fix this, but it will take a while before I can get there, so in the meantime, I'm sitting at home feeling confused about my blades and hoping for some insight... Thanks!

sandraskates · Oct 29, 2018

This was my scenario:
The left sole of my custom Harlicks had a slight roll to the upper outside (hope that makes sense). Thus, my blade mount was not level and boy did it make scrapey noises during stroking.
I actually took my Pre-bronze moves in this mounting before the correction. As the only person on the ice, that scrape to me was deafening!

My skate tech removed the blade and fashioned a shim to go between the blade and sole to even out the mounting, which alleviated that noise immensely and improved my ability to execute moves and spins much easier.

Once diagnosed your problem should be correctable.

bunnybarista · Oct 29, 2018

sandraskates said:
This was my scenario:
The left sole of my custom Harlicks had a slight roll to the upper outside (hope that makes sense). Thus, my blade mount was not level and boy did it make scrapey noises during stroking.
I actually took my Pre-bronze moves in this mounting before the correction. As the only person on the ice, that scrape to me was deafening!

My skate tech removed the blade and fashioned a shim to go between the blade and sole to even out the mounting, which alleviated that noise immensely and improved my ability to execute moves and spins much easier.

Once diagnosed your problem should be correctable.

Thanks so much for sharing your experience! Sounds like I may have the same problem - looking at the bottom of my skates, it does indeed appear that the blade mount isn't level, but I can't tell if it's due to the sole maybe not being flat, or just improperly attaching the blade. :scratch2:

I know my fitter sanded down the soles before mounting the new blades so idk if something happened there.

Ic3Rabbit · Oct 29, 2018

The first thing I was going to suggest was to make sure the soles of your boots are not warped or defective in some way.

sandraskates · Oct 29, 2018

Bunny - I've had a few pairs of custom Harlicks over 25 years and this was the first time EVER that I've had to had a shim added to the sole to even out the bottom.

My tech says that boots and blades are not being manufactured as well as they once were. He's been around for a zillion years. And don't get him started on Edeas; he has absolutely no love for them at all. :laugh:

bunnybarista · Oct 29, 2018

sandraskates said:
Bunny - I've had a few pairs of custom Harlicks over 25 years and this was the first time EVER that I've had to had a shim added to the sole to even out the bottom.

My tech says that boots and blades are not being manufactured as well as they once were. He's been around for a zillion years. And don't get him started on Edeas; he has absolutely no love for them at all.

Lol one of the first things my new fitter said was how much he hates Edea! I just dislike them aesthetically.

These are custom SP-Teris, gently used (i.e. not built for me), so it's possible that some warping had occurred to the heels, but I know my fitter sanded them down and waterproofed them, and it seems like he would have noticed something like this, but apparently not.

This is just a temporary mounting so hopefully we can figure out an easy solution - like a shim - that doesn't cost an arm and a leg.

tstop4me · Oct 29, 2018

bunnybarista said:
Lol one of the first things my new fitter said was how much he hates Edea! I just dislike them aesthetically.

These are custom SP-Teris, gently used (i.e. not built for me), so it's possible that some warping had occurred to the heels, but I know my fitter sanded them down and waterproofed them, and it seems like he would have noticed something like this, but apparently not. This is just a temporary mounting so hopefully we can figure out an easy solution - like a shim - that doesn't cost an arm and a leg.

(a) Since you have a new temporary mount, check the screws to make sure they are tight and the blade is not wobbling.

(b) Another cause would be if the blade was not mounted straight (toe-to-heel). You can check that if you have a good known straight edge (such as a heavy-gauge rigid metal ruler used by machinists or old-time draftsmen). Place the edge of the straight edge against the sides of the blade (toe-to-heel). You shouldn't see any gap between the straight edge and the blade.

(c) If the problem is caused by uneven edges [requires special tool to check properly] or uneven mounting (inside-to-outside), then you would should veer to one side when you are trying to glide on a straight line (on a nominal flat). Also, it should not be noisy if you are gliding on the higher edge: so noisy on a nominal flat and on one edge, but not noisy on the other edge. What is the case for you?

bunnybarista · Oct 29, 2018

tstop4me said:
(a) Since you have a new temporary mount, check the screws to make sure they are tight and the blade is not wobbling.

(b) Another cause would be if the blade was not mounted straight (toe-to-heel). You can check that if you have a good known straight edge (such as a heavy-gauge rigid metal ruler used by machinists or old-time draftsmen). Place the edge of the straight edge against the sides of the blade (toe-to-heel). You shouldn't see any gap between the straight edge and the blade.

(c) If the problem is caused by uneven edges [requires special tool to check properly] or uneven mounting (inside-to-outside), then you would should veer to one side when you are trying to glide on a straight line (on a nominal flat). Also, it should not be noisy if you are gliding on the higher edge: so noisy on a nominal flat and on one edge, but not noisy on the other edge. What is the case for you?

Thank you for the detailed troubleshooting! Let's see... for A) the screws are tight and the blade is not wobbling. B) I'm not sure if I have a straight edge - will have to dig around in my tool box and report back. C) When doing a one-foot glide, I veered to the inside on either foot (and falling onto the inside edge), most drastically on the left skate. (On my old blades I have straight and lovely one-foot glides so it's definitely the new blades, not me.) Good point about one edge not making noise - I didn't pay attention to that today. I will listen closely tomorrow (and my coach will be there to help see what's going on). I will report back! Thanks again, I think this will be helpful in pinpointing the issue(s).

singerskates · Oct 31, 2018

Just had my skates sharpened by my coach. Last Saturday I showed my skates to my coach and explained that I was having a hard time getting my outside edges even when I forced them. My stoking was very noisy to me before he sharpened my blades. Now my edges including backwards with the exception of doing RFO change edge to RFI swing roll was nice and quiet. The swing roll had some chattering while changing edges. During the first attempt doing the swing roll I was sliding sideways as my bladder chattered on the ice. I'm going to have my coach check our my forward and backward edges on my right skate next lesson. I think the blade needs to be realigned.

tstop4me · Oct 31, 2018

singerskates said:
... I was sliding sideways as my bladder chattered on the ice.

Wow! You must have left some wild yellowish trails on the ice.

bunnybarista · Oct 31, 2018

singerskates said:
Just had my skates sharpened by my coach. Last Saturday I showed my skates to my coach and explained that I was having a hard time getting my outside edges even when I forced them. My stoking was very noisy to me before he sharpened my blades. Now my edges including backwards with the exception of doing RFO change edge to RFI swing roll was nice and quiet. The swing roll had some chattering while changing edges. During the first attempt doing the swing roll I was sliding sideways as my bladder chattered on the ice. I'm going to have my coach check our my forward and backward edges on my right skate next lesson. I think the blade needs to be realigned.

Hmmn, so are you saying that the sharpening fixed the noisiness? Or that it's better, but you still feel like the blade has to be realigned?

singerskates · Oct 31, 2018

tstop4me said:
Wow! You must have left some wild yellowish trails on the ice.

Google changed what I typed on my phone when I hit send. Crossing my fingers.....

singerskates · Oct 31, 2018

bunnybarista said:
Hmmn, so are you saying that the sharpening fixed the noisiness? Or that it's better, but you still feel like the blade has to be realigned?

Yes, the sharpening did fix 95% of my problems.

vlaurend · Nov 1, 2018

Out of curiosity, are these Coronation Ace blades the new Revolution blades, with the lightweight stanchions? If so, you should know that all lightweight blades are noisier on the ice than the traditional ones, since the materials allow for more sound reverberation. This is one reason I went from Revolution Gold Seal blades back to the traditional Gold Seals last year. Of course that doesn't explain the problem of falling onto your inside edges, though. That definitely sounds like a mounting issue.

bunnybarista · Nov 3, 2018

vlaurend said:
Out of curiosity, are these Coronation Ace blades the new Revolution blades, with the lightweight stanchions? If so, you should know that all lightweight blades are noisier on the ice than the traditional ones, since the materials allow for more sound reverberation. This is one reason I went from Revolution Gold Seal blades back to the traditional Gold Seals last year. Of course that doesn't explain the problem of falling onto your inside edges, though. That definitely sounds like a mounting issue.

Nope, these are just the plain 'ol Coronation Aces. The noisiness is less noticeable after skating on them for a week, though the misalignment / over-pronation continues to bother me. Currently trying to decide if I can afford an on-ice adjustment now... :shocked:

singerskates · Nov 24, 2018

I have had my coach try to fix my noise scraping issue (scraping only when stroking forward and when doing a change of edge forward on my right skate by sharpening. It seems after the second sharpening (the hollow/radius was way too shallow for me. My coach and I are now using the same sharpening.) the scraping is still happening. I even changed out my adjustable R-Fit Riddell foot bed pieces and it didn't go away. My coach needs to look closer to my blade and figure it out next Friday, or should I say Thursday, because I'm going to be out of town next Friday. I just feel in easy knowing that I am sliding when I hit the middle and back of my heal. Thankfully I doesn't affect my jumps or spins.

bunnybarista · Nov 24, 2018

singerskates said:
I have had my coach try to fix my noise scraping issue (scraping only when stroking forward and when doing a change of edge forward on my right skate by sharpening. It seems after the second sharpening (the hollow/radius was way too shallow for me. My coach and I are now using the same sharpening.) the scraping is still happening. I even changed out my adjustable R-Fit Riddell foot bed pieces and it didn't go away. My coach needs to look closer to my blade and figure it out next Friday, or should I say Thursday, because I'm going to be out of town next Friday. I just feel in easy knowing that I am sliding when I hit the middle and back of my heal. Thankfully I doesn't affect my jumps or spins.

Interesting. If you / your coach figure out what's happening next week, please let me know! I still haven't fully resolved what's going on with my blades. My coach has identified that the noise is most apparent when changing edges, and that I can't hold my outside edges as much as I thought I was / used to.

cl2 · Nov 25, 2018

Something similar happens to me sometimes. My coach explains that the scrapping noise is because I am on the wrong edge trying to force a curve. E.g., when I try to do an outside edge, but am actually on the inside edge, I would force the direction of the curve through body lean instead of proper edge.

Not sure what would be the reason for the wrong edge in the first place. Could be due to blade mounting. For me, it was probably due to poor ankle and hip strength (coming back from an injury) and poor body alignment (old habits die hard).

bunnybarista · Nov 26, 2018

cl2 said:
Something similar happens to me sometimes. My coach explains that the scrapping noise is because I am on the wrong edge trying to force a curve. E.g., when I try to do an outside edge, but am actually on the inside edge, I would force the direction of the curve through body lean instead of proper edge.

Not sure what would be the reason for the wrong edge in the first place. Could be due to blade mounting. For me, it was probably due to poor ankle and hip strength (coming back from an injury) and poor body alignment (old habits die hard).

Hmmn, the noise is definitely increased when I'm changing edges, and I do sometimes realize that I've fallen off an outside edge and am forcing it, like on swing rolls sometimes. This wasn't a problem with my old blades so I'm inclined to think that's mostly the alignment, though my ankles could always get stronger for sure! But I think there's an additional reason for the noise, because I hear it even when I'm trying to skate on a flat. Going to go to a different sharpener next time and see what his opinion is.

cl2 · Nov 26, 2018

bunnybarista said:
Hmmn, the noise is definitely increased when I'm changing edges, and I do sometimes realize that I've fallen off an outside edge and am forcing it, like on swing rolls sometimes. This wasn't a problem with my old blades so I'm inclined to think that's mostly the alignment, though my ankles could always get stronger for sure! But I think there's an additional reason for the noise, because I hear it even when I'm trying to skate on a flat. Going to go to a different sharpener next time and see what his opinion is.

Let me know how it goes, just out of curiosity.

FWIW, I've been in Coronation Aces my entire skating life, so who knows it could be something to do with the blade. I just always thought the problem lay with me.

Scraping noises

bunnybarista

If I risk it all, could you break my fall?~

sandraskates

bunnybarista

If I risk it all, could you break my fall?~

Ic3Rabbit

Former Elite, now Pro. ⛸️

sandraskates

bunnybarista

If I risk it all, could you break my fall?~

tstop4me

bunnybarista

If I risk it all, could you break my fall?~

singerskates

tstop4me

bunnybarista

If I risk it all, could you break my fall?~

singerskates

singerskates

vlaurend

bunnybarista

If I risk it all, could you break my fall?~

singerskates

bunnybarista

If I risk it all, could you break my fall?~

cl2

bunnybarista

If I risk it all, could you break my fall?~

cl2

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