The thing about Rika's 3Aa is that they replace 2As, not the most efficient in terms of points. A 4S from her would either replace her 3S, which would in turn replace a 2T-2Lo if she does 3Lz-Eu-3S, or replace her 3Lo, which in turn replaces her 2T in a 3Lz-3Lo. In essence, Rika's 4S replaces at most two double jumps, which is a base value increase of over 7. Even if she pops the 4S into a 2S, she loses nothing, and we've seen it takes a pop on a 3A and a fall on another 3A to be brought down to no quad/no 3A scoring territory. Next season, she would need two pops and a fall to be on similar scoring to Alyona, and I think we can agree that Alyona doesn't have a PCS edge over her. Rika is also currently not prone to meltdowns. Therefore, it is even more unlikely that Alyona will win against Rika without a 3A herself. The technical gap is too large. Most other skaters will be in the same boat. A 4S and 2x3A is 17.2 base value ahead of 2x2A, 2T+2Lo. Including the short, 4S + 3x3A is 21.9 base value ahead of 3x2A, 2T+2Lo. Only Trusova would have a technical edge over Rika, as it stands.
Worlds: Ladies FS
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The thing about Rika's 3Aa is that they replace 2As, not the most efficient in terms of points. A 4S from her would either replace her 3S, which would in turn replace a 2T-2Lo if she does 3Lz-Eu-3S, or replace her 3Lo, which in turn replaces her 2T in a 3Lz-3Lo. In essence, Rika's 4S replaces at most two double jumps, which is a base value increase of over 7. Even if she pops the 4S into a 2S, she loses nothing, and we've seen it takes a pop on a 3A and a fall on another 3A to be brought down to no quad/no 3A scoring territory. Next season, she would need two pops and a fall to be on similar scoring to Alyona, and I think we can agree that Alyona doesn't have a PCS edge over her. Rika is also currently not prone to meltdowns. Therefore, it is even more unlikely that Alyona will win against Rika without a 3A herself. The technical gap is too large. Most other skaters will be in the same boat. A 4S and 2x3A is 17.2 base value ahead of 2x2A, 2T+2Lo. Including the short, 4S + 3x3A is 21.9 base value ahead of 3x2A, 2T+2Lo. Only Trusova would have a technical edge over Rika, as it stands.
Precisely.
If the tech panel is somewhat doing their job (i.e. calling glaringly obvious URs and outright wrong edges) Rika would have been on the podium.
Here is an estimation of what the TES should look like with BV reduction and GOE=0 (or -5 in case of fall)
SP:
Mariah Bell 3Lz3T< https://youtu.be/KoKrcrDbPyg?t=253 would lose 2 points putting her into 10th place.
FS:
Rika Kihira 3A< https://youtu.be/GxwDjvFHi8k?t=373 would lose 1.5 point
Evgenia Medvedeva 3Lze https://youtu.be/Az05hFUqTiY?t=69 3S3Lo< https://youtu.be/Az05hFUqTiY?t=359 would lose 3.5 points on the lutz and 3 points on the 3S3Lo (6.5 points in total)
Kaori Sakamoto 3Lze https://youtu.be/zClEPP7Ei88?t=106 would lose 3 points.
Satoko Miyahara 3Lz3T<, 3Lz<, 3F<+2T<+2Lo< I'm not going to do the TES calculation
Bradie Tennell 3Lz3T< https://youtu.be/gKyL2eeX974?t=397 would lose 3 points.
I'm not even going into flat edges and not-so-obviouus URs.
Mariah's combo in the short was clearly UR but I don't see an UR on Bradie's
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Thank you!
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How do you know? Have you lived in USSR? How's that connected to Liza Tursynbaeva and her skating? You dropped an accusation without a proof and then you're instantly saying, "let's not continue it". Funny, huh? You possibly have bad blood against Russia which you equate to USSR but here we are discussing figure skating. Please find a better forum for such political diatribes.
And btw, about dual citizenship - this law always existed in Kazakhstan but was not enforced until the most recent times. There were and possibly still are lots of people who held both passports. But that's not the point actually. Why are you and some other posters here so obstinate to accept that Liza is a Muscovite born and grown up here among Russians and Russian culture, claiming Moscow as her hometown? That's just fact, like it or not. Why are these posters so persistent in their will to say, "No, she is Kazakh, period." Incidentally, why aren't you saying, "No, she's Kyrgyz"? Sports-wise, her mom seems to be no less influence on Liza than her dad, judging by her presence at every competition Liza participates. I personally don't care whether Liza identifies herself as Kazakh, Kyrgyz, Russian or none of the above. Why is it so important for you? I'm rooting for Liza because I like her personality (same reason I'm rooting for Bradie and Maria Bell, for example). Some people here seem to prefer "rooting against..." to "rooting for...". Their recent heaping of praises on some Asian female athletes looks like a thinly veiled deep rooting against certain female athletes with Moscow connections. The latter athletes have apparently upset these posters greatly by daring to win in Saitama this year. Get with it. Life is what it is, not what it could be if, and if, and then if once again. Wait for the next chance. Even better, and much better - learn to root for and forget to root against.
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This is not about claiming someone or rooting for/against someone. I really don't care about that at all, I just wanted to clear the rumours because people seem not to know the full picture.
You sure did try to sound like as if she's actually russian, but she competes for Kazakhstan because the competition in Russia is too tough, she had no choice and she has nothing to do with Kazakhstan at all. Messages that she never visited Kazakhstan and simply mailed her passport to Russia clearly indicate what the insinuations were.
Some skaters do that, like Misha Ge for Uzbekistan, but this is not the case at all for Elizabet.
Her parents have strong pride for Kazakhstan and she always represented Kazakhstan internationally even as a novice. That was the reason she was changing a lot of coaches when she was little, and eventually moved to Canada, because they wanted to compete only for Kazakhstan.
She has everything to do with Kazakhstan, it is her home. Her brother is a figure skating coach in Kazakhstan and that is who she aspires to be in the future, to continue Denis Ten's legacy and improve figure skating in Kazakhstan. The fact that she doesn't speak the language does not matter at all, since all Kazakhs are fluent in russian.
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С 2005 года занималась фигурным катанием в ЭШВСМ «Москвич» (Москва) ... Когда Лиза весной 2013 года завоевала "золото" в первенстве Москвы среди юниоров и её включили в сборную Москвы и России, собрался семейный совет и принял решение, что выступать Элизабет будет за Кызылординскую область и Казахстан. Аким Кызылординской области Крымбек Кушербаев взял Лизу под свою опеку. А с весны 2014 года спонсорскую помощь начала оказывать нефтяная компания «СП «Казгермунай»
Since 2005 she skated in club Moscovite (Moscow). When Liza won gold in Moscow juniors competition in spring 2013 and she was included in Moscow and Russia teams, the family council decided that she will be skating for Kyzylorda region and Kazakhstan. The head of Kyzylorda region Kusherbaev became her patron and since spring 2014 the oil company "Kazermugai" has started to sponsor her.
These are facts. She was skating as a Russian and Moscovite for 8 years. When she started to show results the family council made a strategic decision. She immediately received the support that she would hardly have if she kept skating for Russia - even Medvedeva and Zagitova are not sponsored by Russian oil companies. What are the sources that "her parents have strong pride for Kazakhstan" and "she has everything to do with Kazakhstan"?
By the way, novices do not compete internationally - juniors do. And the reason for the decision, once again, is better explained by the fact that in 2013 Russia already dominated the juniors with the worlds sweep by Radionova, Lipnitskaya, Pogorilaya and Liza's career in Russia was far riskier than in Kazakhstan.
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I think the only thing most in here who make comments about Elizabet‘s roots to Kazakhstan want, is for people to stop sharing posts that somehow make it look like she competes for Russia or earned the medal for Russia. She did not. She might have lived in Russia for quite a long time now, she might speak Russian but in the end, she only represents one country - Kazakhstan. So, the medal wasn‘t Russia‘s, she didn‘t earn the spots for Russia. It doesn’t matter what influenced her choice - family, better chances, sponsoring. Because in the end Kazakhstan was the country she chose. So, you might feel like ”she‘s one of you“, or “Russian at heart“ but don‘t act like she won silver for Russia. Because it takes away from what she did for her country: She made history by being the first Kazakh lady on the podium. And they should be rightfully proud of her.
How did this thread get here?? Probably because nationality and nationalism, wars, the movement of people, etc. have left us with this crazy mess.
All of you are correct of Elizabet and are just arguing semantics at this point. Yes, she represents one country and has deep ties to it but that does not negate that her country of residence has a huge influence on her. It's like with Maria Sharapova, yes she has always represented Russia, but rightfully there are some Americans who feel very tied to her culturally because she has lived here for so long.
Questions of nationality and identity are very complex and should be left to the individual. I myself play the part of an American on this forum but I have ties to Central America and the Caribbean. I could represent any of those countries (in a dream world where I have athletic talent
) and Americans would have every right to say, but he lived the vast majority of his life here and we have a claim on him too.
I hope we can move on from this topic of discussion because no one will win this, Elizabet is several things all at once.
All of you are correct of Elizabet and are just arguing semantics at this point. Yes, she represents one country and has deep ties to it but that does not negate that her country of residence has a huge influence on her. It's like with Maria Sharapova, yes she has always represented Russia, but rightfully there are some Americans who feel very tied to her culturally because she has lived here for so long.
Questions of nationality and identity are very complex and should be left to the individual. I myself play the part of an American on this forum but I have ties to Central America and the Caribbean. I could represent any of those countries (in a dream world where I have athletic talent
) and Americans would have every right to say, but he lived the vast majority of his life here and we have a claim on him too. I hope we can move on from this topic of discussion because no one will win this, Elizabet is several things all at once.
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I cannot read people's minds to understand what is the only thing they want. When I read that Lizbet has "everything to do with Kazakhstan, it is her home" I see that it contradicts the facts and tell about that.
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I can tell you how ) whatif wrote a short post which read more or less like "it's Russian podium sweep", with a very clear tongue in cheek. I replied, also totally jokingly, like "don't worry, no one knows Liza is Russian". Frivolous intonations were quite obvious in both posts. But some people took that very seriuosly and started to ask questions like, "How come you call her Russian?" Honestly, Your Honor, I did try to ask them to tone down a notch. I told them several times that sports is not the right place for all that (pseudo-)patriotic thing but all in vain ))) Y'know, Your Honor, some people perhaps need to take some benzo to calm down ))) Sorry couldn't resist )
I can be a very sarcastic person and I completely saw that in the original posts. I was cracking up when I read them. However, this being the internet and people not being able to read tone all the the time we sometimes have to add emoticons so people get the joke. I tend to add in a devil or a grin on a lot of posts just to make sure people understand they should not take me too seriously.ETA: The nationalism part of my post was meant to explain why people need to know you're joking when you talk about such things. Without explaining some people immediately get up in arms because there are historical slights they're responding to. By not acknowledging Kazakhstan some people think you're slighting a country that has historically been disrespected.
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ETA: The nationalism part of my post was meant to explain why people need to know you're joking when you talk about such things. Without explaining some people immediately get up in arms because there are historical slights they're responding to. By not acknowledging Kazakhstan some people think you're slighting a country that has historically been disrespected.
No one "disrespected" Kazakhstan more than Sasha Baron Cohen. But after a while even with respect to him the Kazakh officials expressed gratitude because, first, the tourism grew substantially, and, second, because they had to invest big time in the PR of their country image which has drastically improved.
With Tursynbaeva to change federations was mainly the decision of her parents, not hers. And there are clear reasons and clear logic which I already explained. To add more evidence that the decision was nothing like "she always felt that Kazakhstan was her home" there is a quotation from her mother that at first they wanted Liza to skate for Kyrgyzstan. But the officials there were not interested as there is no figure skating federation and they did not want to solve the problem. There was no figure skating federation in Kazakhstan either. But they added Liza to speed skating federation.
So many nationalistic theories when in fact one should just praize the immense talent and courage (to go with a quad in the first year after such dramatic changes) of Elizabeth and Eteri.
Alina's PCS - yes she deserves high marks for transitions but her crossovers are not pretty. Her skating skills do not match her her jumping ability. Posture needs improvement and she is not particularly fast. The judges seem to have no ability to score PCS based on reality.
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Any link to the tourism article?
Never in my life heard of any Kazakh person expressing gratitude towards Cohen or his movie. Good imagination, my friend. Kazakhs actually detest both the movie and the actor. They decided she would compete for kaz AFTER winning Moscow championship and being included in Russian team and getting funding. This doesn't look like she was afraid of competition, does it?
and where else could she skate for 8 years if her parents lived in Moscow at the time? should they have sent her away, so people would consider her not a moscovite?
They made that decision in 2013, because only in 2013 they decided that Elizabet will become a professional figure skater, take it seriously and represent Kazakhstan, whereas before that they didn't think it was going to be her career.
And also, if you don't know, all skaters in Russian national team get funding for their skates, costumes and training from the government. They don't need any company to do that, they also get a salary on top of that funding! Even skaters like Sakhanovich who might not have results right now, to this day still get funding and support from russian government, so did Eliza in 2013, why would she ditch that?
Btw oil company sponsors her, because kazakh federation can't do that. Getting funding from oil companies is also not something crazy in Kazakhstan, anyone can write a letter to an oil company and they can decide whether to pay for your education/training etc. Sometimes students get their education funded like that.
Even before "russian coaching ban" and 2013 she used to get in trouble for representing Kazakhstan internationally, that is the reason she changed the coaches that often as a child, she would compete in some competitions in Russia, but would compete only for Kazakhstan when she would do something internationally.
And yes, novices do have international competitions, here are a few where Lilbet competed for Kazakhstan before 2013:
Rooster Cup 2011, NRW Trophy 2011, Chrystal Blade in 2010 and 2011.
Full list here -> http://www.fskate.ru/skaters/2064.html
And her parent's pride for Kazakhstan comes from the fact that her father talks about it a lot in interviews. They filmed an interview at their home long time ago, check that one out.
Ps. everyone I'm sorry this comes off as an off topic and a bit like a quarrel, that was not my intention, it's just I got a tiny bit annoyed by misinformation being spread by people who haven't stepped a foot in Kazakhstan and don't know much about Elizabet, but act as if they do.
Actually that's not true, federations begin to send skater to international competitions at the novice level. Such events are usually paired with the junior level as well and events like that are the Asian Open and Golden Bear.
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Any link to the tourism article?
I like to have new friends! They make my life complete.
"In the days leading up to and following Borat's release, the Kazakh government hired two PR firms and took out ads in the New York Times, US News and World Report, and on CNN to show the public the real Kazakhstan. Some ads were framed as unrelated to the film, while others were explicit about using the film as a jumping-off point for educating the public.
After years of low-key resentment, Kazakhstan's then foreign minister Yerzhan Kazykhanov told politicians in 2012 that the film contributed to a tenfold increase in tourism to the nation—and that he was grateful to the film as a result.
"We are a proud nation," Aisha Mukasheva, a spokesperson for the Embassy of Kazakhstan in the United States, says. "In our 25 years of independence, we have a lot to be proud of: nuclear disarmament, our economic development, and our growing role on the world stage." In clipped but direct speech, Mukasheva says Kazakhstan harbors no ill will toward the film today, explaining away any individuals' tensions in recent years as equivalent to the irk an Englishman might feel at being equated to Mr. Bean. "It was a comedy—not a documentary," she says while explaining the nation's current position toward the film.
Mukasheva shares Kazykhanov's previously stated view that Borat gave Kazakhstan a useful media jolt and increased tourism."
https://www.vice.com/en_us/article/9bk74a/kazakhstan-borat
I tried to give Zagitova another try but really couldn't finish watching her program. I don't think I'll ever understand people who gets excited about her skating. She has zero musicality, zero sense of carriage and alignment. The program is a busy, incoherent mess. The only thing positive about her jumps is that they are most of the time rotated, but there's no beautiful entry, air position or landing (what's with Eteri skaters' slouched upper bodies and unsquare shoulders on their landings?).
What a tragedy for skating that she's an Olympic and World champion. You can sleep through her entire program (programs) and not miss anything important.
What a tragedy for skating that she's an Olympic and World champion. You can sleep through her entire program (programs) and not miss anything important.
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Different strokes for different folks. Although I agree that her Carmen was rushed especially in the second half so that it was hard to connect with it, Alinadelivered POTO brilliantly. And DQ was a masterpiece when she was not only deep into the role of Kitry but also hit all the key notes in her best performances (like Europeans).
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Zero: The Biography of a Dangerous Idea.
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How convenient that you cut out only some parts of the article??
How about these:
In the rearview, it's easy to see why Kazakhstan found Borat insulting. The film's Kazakhstani scenes were shot in a grubby Romanian town; the title character's "Kazakh" speech was a mix of Hebrew and Polish slang and gibberish; and almost every detail the film presented about the country was a complete and unflattering fabrication. Even though one could argue Borat was satire that played on Americans' ignorance regarding the Central Asian republic, some critics chided Cohen for punching down in his portrayal of the country.
Specificially, Kazaks didn't appreciate the fact that Cohen was blithely filling a void of ignorance with an over-the-top image of their country as a dirt-poor, rabidly anti-Semitic, and misogynistic shithole.
It quickly became clear, though, that bigwigs in Kazakhstan's capital Astana were pissed off.
Borat gave Kazakhstan a useful media jolt and increased tourism—but not necessarily in the long-term. She claims the film comes up increasingly less in conversation with foreigners, and insists that Kazakhstan is better known to tourists for its skiing, hiking, and scenery today than for the film.
One minister sarcastically saying thank you does not mean the whole nation appreciated any of that or that any of the people or ministers are actually thankful.
Let's close this topic, shall we? Stop acting as if you know Kazakhstan or Elizabet so well please, your knowledge about Kazakhstan, it's people and Elizabet is subpar (and turns out about figure skating too).
I've lived my whole life here, let's just say I know somewhat more than you about my own country, our culture and of course our skaters.
