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She did have an influence on the more artistic skaters of later generations. Akiko Suzuki in one of her books specifically mentions Witt as an inspiration when she was young.
What skaters have left the biggest legacy?
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She did have an influence on the more artistic skaters of later generations. Akiko Suzuki in one of her books specifically mentions Witt as an inspiration when she was young.
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Thanks for sharing this. Evan Lysacek's 3T looks horrible.
I have seen it referenced in articles whenever another female skater start doing 3As at big competitions, along with Midori's achievements. It is still a feat that hasn't been surpassed yet.
Yes. Hasn't been surpassed not just at olympics but in international competitions. It shows how hard and epic this achievement is. Way harder than to land a 3lz-3T or any other 3-3 (outside 3A-3T/lo and the weird 3lz-3F).
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For all the flack we give Russian ladies for that cheat on the toe pick... American men Lysacek and Weir both had it in 2010 Olympics. Even Nathan Chen doesn't have particularly great technique on it.
Midori Ito, for pushing the field with the best triple axel* (also first woman to do it ever), 3Lo**, 3T-3T**, 2A***, -3Lo ***(although out of a double), 3S, 2-1-3 ever, and for also being the first to do 5 and then 6 and then 7 triples in an LP. If it's a triple, Ito probably has that benchmark (3 flip/lutz + 3Toe to Yuna, although maybe Kawabata did a better Lutz+Toe this season). The way jumps are going, it is doubtful anyone can match, let alone surpass, her quality.
*1990 worlds LP
**1989 worlds LP
***1988 Olympics SP
1988 olympics LP too.
MO, that 1990 worlds LP is probably her best program technically. Not only for the 3A but also the 3-3 as the last jumping pass.
Her 1991 trophée lalique LP is also noteworthy for the two first jumping passes, 3lz-3T and 3A-2T. I think Kristi Yamaguchi beat her for the first 3lz-3T, in the same competition, because of skating order. But quality wise Ito's was better.
She could have been the first to land 3A-3T too since there is video of her landing it in practice.
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1988 is of course brilliant, I just didn't think she set any benchmarks in the LP, but the technical quality was unsurpassed in that competition (and it is doubtful that anyone ever has blown the field so far away in a single competition, figures be damned). I was actually rescoring this with CoP rules, and it turns out that she wins 2011 worlds and 2012 worlds
with level 1 footwork and maximum of level 2 spins, and considering no footwork at all in the LP (just two choreographic sequences). Even if I invalidate the 2F in the SP, she wins by a narrow margin.1990 worlds and 1991 Lalique are great, and yes her 3A combos are noteworthy, too. I think she had better quality jumping in 1989 worlds, though, and that performance in general is a wonderful example of where people who immediately disparage "just jumpers" who are "killing the sport" can shove it.
That shows how much she was ahead of her time. She was a CoP skater before ISU got the idea.1988 is of course brilliant, I just didn't think she set any benchmarks in the LP, but the technical quality was unsurpassed in that competition (and it is doubtful that anyone ever has blown the field so far away in a single competition, figures be damned). I was actually rescoring this with CoP rules, and it turns out that she wins 2011 worlds and 2012 worlds
With CoP (especially the 2010- version) she could have done pretty things. Like the first 4 triples program that she couldn't do in ISU competition but did as professional. And win more titles of course.
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Just wanted to mention that Dick Button also created the World Pro Figure Skating competition which was great until he sold it. and back in Dick's time as an elite figure skater, very few videos exist from that time and before. Also, he's the only American to with the European Championships.
I do think that any legacy will be somewhat generational except for people who are willing to look back at history. Years from now, people might not know that Brian Boitano created the Tano Lutz. Young ice dance fans might recognize Chris Dean as a great choreographer but probably never saw him skate with Jane unless searched out on You Tube.
Many young skaters are more aware of Scott Hamilton as an Olympic commentator but he's being supplanted by Tara and Johnny.
When you put them all together, they all have legacies but only time will tell how enduring.
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His gold medal was horrible. It was a slap in the face for all figure skating community. And time proves this - we have exactly zero memories and zero of his legacy left in figure skating now.
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The legacy he left is basically being the prime example of how a OGM win should NOT look. :disapp:
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But you can't surpass three 3A in a competition. It's limited by repetition rule. Rika has matched it hasn't she?
And yes still an epic achievement. I was rooting for Yuna, but I could still appreciate the feat at the time of Vancouver Olympics.
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Poor maligned Evan. I wasn't rooting for him, but that Olympic Men LP was pretty disaster filled. Sure Plushenko landed one quad, but he is just not an elegant skater and made mistakes. Evan's LP was just smartly choreographed capitalizing on backloading bonus (same approach as Zagitova recent win). Current rules wouldn't allow Evan to have won based off of backloading.
Anyway, I don't think anyone is saying Evan had (positive) legacy for the sport. But seriously, he is not worst I don't believe.
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Matched. I sould have said matched. And no one have matched that. Neither Rika or Tuktamysheva.
As someone who got into FS post-Sochi, I'm only aware that Lysacek won despite not having a quad over Plushenko who landed one and that he wasn't well liked due to his treatment of Johnny Weir and that people didn't exactly find him an inspiring skater, but why a slap in the face? Hanyu won Sochi with 2 falls but the math checked out so (almost) nobody considers it a slap in the face of FS.
I guess that the fact that basically almost everyone else bombed the FS and that he skated an epic SP is why most of people don't considers it as a slap in the face, and a more memorable win. Not mentioning that Hanyu himself is an inspiring skater. Way more inspiring than Lysacek.
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Lycasek was criticised for not having a quad. The reason why it is considered a travesty is because he provided little to no quality in what he did. Average quality jumps, spins and footwork, with bad programs. Everyone else in the top 4 (+ Kozuka) had something more to offer in their performances, even if not completely "clean" like Lycasek, and it was debatable if backoading jumps (especially of his lacking quality) was enough to trump them.
Since he was also the reigning world champion, it was thought that his reputation and backing from a big fed gave him a leg up while playing it completely safely for the win.
Just to emphasise how average he was in terms of technique, Yuna Kim the women's OGM was better across the board in her quality of her spins, footwork, and skating skills, and even had the better 3Lz+3T.
Since he was also the reigning world champion, it was thought that his reputation and backing from a big fed gave him a leg up while playing it completely safely for the win.
Just to emphasise how average he was in terms of technique, Yuna Kim the women's OGM was better across the board in her quality of her spins, footwork, and skating skills, and even had the better 3Lz+3T.
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Evan's rivalry with Johnny Weir has been turned on its head, I don't know why. Johnny was always making snide remarks and innuendo about Evan. Evan chose not to respond. The one time he did, his temper flared because Johnny had publicly questioned Evan's sexuality. Afterward, Evan apologized for his remark and went on to say (I'm paraphrasing) that he (meaning "I, Evan") should never respond that way, even when provoked.
For the record, Evan won over Plushenko on the strength of his technical mark in the free skate. That included marks for higher quality: his higher GOE marks. I remember Sandra Bezic looking at the judges' scores and saying, about Evan: "GOE, GOE, GOE." After the event, she also noted that Evan and Evgeni got identical component scores, but she said, "I don't see how that can be." Meaning she believed Evan's should have been higher.
Besides his well-deserved Olympic Gold Medal, which he won fair and square according to the rules in 2010 (much like Alina Zagitova did in 2018) .... Evan's great legacy is that in the sht-storm that followed his winning, when people all over the world were maligning him and his skating, his response was always positive to his fellow competitors. Several US television interviewers asked Evan why he thought Evgeni Plushenko did such un-sportsmanlike things such as (1)stalking out of the K&C and (2)(most horribly, IMHO) when he came out to get the silver medal, he leaped up to the top, gold medal position. Just for a second, but it was clear what Evgeni intended. Evan's response was invariably to explain graciously that Plushenko had specifically come out of retirement and re-trained to win another gold medal, so his performance carried that extra emotional weight. Whereas Evan himself only had wished and hoped and worked to skate as well as he possibly could at the Olympics.
Evan was a Great competitor. If you look at his record from 2005-2010, that's clear. AND being a Great Competitor means also, IMHO, that an athlete is able to respect all their competitors enough to be gracious in victory or defeat.
That is Evan Lysacek's true legacy.
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Well, obviously you can't expect any of the men at the 2010 Olympics to aspire to the standard set by Yuna Kim. A glance at the GOEs shows what the judges thought. Kim got as much in GOE (17.40) as Lysacek (9.64) and Plushenko 7.86) combined. (Well, I guess strictly speaking the Plushenko/Lysacek tag team edged Kim by a tenth of a point in terms of quality of technical elements.)chopinskate said:
My takeaway from the men's competition was, it's not who is the best skater, it's who skates the best. 2010 Plushenko was not 2006 Plushenko. It should have been between Takahashi and Lambiel (with sweet-edges Kozuka also to be considered). But Lysacek brought his all and squeezed out every tenth of a CoP point that he had in him.
The competition ushered in the next chapter in the continuing debate, "are quads valued too highly or not highly enough."
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