Junior Worlds: Men's FS

USA's Tomoki Hiwatashi won the gold in the Men's event at the 2019 Junior World Figure Skating Championships in what was his third appearance. Russia's Roman Savosin rose from sixth to capture the silver, improving from his fifth-place finish last year, while Daniel Grassl of Italy pocketed the bronze in his debut at this event.

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Lots of changes in placements here! What are your thoughts?

I had hoped that Camden would skate well, but he didn't (even if it was better than what I saw of him last time), I was very happy for Tomoki - and those reactions in the K&C were just priceless - while I thought Roman skated very well and deservedly got first place FS. But, the SP definitely counts as well, so fair is fair for Tomoki getting gold and Roman silver. Nice to see an Italian once again on the podium - it never happens, and then suddenly twice in a row. Very juniorish skate (which can't be said of the other two medallists who skated more maturely), but it is the JWC after all. And Daniel does the quad loop...my favourite quad and so few men do it (well Yuzuru does too, but that's another level altogether). Sad for Alex as well, who did not have his day. Steven looks very promising, no matter that he didn't yet get a medal (but he did get a small one for his FS). He's got years to improve as he is very young. Admittedly, I had hoped for more quality after yesterdays fantastic event, but it still was enjoyable to watch. And when someone wins who has struggled so much, that's just awesome. Congrats to all three medallists!

It was a disaster
Well not a disaster, just not...what I expected or any of us wanted

ANY OF US? For me and many many others, this was EXACTLY what we wanted. Makes up for last year when Alex Krasnozhon lost out on a JWC gold due to an injury he still struggles to overcome.

It’s certainly what I wanted or at least, cheers to Tomoki. I wish Alex K. and Camden had skated up to their potential, but ice is slippery....

I said in the comp thread, it’s the junior men. Anything and everything can happen, which is what makes it so great:agree:

Congrats to Tomoki!!! I got my American win (thankfully it was not Alex K).

Congrats to Roman on silver!!!

Congrats to Artur on 4th!!!

Better luck next time to Camden, Joseph, and Koshiro :agree:

So I got half of what I wanted

Lots of time violations....

chuckm said:

ANY OF US? For me and many many others, this was EXACTLY what we wanted. Makes up for last year when Alex Krasnozhon lost out on a JWC gold due to an injury he still struggles to overcome.

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I think the poster was talking about overal competition. Who won in the end is not the main thing which defines competitions, but the game itself. And that was a bad game :disagree:

Baron Vladimir said:

I think the poster was talking about overal competition. And it was generaly bad. Who won in the end is not the main thing which defines competitions, but the game itself :disagree:

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And this was a fine competition.

What defines a competition is not ten skaters in a row all landing jumps; it is the *competition*. Whether the ice monster bites you or not.

I’ve said it before, I’ll say it again, it’s why I love the junior men. :luv17:So many different styles, so many different strengths, and sometimes, not so many clean skates. Don’t get me wrong, I love clean skates as much as the next person, but it doesn’t make or break a comp for me.

I liked this comp:thumbsup:

So anyone who says they didn’t like this comp because of the ice monster, that’s an opinion they’re certainly entitled to, but they don’t speak for “us”.

Well, it was an interesting competition and i can give a plus for that. But performances were bad overall, no matter you like particular skaters or not. Maybe only Savosin gave his best performance from this season and even he had 3 URs in his program. Basically all the other skaters had much better outgoings this season. Which says a lot.

It was a messy FS, but I still preferred this year over last as the competition was way more interesting.
Congrats to Tomoki on winning and for a stellar 2nd half of the season overall. Seemingly going nowhere results-wise for two and a half seasons after his JW bronze had to be mentally taxing and discouraging, but he kept at it. Proving it ain't over 'till it's over. :thumbsup: (though of course at some point you have to deliver before it's too late- which Tomoki did!)

I've said everything that needed to be said about Camden, I think. But seriously, I beg, switch to Krall. He'd gain a lot more stability in his jump execution without his artistry being compromised. There is too much chaos with Tom Z and Tammy both trying to be the boss(or whatever is going on in that camp...) and seemingly none of their pupils getting sound guidance.

As for the juniors next season, I'm really looking forward to Artur and Stephen's rivalry. And perhaps Samsonov will have a say as well.

Baron Vladimir said:

I think the poster was talking about overal competition. Who won in the end is not the main thing which defines competitions, but the game itself. And that was a bad game :disagree:

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Agree, this is the price we pay for such an amazing short program.

I was expecting Tomoki to win and he did. He was the skater here with the best combination of TES and PCS and had the highest scores this season prior to this competition. He added another quad after 4CC and that may not have been the best choice since he doubled it. But, I think he is the rightful winner. His spins are great!

I am happy Roman got a medal! He improved his SS and performance quality so much this year. I really enjoy watching him skate! His jump technique is scary it is amazing he lands jumps. I hope he works on it. He would be a fine addition to the Russian senior men if he stay consistent.

Happy Italy got another medal but I feel Grassl was the one skater who was overscored in both the short and long program. I would have had him lower.

Camden’s long was a disappointment, as expected which is sad because he is one of my favorite skaters here (Camden and Artur ). I have heard that the rink he trains at is so crowded that it is hard to practice lps at full speed this maybe one reason the skaters there tend to fall apart in the lp. Hopefully, he finds a way to fix this issue.

So what are JGP and next years JW spots gonna look like?

Step Sequence4 said:

So what are JGP and next years JW spots gonna look like?

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JW Spots
3 spots: USA, RUS
2 spots: ITA, CAN, FRA, GEO, JPN
1 spot: everyone else

JGP Spots
2 entries 7 events: USA, RUS, ITA
1 entry 7 events: CAN, FRA, GEO
1 entry 6 events: JPN, AZE, CZE, UKR
1 entry 5 events: ISR, AUT, TUR, KOR, SWE, GER
1 entry 4 events: CHN, EST, THA, BLR
1 entry 3 events: SUI, KAZ, CRO, ESP, BUL, GBR, POL
1 entry 2 events: everyone else

If any spots from the first three groups aren't used, the priority for extra spots is CAN, FRA, GEO (in that order, though practically, all spots will go to CAN)

Will Italy even have enough skaters to fill all of their JGP spots? I am so jealous right now..

(edit: oh wait Canada will probably get those spots? yayyyy)

Noxchild said:

Will Italy even have enough skaters to fill all of their JGP spots? I am so jealous right now..

(edit: oh wait Canada will probably get those spots? yayyyy)

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oh dear, believe me you don't need to be jealous i'm afraid the answer is no

2019 Junior Men's Worlds: A Horrific Display of Technique

There is currently a lot of talk about overly pre-rotated jumps, and watching the performances of the Men's podium at 2019 Junior Worlds is a shockingly disturbing example of how bad the problem has become in the sport. All 3 of these boys have poor form and cheats on EVERY jump they do. Their jumps all spin off the ice sideways and look awkward; they lack a strong pop up into the air and have titled body position, with no room left at all as they come down from the jump (no ballon), generally ending in a standstill. These boys have clearly been trained under a system where this glaring mistake is being overlooked and is actually now being actively taught by coaches - teaching skaters to cheat jumps in order to make them easier and abuse the rules.

I first watched the performance of Tomoki Hiwatashi, who won the event. With his very apparent sideways takeoff on the Toeloops (should have been a < call on the opening quad), his Lutz that barely leaves the ice, his Loop and Salchow with a forced upper body and pulled landings, and his clunky Triple Axels where he clearly turns all the way to forwards during takeoff and lands with no speed on a weak edge, I figured his win was going to be yet another example of bad technique being overlooked at the expense of another competitor.

So then I went watched the performance of Roman Savosin, who placed 2nd. Russian guys usually have strong classic jumps, but it seems the cheating has invaded their camp too, because here we have a Russian guy who is using the "spin off the ice" technique more than any in the past. He does at least land the Quad Toe nicely, but there isn't a good explosive quality off the ice and fullness in the air; you can see him clearly swinging into it at the start with a 3/4 turn pre-rotation. His other jumps share this fault and have other troubles; the Triple Axels having a very blatant "turn to forwards" on the takeoff, with a wretched air position and coming down jerky on the landing. His 3Lutz jump has almost no height, but unlike Tomoki who at least doesn't cheat that entrance so bad, Roman does a 3/4 turn pre-rotated takeoff ("sideways"), making this Lutz look even more clunky. His other Triples are similarly spinny, creating a jarring look and having a shortage of rotation.

Finally came the performance of Daniel Grassl, would he save me from the nightmare? Unfortunately no, he has the same problems. The jumps all turn around further than they should on the entrances and do not pop into the air; spinning off the ice rather than leaping off it. There is no flow on the landings because they are still furiously rotating as they land, instead of completing the rotation IN the air and then settling into the ice. Daniel's toeloop is the most cheated of all the boys, turning even more than 3/4 on the entrance; definitely should be called as underrotated.

Furthermore, none of these boys are doing anything interesting artistically and they aren't even displaying great skating skills. Nothing has been gained as a tradeoff of making the jumps easier and smaller, the programs are just worse. Look at what Plushenko was doing at 15 years old, it blows these guys out of the water, and all the way up through Adian Pitkeev in 2014, you can see how vastly superior the jump quality used to be even for young Juniors - https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rfkqg0lRXbU. Up through 2016 things were still fine with the guys, as Daniel Samohin and Nicolas Nadeau had big jumps without cheats. It seems things have changed ever since the success of Vincent Zhou in 2017, reaching the point now where people are removing any semblance of great quality from their jumps, instead focusing only on how they can get it landed without a < call, in a world where judges don't actually look at full rotation properly.