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- Feb 14, 2018
I don’t want to re-litigate Sochi, I want to be fair to those who aren’t fans of Yuna, but I also was trying to explain why “Yuna is the greatest of all time” is a relatively mainstream opinion.
What skaters have left the biggest legacy?
- Thread starter rugbyfan
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I don’t want to re-litigate Sochi, I want to be fair to those who aren’t fans of Yuna, but I also was trying to explain why “Yuna is the greatest of all time” is a relatively mainstream opinion.
- Joined
- Feb 14, 2018
I didn't say that for the Sochi thing, but because it appears that she's among your favorites, if not your favorite
The greatest of all time for me is my avatar, so i guess that i'm not only outside the mainstream opinion but also an exception
She is one of my favourite skaters. I also just admire her for staying sane and never breaking under all she endured (breaking into figure skating in a country with no figure skating culture or ISU clout, carrying the pressure of a nation on her shoulders as a teenager, etc.). But I also liked Sotnikova, which isn’t allowed when Sochi Drama begins and everyone goes into trench warfare mode. [emoji16]
Also, you have good taste.
I feel like there are pre- and post- 6.0 GOATs, and within the 6.0 era, we have the legacy of the original greats (Axel, Salchow, Heine, Button, etc.), then the icons who shaped the sport for a generation to come (Kwan, Browning, etc.). And those who have a legacy in the sport are those faces who immediately rise to the consciousness of more casual fans when they hear “figure skating” — say those words and some will recall Kwan’s iconic spiral, and those born later will probably think of Mao, Yuna, Julia, or someone else entirely. But there are names that will always be synonymous with the sport, and I’m willing to give an impassioned (but hopefully at least somewhat balanced!) case for anyone. 
Yuna had a cultural impact, even in the West, that few athletes from any sport ever achieve. It really was insane. I wonder how many people remember Mao landing three 3As at the same Olympics. Far too few, I’d assume.
Personally, I hate the "greatest of all time" designation. There will always be differences of opinion.
"One of the greatest of all time" is a much safer statement, easier to generate a consensus.
Fortunately this thread allows for many different kinds of big legacies, with no limit on the number of skaters who might qualify.
"One of the greatest of all time" is a much safer statement, easier to generate a consensus.
Fortunately this thread allows for many different kinds of big legacies, with no limit on the number of skaters who might qualify.
IDK.....I actually really enjoy reading GOAT debates for any sport, so long as they don’t devolve into a caustic back-and-forth over whose fave is better. It’s satisfying to point to that one person who defined/dominated an era, although sometimes it really is too close to call. You don’t have to be the GOAT to have a legacy, either, of course.
I can’t wait to argue over who is the GOAT of the +5/-5 era in a couple of quads.
I can’t wait to argue over who is the GOAT of the +5/-5 era in a couple of quads.
- Joined
- Feb 14, 2018
Indeed. Comparing across eras is just too difficult. The hype around world record scores really didn’t help skating — it implies that we can make 1:1 comparisons across eras, when just basic rule changes often make that task impossible.
:thumbsup:
If ISU doesn't change the system again before those two quads.
"Greatest of all time" by definition implies that their greatness transcends the era in which they competed and would hold up against all other skaters from all other eras.
Which is why it's kind of silly to annoint one.
Within a given era and discipline, sometimes there is a clear standout. But compared to others from all other times, there will generally be plenty of room for debate.
Which is why it's kind of silly to annoint one.
Within a given era and discipline, sometimes there is a clear standout. But compared to others from all other times, there will generally be plenty of room for debate.
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- Aug 26, 2017
Yuna's silver was a gold in the hearts of most in the skating community. There will never be the "greatest of all time" but Yuna is by far the most successful COP skater. Never finishing off the podium in her decade long career is legendary. She was the best all around skater.
It's more 4 seniors seasons + 4 competitions in a quad. 6 full seasons if we count junior seasons.
Still impressive, since it's already hard to finish on every podium in a single season.
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- Mar 5, 2014
In terms of Japanese skaters currently competing both Rika and Mai have been quite vocal about Mao being their biggest inspiration and I can sense Mao's legacy living on through their skating though their styles are uniquely their own, with the triple axels combined with intricate footwork in Rika and both Mai and Rika having an expressive power, fine flexibility and erect posture that focuses more on full body movement and excellent, smooth skating skills with deceptive speed reminiscent of Mao, and in terms of expressive power combined with the triple axel the foundation goes back to Midori Ito, who was a big inspiration for Mao, Midori having good flexibility for her time especially for a skater with so much power. I think Midori and Mao left a legacy for the tech revolution in women's skating today.
To me, the greatest of all time is in the eye of the beholder to a large extent in such a subjective sport much like music, and for me it isn't dependent on who accumulated the most medals or highest scores but the one who leaves behind the most memorable and moving performances which for me is Mao and then Midori and Chen Lu with her fabulous skating skills, lovely delayed rotation, marvelous musicality which I sense Mao shares with her. I immediately thought of Mao's legacy when I saw Rika's marvelously moving and technically impressive NHK freeskate, especially when she said after the performance that the most important thing for her was to get as close to Mao as possible because she adored her (translated from Japanese), though again Rika has her own unique style.
To me, the greatest of all time is in the eye of the beholder to a large extent in such a subjective sport much like music, and for me it isn't dependent on who accumulated the most medals or highest scores but the one who leaves behind the most memorable and moving performances which for me is Mao and then Midori and Chen Lu with her fabulous skating skills, lovely delayed rotation, marvelous musicality which I sense Mao shares with her. I immediately thought of Mao's legacy when I saw Rika's marvelously moving and technically impressive NHK freeskate, especially when she said after the performance that the most important thing for her was to get as close to Mao as possible because she adored her (translated from Japanese), though again Rika has her own unique style.
- Joined
- Feb 24, 2012
Biggest Legacy is tough. You are talking number 1 which on this forum is bound to be full of controversy. So I agree that would take out Baiul, Buttle, Browning, Lambiel et al. It is hard because we have a very "biased" viewership here. We do not have a lot of those who know much about the Protopopovs, Sonya Henjie, Dick Button, Peggy Fleming, Dorothy Hamel and whoever else from the early and mid 1900's. Certainly Michelle Kwan, Yuna Kim, even Mao Asada, maybe Yuzuru Hanyu, Katarina Witt are possible candidates as to winning but Legacies as to innovation then Torvill and Dean; John Curry, Toller Cranston, Kurt Browning, Jeffrey Buttle, Stephane Lambiel, Patrick Chan come to mind. Prolific champions then you get to Kwan, Kim, Plushenko, Hanyu, Witt, Now combining both then Torvill and Dean, Gordeeva and Grinkov. Short time but a legacy then Baiul, Denise Biellman, Midori Ito, Yagudin. Skaters who didn't imho leave legacies but who won OGM would be like Evan L. or Shizuka, Tara L and Sarah Hughes. But there will be many opinions.
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- Jun 21, 2003
I think what is remarkable about this record is that Kim NEVER finished off the podium at ANY competition at ANY level. Her first international competition was the Triglav Trophy in 2002 (first Novice). The next year she did not compete internationally, but won her national championship. In the 2003-04 season she won the Golden Bear (Novice). Then she was off to the races competing in competition as a junior or senior in at least one competition every year from 2004-5 to 2013-14, except for 2011-12.
Here she is at her first international event.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=l33Ia8pUVgU&t=1m13s
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- Joined
- Jun 21, 2003
You are a tough judge! All of Biellmann, Ito and Yagudin went to Worlds 6 straight years. In Yagudin's case he won four, with one silver and one bronze.
I think the thing is that each poster have his own definition of legacy.
Ito skated until 22yo without break. She came back one more year at 26yo. That's not short IMHO.
:thumbsup:
- Joined
- Jun 21, 2003
She's still competing! Here she is at the 2018 ISU Adult Championships, Elite Ladies' division.
https://youtu.be/9A2fPsBxXZQ
