2019-20 Russian Ladies' Figure Skating

IndiaP12 said:

She trains with Eteri

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Is she going to be a junior this season? Because I do like her

nussnacker said:

you can discuss whoever you want. Why tell others not to talk about a particular skater?
If you want to talk about Zhenya or other skaters you like, go for it!

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Exactly. I can't believe posters here don't remember all the negativity towards Alina in this forum during this past season. It was a constant barrage of "oh she looks scared like she's about to cry before each competition" and "oh she hates competing, she can't handle the pressure" and "oh, she only won Olympics because the pressure was off." It was mostly posters predicting her downfall and the necessity of her leaving Eteri. It was posters commenting on how she must have an ED based on the comments she made. I can go on and on, because I had to read through this forum during the entire season and have an internal debate on whether I should respond to these posters or just ignore them. I mostly just ignored them to keep my sanity. Flanker, Finley, Lesnar and other Alina fans mostly kept to the fan fest because The Edge seemed like such a toxic place to be. Now, this thread is very different mostly because Alina fans have come out of the woodwork to post positively about her.

Having said all that, I can completely understand fabienne's wish to discuss other Russian ladies skaters. I think posts about Alina (and Evgenia) often attract very polarizing views, whereas the other skaters (3A) tend to have more neutral fans. At least when they are talking about 3A, people are more polite and it doesn't disintegrate into a love-hate fest. I wish Evgenia fans would post more in here too. I remember when in prior seasons, there was always a bunch of Evgenia news in the Russian Ladies thread and now there is hardly anything. I think Evgenia fans vastly outnumber her hater-s, and they should not feel threatened.

Seruleane said:

Exactly. I can't believe posters here don't remember all the negativity towards Alina in this forum during this past season. It was a constant barrage of "oh she looks scared like she's about to cry before each competition" and "oh she hates competing, she can't handle the pressure" and "oh, she only won Olympics because the pressure was off." It was mostly posters predicting her downfall and the necessity of her leaving Eteri. It was posters commenting on how she must have an ED based on the comments she made. I can go on and on, because I had to read through this forum during the entire season and have an internal debate on whether I should respond to these posters or just ignore them. I mostly just ignored them to keep my sanity. Flanker, Finley, Lesnar and other Alina fans mostly kept to the fan fest because The Edge seemed like such a toxic place to be. Now, this thread is very different mostly because Alina fans have come out of the woodwork to post positively about her.

Having said all that, I can completely understand fabienne's wish to discuss other Russian ladies skaters. I think posts about Alina (and Evgenia) often attract very polarizing views, whereas the other skaters (3A) tend to have more neutral fans. At least when they are talking about 3A, people are more polite and it doesn't disintegrate into a love-hate fest. I wish Evgenia fans would post more in here too. I remember when in prior seasons, there are always a bunch of Evgenia news in the Russian Ladies thread and now there is hardly anything. I think Evgenia fans vastly outnumber her hater-s, and they should not feel threatened.

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We zhenya fans do the same , we mostly talk inside the fanfest I think because for me this forum is or was a bit too toxic, that is also for me the reason why I do not post things about zhenya in here. I have really no nerve to read or get I to heated discussion. Again it is still in my memories of how many here wished her to fail in here . And it leaves a bad taste in my thought if you understand what I mean. I can't speak for anyone else but those are at least my reasons why I will not bring zhenya up on my own in here. And i also just jumped over most the posts pertaining to alina negatively. Yes I was worried because she was injured this season but I was also worried about zhenya or I am worried for alena as well. And since she bombed at world's in 2018 duo to nerves I think, I naturally wondered if she could handle the pressure.where she was almost eteris only senior woman. When the pressure was on her more so than the season before But I also would never wish for her not to be able to handle it.

fabienne1996 said:

Is she going to be a junior this season? Because I do like her

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No, she just turned 11 (she will be a junior in 2 years)

IndiaP12 said:

No, she just turned 11 (she will be a junior in 2 years)

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Ok thanks, I think she will be a sight to see. Somehow she has something about her by which you remember her .

fabienne1996 said:

Ok thanks, did she train somewhere else before that? I somehow was always confused cause I think I read she was once part of the snow leopard but then I saw fotos of her in what looks a trainingsroom at Crystal. That's why I was always asking myself where she trains.

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I think she used to live/or train in Arkhangelsk/Severodvinsk? I don’t know when she moved to Moscow

I would love to see more skaters discussed.

Anyone who thinks that is because I dislike Alina please, I don’t know enough about her to like her or dislike her. ETA: I know who she is, I know what she’s accomplished, I know nothing about Alina personally, so I don’t know enough :think:

The simple fact is that folks have said feel as though they can’t post because they will be attacked. That’s not petty. That’s not “oh my god you’re disrespecting Alina”. That’s not “everyone wants to talk about Alina because she’s the most wonderful thing ever”.

They feel as though if they will be attacked if they support Zhenya. The way to solve that?

Say “Please come in here and support Zhenya and I won’t attack you. I may argue or disagree, but I won’t attack.”

Problem solved.

Seruleane said:

I think posts about Alina (and Evgenia) often attract very polarizing views, whereas the other skaters (3A) tend to have more neutral fans. At least when they are talking about 3A, people are more polite ...

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Just wait till next year!

flanker said:

Also, what prevents you from bringing some interresting/important topic about them here? I doubt anybody would have anything against it.

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Hey, I've tried bringing up Liza and Sofia in this thread and all I've got for my trouble is "Ew, Mishin choreography", "Sofia's jumps are tiny" or "Liza can only jump and she's a boring skater anyway."

So, I don't bother any more.

el henry said:

I would love to see more skaters discussed.

Anyone who thinks that is because I dislike Alina please, I don’t know enough about her to like her or dislike her. ETA: I know who she is, I know what she’s accomplished, I know nothing about Alina personally, so I don’t know enough :think:

The simple fact is that folks have said feel as though they can’t post because they will be attacked. That’s not petty. That’s not “oh my god you’re disrespecting Alina”. That’s not “everyone wants to talk about Alina because she’s the most wonderful thing ever”.

They feel as though if they will be attacked if they support Zhenya. The way to solve that?

Say “Please come in here and support Zhenya and I won’t attack you. I may argue or disagree, but I won’t attack.”

Problem solved.

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You can discuss them, pal =) Exactly what I said previously, instead of saying "can we please discuss someone else?", wouldn't it be better to actually start a discussion?
saying "can we please stop talking about her?" (the comment that people responded to) does not equal to "I want to talk about other skaters"
It's kinda messed up to tell people to not talk about one particular skater in the thread that is open for all russian skaters.

For Evgenia fans and anonymoose_au:
You can discuss Zhenya (or anyone else) as much as you want, not that I or any other participant of this forum holds the power to tell someone whether or not they have the right to talk about her.
Zhenya's fans have as much right to talk about her as anyone else in this thread
don't think anyone attacked the fans themselves. If someone expresses an opinion you disagree with about the skater you like, it's not a personal attack at you.
People might have different opinions, and in this thread opinions can be both positive and negative.
If they are "toxic", a good choice will be to report them to moderators.
However, if not anything here is praise and love towards your favorite, you just gotta deal with the world, where believe it or not, there's no way one skater can please everyone. There's absolutely no person on this planet, who's liked by everyone, so you just gotta accept this harsh reality.
If it's a negative and constructive opinion, I don't see anything wrong with it. If it's positive, and you agree with it, support it and contribute to discussion.
If it's downright "bashing", then report it to the forum staff, and it will get deleted, and maybe the violator will receive a strike/warning.
dealing with people having different opinions is probably the only way for all threads, aside from fanfests =)

anonymoose_au said:

Hey, I've tried bringing up Liza and Sofia in this thread and all I've got for my trouble is "Ew, Mishin choreography", "Sofia's jumps are tiny" or "Liza can only jump and she's a boring skater anyway."

So, I don't bother any more.

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It doesn't matter what others think about yours or fabis favorite skaters it matters what you think about them. And yes Sofia and Liza were great stories last season and will be interesting to follow them this season. As it will be in following other Russian ladies.

Scott512 said:

It doesn't matter what others think about yours or fabis favorite skaters it matters what you think about them. And yes Sofia and Liza were great stories last season and will be interesting to follow them this season. As it will be in following other Russian ladies.

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Yeah, but why post if no-one else cares? They are favourites, but if others don't (and it's a matter of taste or Mishin choreography), why would I want to? I don't want to have to defend them and get upset and angry in the end because I can't change people's taste or even get them to admit other people might enjoy a different style. It happened with T/M and it's draining.

Besides from what I hear the 3A are coming and everyone else might as well give up.

anonymoose_au said:

Hey, I've tried bringing up Liza and Sofia in this thread and all I've got for my trouble is "Ew, Mishin choreography", "Sofia's jumps are tiny" or "Liza can only jump and she's a boring skater anyway."

So, I don't bother any more.

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What exactly were you hoping for? A fanfest? You can't discuss Liza/Sofia without acknowledging their weaknesses. If they want to stay relevant, they truly need a new choreographer, and competitive programs with transitions. It's not even about not liking their "style". I enjoy many styles of skating. But their choreo and transitions are barely existent. Yes, they play to the crowd with faceography and handography and they are perky performers. But up against other Russian girls/women their programs will not be competitive.

LiamForeman said:

What exactly were you hoping for? A fanfest? You can't discuss Liza/Sofia without acknowledging their weaknesses. If they want to stay relevant, they truly need a new choreographer, and competitive programs with transitions.

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No, but is it too much for their positives not to be downplayed? Liza is not just a jumper and even if she was her jumps are superior to any other lady I've seen.

Sofia's consistency is astounding, but you'd think it was no big deal.

As for the choreography well that's the sticking point isn't it? I dislike Eteri/Danill choreography, to me none of it sticks out, none of it captures my attention. However, what's the point in saying so? I loved Liza's programs last season, others did not. Difference is they saw no issue completely denigrating Liza for it - like how dare anyone enjoy this crud?! Well, I enjoyed it and hearing people saying I'm an idiot for doing so isn't my idea of a good time.

anonymoose_au said:

No, but is it too much for their positives not to be downplayed? Liza is not just a jumper and even if she was her jumps are superior to any other lady I've seen.

Sofia's consistency is astounding, but you'd think it was no big deal.

As for the choreography well that's the sticking point isn't it? I dislike Eteri/Danill choreography, to me none of it sticks out, none of it captures my attention. However, what's the point in saying so? I loved Liza's programs last season, others did not. Difference is they saw no issue completely denigrating Liza for it - like how dare anyone enjoy this crud?! Well, I enjoyed it and hearing people saying I'm an idiot for doing so isn't my idea of a good time.

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Don't get so upset about others opinions. Those are just opinions, they won't change anything in the real world =)
As for me, here's my opinion on Liza and Sofia.

There are a lot of positives I enjoy about Liza. I think she's probably the only current skater who truly enjoys every performance she produces.
There's a lot less nervousness and she's so much more relaxed in general. And the only one of all current female skaters around the world, who I am willing to praise for textbook technique on every single jump. She's undeniably #1 on my jumpers list among ladies (current) =)
But I do agree both have a lot of work to do to really stay at the top of the ranks.
For Liza, I think spins, skating skills and all other non-jump movements are holding her back.
It's like with Jason: he's not jumping any quads in SP, but due to high quality of all other elements, like spins etc. he comes ahead of those, who lack that, because most men can't do what he does.
And for Liza it's exactly the opposite, because she specifically lacks those, it's unfortunate, but that fluff piece adds up to a lot of points. And if all other ladies are doing it, then Liza unfortunately is at a weaker position.

I do enjoy her performances nevertheless though =) I think, despite it all, she's got that inner charisma and confidence, knows how to work the crowd and is truly a wonderful performer.
Credits for Zhenya too, I think despite a lot of things I don't like in her skating, she too has a great quality to work the crowd and perform.

As for Sofia, I really like Sofia's free, I think it's very fun. I think her jumps got worse compared to previous years. I think her jumping technique is not good to begin with, and I am surprised Mishin is okay with it, and her jumps are quite small in general. I personally do not believe she'll ever nail 3A, but who knows =) Mishin better work his technician magic to make that happen.
But she was very consistent, you can only wonder what mental strength that girl possesses, nerves of steel! And she does strike me as a skater with a personality more so than some other skaters, I think her liking Ashley Wagner and doing Burlesque program is very fun and unique.

P.S I don't think anyone was calling you anything(an idiot as you wrote) or said "how dare you enjoy this". Don't be too dramatic =)

anonymoose_au said:

Yeah, but why post if no-one else cares? They are favourites, but if others don't (and it's a matter of taste or Mishin choreography), why would I want to? I don't want to have to defend them and get upset and angry in the end because I can't change people's taste or even get them to admit other people might enjoy a different style. It happened with T/M and it's draining.

Besides from what I hear the 3A are coming and everyone else might as well give up.

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Who doesn't care about Liza or Sofia? Liza is a great comeback story and Sofia came a long way last year and seems like a wonderful girl. And there are many other Russian girls to talk about besides Evgenia and Alina. But because it's the offseason and we can't focus on competitions attention is paid to other things like social media or who's doing what music. You should not feel unhappy here but I know sometimes this place gets out of hand and things happen. I think you should post about Evgenia and a few other skaters you like. Some people will react positively to what you write just like they do everyone else.

Arbitrary said:

But how it looks now some of Rus ladies are more media persons than competitive skaters.
Liza and Eugenia of seasoned Seniors and Sasha from new Seniors. Too much of media attention...

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As long as they can balance their media lives and maintaining their skill set, more power to them; my understanding of skating is that winning competitions isn't lucrative, any real money to be made is through endorsement deals. If they don't maintain their skill-set and ability to perform they'll get passed over, there's too much talent right now.

Elana said:

Something to discuss if anyone wants to (all hypothetical and positive!)

So right about now Alena would be pretty much the same age as Alina was last year when she won the olympics. I am curious as to who you guys think is the stronger skater at this exact moment in their careers (Alena now, Alina at Olympics)

This would be considering Alina’s layout at the olympics and her performance quality then as compared to Alena’s typical layout and her performance quality now (I know we haven’t see her compete since January but you can imagine). I’m just intrigued to see if anyone has an opinion on this because I see them both as very strong skaters but in different aspects so it is hard for me to choose which I would think is the better overall package. Had Alena gone to the olympics against Alina at this current stage in her skating would she have won? Of course I know their PCS are currently different due to junior/senior, but I’m more curious in general opinions of their overall skating as a whole not necessarily what the judges may award them. Continuing on this, if both are healthy next season, who would you expect to win between the two given two clean skates and no quads?

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Overall package I think Alena K. is better she looks more natural out on the ice. I'd like to see both of them do programs that was choreographed for the other; Zagitova I'd like to see with something that's slower and lets her be a more expressive vs. the crazy-busy programs she had last year and Kostornaia I'd like to see in something not-so 'soft'.

I'm not sure that this is the spot to do it, so if not let me know, but I just need to vent about TSL a little bit. I know they can be petty and catty, but in a world deprived of skating news sources, it can be hard to ignore them.

Anyhow, this has been bothering me about their segments for a while now, but I'm so tired of them talking down about fans of the current crop of up and coming Russian ladies. I have so much respect for skaters of generations past, but I'm so tired of listening to them go on and on about how no one is like Michelle or Kristi or Tonya these days as if their skating is the only skating that is valid. They are all incredibly talented women, but we're in a new generation now that is pushing towards different goals. Its awfully elitist of them to talk down about "all the young fans on skating forums who are gushing about Kostornaya's new free skate music (which they bashed ad nauseam)" [emoji849]

vesperalvioletta said:

I'm not sure that this is the spot to do it, so if not let me know, but I just need to vent about TSL a little bit. I know they can be petty and catty, but in a world deprived of skating news sources, it can be hard to ignore them.

Anyhow, this has been bothering me about their segments for a while now, but I'm so tired of them talking down about fans of the current crop of up and coming Russian ladies. I have so much respect for skaters of generations past, but I'm so tired of listening to them go on and on about how no one is like Michelle or Kristi or Tonya these days as if their skating is the only skating that is valid. They are all incredibly talented women, but we're in a new generation now that is pushing towards different goals. Its awfully elitist of them to talk down about "all the young fans on skating forums who are gushing about Kostornaya's new free skate music (which they bashed ad nauseam)" [emoji849]

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Tomya? She should not be held up as a standard by TSL. Not a fan of theirs.

As for Alena K it will be interesting to see how great she will become. I think she will be great and very very special if she can remain healthy.

In light of the past few pages of this forum. I guess we as much as everyone else have the right to load up Evgenia content into this forum. Evgenia fans come and ignore those who try to bring her down, let’s push back against the normal posting habits of this forum.
So here goes.

It looks like the program is ready and Averbukh is fully behind her, which is music to my ears.
https://tass.ru/sport/6451191

Latest news on possible dresses for the FS. Is it Evgenia’s? We will have to wait and see!
https://www.instagram.com/p/BxspUb8nxDh/?hl=es

Also look how good those 3S are still in the off season, they may be getting even bigger. Her spins are looking easier for her too!
https://www.instagram.com/p/BxjhIHaoVRP/?igshid=vfy65c85y520