2019-20 Russian Ladies' Figure Skating

Azikin said:

I have been a big fan in the past but now I'm lukewarm towards her at best.

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And now I‘m supposed to believe it’s because of her skating changing rather than just the fact that she dared to leave her coach and you didn‘t like it? Sure thing.

Edwin said:

Indeed, the BOrser method hasn't brought much improved results in two years.

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She HAS improved, anyone who knows a thing or two about jumping technique and doesn’t automatically dislike her because of her coaching change will admit that. The only thing that‘s become worse is her spin stability but what is one to expect with a chronic back injury? And even there, she might be losing levels occasionally but she‘s gained flexibility. So?

The problem isn‘t her lack of improvement, it‘s the insane and rapid technical leap from skaters in her own country that most skaters all over the world struggle to catch up with. Who do we have, exactly, who‘s regularly jumping 3A and quads? Kihira, who‘s been training it for years. Her Russian teammates. You Young. That‘s about it. Zhenya‘s part of a different generation, she grew up in a different era of skating. Staying with Eteri wouldn‘t have changed a single thing. Her results couldn’t have been improved because she was absolutely dominant, or at least top two in the world, before she left Eteri. That was bound to change anyway as soon as 3A came up. No one stays on top of the sport for so long, Zhenya’s dominance was actually a very rare exception. She was smart enough to realize this and made a move for the future. Unless you think she‘d be jumping 4S and 4T by now with Eteri at which I can just say: lmao

She‘s trying her best to improve on all aspects of her skating AND learn new elements. I have no idea whether she‘ll be successful but it‘s not like she‘s not trying. If that means she needs to retire for some people (I mean, Plushenko... could it be any more obvious that he enjoys drama? Best not to be taken seriously), then so be it. But the skater with the fifth best total score this season so far might not agree with that.

Edwin said:

Hopefully, the training staff that actually works on ice daily, i.e. Volkov c.s., know how to properly train, develop and raise their wards entrusted to them. A parent must be pretty desperate to entrust their child to Plyushchenko himself, given how little 'Gnom Gnomich' was and is beging treated by his dad.

Plus, ventilating this attitude won't do the relationship with FFKM and FFKKR no good, and those are the parties that decide over prestigious assignments with ISU.

But certain ice shows are probably more important in the small brain that is Plyushchenko's world.

Now, where does Konstantinova fit in? Future show star or back to a real competitive career?

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Is that official Stasya moved there? If so i guess she wants to stay competitive.

On Plushenko i don't like how unreliable the situation with the coaches there have been in the past seasons. You need to bring results if you want to keep the Academy growing, you can't just rely on shows.

They were getting results with Tarakanova, i definitely saw Plushenko's inputs in her skating, she was getting more polished artistically, results were coming, then they trashtalked her.

Same with Samoilov, he was making HUGE improvements there in the skating, and the quads (that's where we started to see him landing quad lutz and quad flip), then he left with one of the coaches.

Azikin said:

You can think that but she hasn't been the same skater since she left Eteri and the new GOE system has nothing to do with that. She changed a lot. I have been a big fan in the past but now I'm lukewarm towards her at best.

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I think it's definitely good that she's continuing:

A) honestly it's good for the sport, Figure Skating has always relied on icons to stay popular, successful skaters that can last for years. If the champion keeps changing every 2 year then the casual figure skating fan probably doesn't even know who are the top athletes in ladies right now as they keep changing. Russia in this aspect is an exception: there is excitement regardless of who wins because the top athletes are all russians.

B) Evgenia and Elizaveta and few others are proofs that Ladies Figure Skating in Russia doesn't end at the age of 17-18.

Artistically she has improved a lot, i can see deeper edges, more flow during the steps sequence, you can recognize Tracy's work there. On the jumps, yeah i think she regressed, in 2017 she could do any sort of combo, now idk why she is sticking with the 2a-3t which looks meh, when she could do 3f-3t in the long AND 3s-3lo. It'd be interesting to see some video about the quad sal, they said in the past they were working on that.

She'd need more technical contents next season if she wants to aim at podium at Nationals.

Also spins regressed quite a bit, that to me seems just a matter of training.

Edwin said:

Plyushchenko again:

Yevgeniy Plyushchenko, the famous Russian figure skater, now a coach and the head of his own Academy, in an exclusive interview with SE, predicted that the state funding system for schools in figure skating will soon be curtailed. Such schools, in particular, are Sambo-70 and CSKA.

- The selection in such (state sponsored) schools is incredible, that's true. If we compare public and private schools in general, then in the state ones you cannot rise high. The skater comes - leaves, they'll find the next one. The system is working. There are so-so salaries, but there are also 'envelopes'. If you don’t bring an envelope, you won’t get anywhere. If we are frankly talking about this topic.
But this chapter will close soon. Slowly, offended parents begin to talk about it: they 'hit' here, have a 'bad attitude' there .. ... But when tax authorities start getting interested in such things, it will take on a completely different character.
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From: https://www.sport-express.ru/figure...-o-rabote-gosudarstvennyh-sportshkol-1644384/

Money is apparently the only thing that moves and figures in Plyushchenko's world?

Wonder if the tax authorities should be more interested in the Academy and its wealthy clientele, where ambitions and wanting a 'return on investment' take prevalence over children's wellbeing?

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It is impossible to forbid a person to be a clown if he desperately wants it.

Tolstoj said:

I think it's definitely good that she's continue:

A) honestly it's good for the sport, Figure Skating has always relied on icons to stay popular, successful skaters that can last for years. If the champion keeps changing every 2 year then the casual figure skating fan probably doesn't even know who are the top athletes in ladies right now as they keep changing.

B) Evgenia and Elizaveta and few others are proofs that Ladies Figure Skating in Russia doesn't end at the age of 17-18.

Artistically she has improved a lot, i can see deeper edges, more flow during the steps sequence, you can recognize Tracy's work there. On the jumps, yeah i think she regressed, in 2017 she could do any sort of combo, now idk why she is sticking with the 2a-3t which looks meh, when she could do 3f-3t in the long AND 3s-3lo. It'd be interesting to see some video about the quad sal, they said in the past they were working on that.

She'd need more technical contents next season if she wants to aim at podium at Nationals.

Also spins regressed quite a bit, that to me seems just a matter of training.

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On Stasya: I think she herself confirmed it.

As for Zhenya‘s jumps: I think she‘s sticking with 2A+3T for GOE. There‘s no special bonus for doing 3-3, in fact, I‘m pretty sure since GOE is awarded for the highest value jump, doing a 2A+3T instead of, say, 3F+3T is actually beneficial. It also allows her to backload two of her combos. Having a 3F+3T in the second half would be riskier. 2A+3T+2T and 3F+2T is much more likely to be stable (and thus earn better GOE) and she isn‘t losing any points over that. I‘d say it‘s strategy.

Also, sure, she could do any combo in 2017, she did 3-3-3-3 regularly but we still only saw 3F+3T, 3S+3T and 2A+2T+2T in competition. Compared to then, her technical content right now is harder. She hasn‘t regressed, she‘s upgraded. (and on top of that changed and thus improved her technique) It might not seem like that because we always compare it to the standard that’s required to win gold today but, compared to her former self, the technical difficulty of her combos has improved.

What has regressed is her consistency but then again, I personally suspect that the system leading to this insane consistency just wasn‘t working for her anymore. It‘s also a different mentality if you‘re 17 or 20. Competing as a child/teenager vs. adult brings changes. It‘s normal.

It‘s absolutely true that she needs more technical content for a Nationals podium but so far, so does everyone else to be honest. Since her lutz is unlikely to improve that much that it won‘t be called, her best bet is to somehow make that 4S work. I don’t know how realistic a quad is but knowing Evgenia, she‘ll give it her very best effort.

https://www.instagram.com/p/B3m1F_NJyM-/?igshid=vfq3a223u52j

Here‘s an old video on the harness from when she was starting to learn 4S. You can judge for yourself. It‘s from the beginning of last summer, though, so I do hope that it‘s improved since then. Brian said it has. Let‘s see what another summer/spring of work will bring.

Tolstoj said:

They were getting results with Tarakanova, i definitely saw Plushenko's inputs in her skating

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The only thing that Plushenko "inputs in her skating" is her weak SP which is a parody of his programs with hip wagging and all that's stuff.

Orlov said:

It is impossible to forbid a person to be a clown if he desperately wants it.

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Yes, that's the right word. It reminds me of a US politician/businessman who always uses big words to praise himself. Really funny.

Good short for the juniors at Russian Cup Final

As expected. 1. Samodelkina 77.05 (great 3A+3T) 2. Petrosyan 71.08 3. Akatieva 70.84

Startlist for the seniors tomorrow:

Gulyakova
Tarakanova
Frolova
Nugumanova
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Gubanova
Tsibinova
Shulskaya
Talalaykina

The competition was great!:clapper:

Mawwerg said:

The competition was great!:clapper:

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It was, and very pleasing and exciting. I was a little afraid after the previous events where there was quite some 'fatigue' showing. But most of these young skaters are so eager, and so capable, physically well conditioned, they gave it their best efforts again.

This is probably my favorite SP this season. A shame we won't see it at Worlds. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ng0YPGsmaGY

NadezhdaNadya said:

I do not get this... If it is so, then how Jason Brown wins medals when he does not have quads and so many men do have? I know that the system now is more balanced with the men's skating - Yes, they are allowed to have quads in the SP, but stil someone without a quad can win a medal!
I have suggestion for ISU - for the skaters who jump lutz, flip and toe loop with excessive prerotation, just do not allow these skaters to jump these jumps at all! And have slow motion, so If anyone tries to jump these jumps with excessive prerotation, just invalidate them! Those who cannot jump lutz, flip and toe loop properly would not be allowed to have even triple lutz, triple flip and triple toe loop, let alone to have quad lutz, quad flip and quad toe loop. And the skaters witn amazing technique like Elizaveta and Alexia Paganini finally will have very big technical advantage.

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https://youtu.be/FD_f_k2iQtY
I want to see Eteri's angels doing this!
Who can use the toe pick properly to jump lutz, flip and toe loop from the Russians?
Elizaveta Tuktamysheva
Polina Tsurskaya
Anastasiya Tarakanova
Maria Sotskova
Maria Artemieva

Sorry it’s not related to the current conversation, but does anyone know where Alena got that beautiful black long sleeve lace top she wears during practise? I’ve been trying to find it and can’t seem to, it’s so pretty!

https://youtu.be/s5L6uVF3YN8
Maria Artemieva with her HUGE triple lutz! Perfect technique! Has she been mentioned often in this thread through the years I wonder? Hmmm...

Orlov said:

The only thing that Plushenko "inputs in her skating" is her weak SP which is a parody of his programs with hip wagging and all that's stuff.

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All Plushenko's angels tend to use old Plushenko music: Concerto d'Aranjuez, Tango Roxanne,...

But you can see bits of Plushenko's skating for example here in the choreo sequence

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ilB2Wa9LzIY

She's always had that passion in her skating but with Panova was far too controlled (i'd say nonexistent now), while with Tutberidze was becoming messy and sloppy.

Also i'd take that Querer SP anyday over the previous SP where she was acting like a weak minded person trying to escape from jail. What an appropriate theme for a 13 years old girl. (remember those were the years where most programs for Tutberidze skaters had these gimmicky themes with added voice overs,...)

NadezhdaNadya said:

https://youtu.be/s5L6uVF3YN8
Maria Artemieva with her HUGE triple lutz! Perfect technique! Has she been mentioned often in this thread through the years I wonder? Hmmm...

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Oh yeah...I’ve brought her up many many times. Too bad she fell on it so much. She had beautiful jumps but boy were they unreliable.

Sam-Skwantch said:

Oh yeah...I’ve brought her up many many times. Too bad she fell on it so much. She had beautiful jumps but boy were they unreliable.

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I noticed. She was not very consistent. Too bad.

Fluture said:

On Stasya: I think she herself confirmed it.

As for Zhenya‘s jumps: I think she‘s sticking with 2A+3T for GOE. There‘s no special bonus for doing 3-3, in fact, I‘m pretty sure since GOE is awarded for the highest value jump, doing a 2A+3T instead of, say, 3F+3T is actually beneficial. It also allows her to backload two of her combos. Having a 3F+3T in the second half would be riskier. 2A+3T+2T and 3F+2T is much more likely to be stable (and thus earn better GOE) and she isn‘t losing any points over that. I‘d say it‘s strategy.

What has regressed is her consistency but then again, I personally suspect that the system leading to this insane consistency just wasn‘t working for her anymore. It‘s also a different mentality if you‘re 17 or 20. Competing as a child/teenager vs. adult brings changes. It‘s normal.

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Why not frontload? 3f-3t and 3s-3lo in the first half, then a three jump combo in the second, let's say 3lo-2t-2t

Also, sure, she could do any combo in 2017, she did 3-3-3-3 regularly but we still only saw 3F+3T, 3S+3T and 2A+2T+2T in competition. Compared to then, her technical content right now is harder. She hasn‘t regressed, she‘s upgraded. (and on top of that changed and thus improved her technique) It might not seem like that because we always compare it to the standard that’s required to win gold today but, compared to her former self, the technical difficulty of her combos has improved.

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I compare to it to 2016-17 Medvedeva and i liked the technique back then more. Especially on jumps like 3lo, back then it was beautiful, smooth and seamless with transitions in and out. They got rid of all the transitions now.

While other jumps are perhaps better now like her new 3flip entry is more difficult now.

https://youtu.be/PLFVGwGQcB0
The main music theme in Anna's FS is not from Fire-bird

NadezhdaNadya said:

https://youtu.be/PLFVGwGQcB0
The main music theme in Anna's FS is not from Fire-bird

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we are aware. what does this have to do with anything?