2019-20 Russian Ladies' Figure Skating | Page 51 | Golden Skate

2019-20 Russian Ladies' Figure Skating

MissBeeFarm

On the Ice
Joined
Feb 22, 2018
We? I don't think anybody here on this board participating in this discussion is a trainer graduated from one of the Russian sports universities or has equal qualifications obtained elsewhere.

All of us are emotionally evaluating this or that coach's training methods, none of us has ever been subjected to them.

The results obtained by #TeamTutberidzeForProgress speak for themselves, and one doesn't hear the current skaters complaining that bad about their daily routine at Khrustalniy.

I am glad there is a mixed team of specialists working with the skaters, and all the skaters speak only with respect about them.
None of the skaters are pampered in any way, they have to 'earn' their daily keep by working hard, but AFAIK, they work with pleasure and are all the more content when they have put some moments of frustration and anger behind them because they persevered pursuing their goals.

There is no gain without pain, every sportsperson knows that.

I actually wrote exactly that :scratch2: I wrote "if you have the expertise to do so"....

It's funny that my original comment that was meant to show how utterly unfair that comparision is to Eteri is the one being attacked, and not the one that actually attacked Eteri in the first place.
 

flanker

Record Breaker
Joined
Feb 10, 2018
Country
Czech-Republic
If we got a interview from Polina T or Dasha T who left EG a year ago I would give it more consideration. But those two girls got to a much much higher level than this kid did with EG. Why don't we hear from them?

I just blows my mind the endless desire of the media to get things on EG. It's almost as if Madison is behind this. ;)

Darya Panenkova said recently she would like to return to Khrushtalnyi and some users were sad because of it :) (the only sad thing here for me is that it probably won't happen). We've also read interview with Polina Shelepen, which in fact gave pretty positive impression about "Eteri's methods", that some people called Polina suffering from some kind of Stockholm syndrome...
 

Alex65

Final Flight
Joined
Aug 11, 2018
Country
Russia
I actually wrote exactly that :scratch2: I wrote "if you have the expertise to do so"....

It's funny that my original comment that was meant to show how utterly unfair that comparision is to Eteri is the one being attacked, and not the one that actually attacked Eteri in the first place.

Everything was mixed up in the Oblonskys' house (c). Please do not take to heart.:console:
 

Orlov

Medalist
Joined
Jun 19, 2018

Today Victory Day is a very big holiday in our country (unconditional surrender of Nazi Germany in 1945)

Sima said: "Now the woman on TV said that every year veterans [WW2] are becoming less and less. But why did she smile at the same time, why was this smile necessary?"

Probably some not quite professional TV presenter uttered this phrase with a duty, automatic smile, inappropriate with such a phrase. Because of this, Sima was upset (Sima is a very sensitive girl, it was always visible)
 

Edwin

СделаноВХрустальном!
Record Breaker
Joined
Jan 5, 2019
And perhaps she is with her parents mourning some family members that deceased in the Second World War at the hand of the Nazi's?
I have been guest with a Russian host family in Sankt Peterburg at the 65th anniversary of Victory Day and it was an emotional moment to stand with my hosts and drink to the memory of the fallen, also in their family during the Blockade and I remember the gruesome tales of hunger, cold and despair they have lived thru.

Children honour their deceased family members in a ceremonial parade:
https://www.1tv.ru/shows/den-pobedy...bessmertnyy-polk-v-den-74-y-godovshiny-pobedy

lest we forget ...
 

uhh

Medalist
Joined
Nov 19, 2013
Reading this thread is becoming more and more like reading a facebook conspiracy theory group or even Infowars.

Sure, we don't know everything about Eteri's groups, but multiple skaters have come out and said they had to skate on injuries and were told to restrict their water intake, and that alone, my friends, is abuse.
 

Orlov

Medalist
Joined
Jun 19, 2018
Sure, we don't know everything about Eteri's groups, but multiple skaters have come out and said they had to skate on injuries

Who exactly and when said it? After all, you mean that they were forced, right (because you said the word "abuse")?

Your remark about limiting water intake is a manipulation. Alina told about this that it was in the days of the Olympiс, and you present it as if it were like that every day.
 

flanker

Record Breaker
Joined
Feb 10, 2018
Country
Czech-Republic
Reading this thread is becoming more and more like reading a facebook conspiracy theory group or even Infowars.

Sure, we don't know everything about Eteri's groups, but multiple skaters have come out and said they had to skate on injuries and were told to restrict their water intake, and that alone, my friends, is abuse.

Multiple skaters skated with injuries. In every country which has figure skaters. While some are praised for their bravery, with others people come with conclusions about abuse.
Also, multiple skaters are restricted with water intake during competitions. There are even official "cookbooks" about how much water you can or can't drink during competitions. Written by multiple skating federations all over the world. So, what are you trying to say, the one who calls us your your friends (I don't know you so I can't do you the favor to call you back by the same word)?
 

Orlov

Medalist
Joined
Jun 19, 2018
Do you know what angers me the most? Skaters have parents who care and love their children, are present at the training sessions (Kostornaya’s mother is present at each training session). But still there are people who write "abuse". This is, after all, disrespect towards the parents of skaters. Know what I'm thinking? This is due to social myths about Russia. I am sure that many, at least subconsciously, think with cliches from the times of the cold war. What we in Russia have here is a tough state, which takes away children from their parents and turns them into Ivans Drogo. So, this is a myth. We are free people and skaters are free people.
 

Fluture

Record Breaker
Joined
Apr 26, 2018
Who exactly and when said it? After all, you mean that they were forced, right (because you said the word "abuse")?

Your remark about limiting water intake is a manipulation. Alina told about this that it was in the days of the Olympiс, and you present it as if it were like that every day.

“Interesting stuff I heard about skaters and food; that even a slightest change in weight affects how this or that element is done?"

Alina: unfortunately, it is true. During the pre-Olympic season, during training camps, we all, certainly me, watched my weight very carefully, measured three times a day, morning, mid-day, night…

Urgant: let’s not talk about my life..

Alina: I was trying to maintain a steady weight, checking for as little as 100 gm. deviation…

Urgant: as little as 100 gm?
Alina: yes.

ok, the 100 gm. How much is 100 gm, a glass of water? Can’t even drink a glass of water?

Alina: yes, there was a moment when I stressed about my weight, and afraid to drink water. When measuring, I took a sip of water and spit it out."


-Alina Zagitova

It was the whole Olympic season which lasted a bit longer than a few days, I would say.

People see what they want to see. Eteri certainly is successful with what she‘s doing. Her students get medals. But this does not mean that her methods necessarily have to be right. It also doesn’t mean that everyone who actually listens to what her students say on a frequent basis about her attitude to weight, is jealous of her success or doesn’t want Russian athletes to win.

Russian figure skating is what brought me to this sport. It was an Eteri student that brought me to this sport. They, and her ex students, are among my favourites ever. I WANT them to be successful. But healthy at the same time. As healthy as an athlete can be at least. Injuries happen. A potentially dangerous attitude to food should not.

And sadly, everything we have seen so far from Eteri‘s comments and her students‘ comments leads to one conclusion. That there are severe problems with eating and weight in this group and they would greatly benefit from a nutritionist who tells them that trying to restrict your weight gain to less than 200g while you grow is not going to work. This is not about normal injuries or “no pain no gain“. Elite sport is difficult. But you can choose to have a healthy attitude about your body. And those are children. If they aren‘t taught this from the very beginning, they will not learn it.

Eteri might be successful and I don‘t deny that. Her medals speak for themselves. But being successful doesn‘t automatically mean someone is right in how they treat people. I‘d say, thankfully not.

I will continue to enjoy most of her students. I am looking forward to the debut of the 3A, the continuation of Alina‘s journey, Alena Kanysheva’s new programs and Kamila‘s junior debut. I will cheer them on and hope they do well. But I know that I will never be able to enjoy them as much as I would knowing they were in a healthy environment.

That‘s all I have to say about this. For now I hope we get to hear new information about Russian skaters‘ programs soon. Sasha‘s FS program is already announced. Hopefully we will hear about Alena‘s and Anna‘s too, soon. And maybe we will have some surprises next year, like Sofia Samodurova was this season? With the 3A it‘s going to be difficult, but maybe Anastasiia Gubanova? She seems to be Buyanova‘s top student now. And she‘s great. And I really hope for Sima Sakhanovich to land the 4S one day we‘ve seen her try on her instagram account.
 

Scott512

Record Breaker
Joined
Feb 27, 2014
Do you know what angers me the most? Skaters have parents who care and love their children, are present at the training sessions (Kostornaya’s mother is present at each training session). But still there are people who write "abuse". This is, after all, disrespect towards the parents of skaters. Know what I'm thinking? This is due to social myths about Russia. I am sure that many, at least subconsciously, think with cliches from the times of the cold war. What we in Russia have here is a tough state, which takes away children from their parents and turns them into Ivans Drogo. So, this is a myth. We are free people and skaters are free people.

Well said. I especially appreciate your Russian point of view add experiences.
 

Orlov

Medalist
Joined
Jun 19, 2018
Wonderful :) Here, so easy and calmly delete posts :)

to fluture. Briefly, the translation you use is incorrect - Alina speaks not about the whole season, but only about the pre-Olympic camp. And about the restriction of water consumption, even in your passage, she says "there was a moment" (at the Olympics)
 

Scott512

Record Breaker
Joined
Feb 27, 2014
“Interesting stuff I heard about skaters and food; that even a slightest change in weight affects how this or that element is done?"

Alina: unfortunately, it is true. During the pre-Olympic season, during training camps, we all, certainly me, watched my weight very carefully, measured three times a day, morning, mid-day, night…

Urgant: let’s not talk about my life..

Alina: I was trying to maintain a steady weight, checking for as little as 100 gm. deviation…

Urgant: as little as 100 gm?
Alina: yes.

ok, the 100 gm. How much is 100 gm, a glass of water? Can’t even drink a glass of water?

Alina: yes, there was a moment when I stressed about my weight, and afraid to drink water. When measuring, I took a sip of water and spit it out."


-Alina Zagitova

It was the whole Olympic season which lasted a bit longer than a few days, I would say.

People see what they want to see. Eteri certainly is successful with what she‘s doing. Her students get medals. But this does not mean that her methods necessarily have to be right. It also doesn’t mean that everyone who actually listens to what her students say on a frequent basis about her attitude to weight, is jealous of her success or doesn’t want Russian athletes to win.

Russian figure skating is what brought me to this sport. It was an Eteri student that brought me to this sport. They, and her ex students, are among my favourites ever. I WANT them to be successful. But healthy at the same time. As healthy as an athlete can be at least. Injuries happen. A potentially dangerous attitude to food should not.

And sadly, everything we have seen so far from Eteri‘s comments and her students‘ comments leads to one conclusion. That there are severe problems with eating and weight in this group and they would greatly benefit from a nutritionist who tells them that trying to restrict your weight gain to less than 200g while you grow is not going to work. This is not about normal injuries or “no pain no gain“. Elite sport is difficult. But you can choose to have a healthy attitude about your body. And those are children. If they aren‘t taught this from the very beginning, they will not learn it.

Eteri might be successful and I don‘t deny that. Her medals speak for themselves. But being successful doesn‘t automatically mean someone is right in how they treat people. I‘d say, thankfully not.

I will continue to enjoy most of her students. I am looking forward to the debut of the 3A, the continuation of Alina‘s journey, Alena Kanysheva’s new programs and Kamila‘s junior debut. I will cheer them on and hope they do well. But I know that I will never be able to enjoy them as much as I would knowing they were in a healthy environment.

That‘s all I have to say about this. For now I hope we get to hear new information about Russian skaters‘ programs soon. Sasha‘s FS program is already announced. Hopefully we will hear about Alena‘s and Anna‘s too, soon. And maybe we will have some surprises next year, like Sofia Samodurova was this season? With the 3A it‘s going to be difficult, but maybe Anastasiia Gubanova? She seems to be Buyanova‘s top student now. And she‘s great. And I really hope for Sima Sakhanovich to land the 4S one day we‘ve seen her try on her instagram account.

EG is more than might be successful. She will be a legend someday even as imperfect as she is. Eteri is a Rough Rider and people bringing their kids to train under her know what they're getting into. And yes her ways are not for everybody and they are tougher than most. Kanysheva just join that group a couple months ago do you really think her parents would let her go there if they didn't think she would be safe and healthy?

But you also said you will enjoy most of her skaters. I'm curious as to which ones you won't enjoy. Hmmmm.
 

Fluture

Record Breaker
Joined
Apr 26, 2018
Wonderful :) Here, so easy and calmly delete posts :)

to fluture. Briefly, the translation you use is incorrect - Alina speaks not about the whole season, but only about the pre-Olympic camp. And about the restriction of water consumption, even in your passage, she says "there was a moment" (at the Olympics)

I used the translation that was offered by a native speaker and great fan of Eteri. If it is incorrect, I do apologize for that. However, I still stand with my original point that weighing girls several times a day and restricting their food and water intake is wrong. Especially since the daily weighing and stressing about a few grams isn‘t happening only during the Olympic season, if it affected skaters like Polina Shuboderova who never even came close to making any Olympic team whatsoever.

EG is more than might be successful. She will be a legend someday even as imperfect as she is. Eteri is a Rough Rider and people bringing their kids to train under her know what they're getting into. And yes her ways are not for everybody and they are tougher than most. Kanysheva just join that group a couple months ago do you really think her parents would let her go there if they didn't think she would be safe and healthy?

But you also said you will enjoy most of her skaters. I'm curious as to which ones you won't enjoy. Hmmmm.

I didn‘t mean this as “she is not successful“ obviously. She is. Maybe I used grammar wrongly here, English is not my mother tongue after all. What I wanted to say is:

She might be successful BUT this still does not make her methods right. I don‘t know how to explain it, maybe a native speaker can educate me about this.

That‘s beside the point, though.

About your question on Kanysheva. Well, I think parents would let their children join if they realized how much they want the success and if they were told by a coach that such methods are the only way to be successful. That‘s why it is so important that students speak up that this is not right and should not happen.

About which skaters I won‘t enjoy. Well there are some whose style I prefer and whose I just don‘t really like. I think it‘s no secret that I was not a fan at all of Alina‘s FS this year, or that I simply do not particularly like Sasha‘s style of skating. This doesn‘t mean I don‘t like them as persons or don‘t cheer for them, I do. And it‘s pretty much beside the point anyway.
 

NoviceFan

Triple Something-Triple Looping
Medalist
Joined
Sep 21, 2018
Do you know what angers me the most? Skaters have parents who care and love their children, are present at the training sessions (Kostornaya’s mother is present at each training session). But still there are people who write "abuse". This is, after all, disrespect towards the parents of skaters. Know what I'm thinking? This is due to social myths about Russia. I am sure that many, at least subconsciously, think with cliches from the times of the cold war. What we in Russia have here is a tough state, which takes away children from their parents and turns them into Ivans Drogo. So, this is a myth. We are free people and skaters are free people.

Respectfully, I disagree with this. From the outside looking in, I do not feel that [negative] opinions about a certain coach is, or should be construed as, an indictment of an entire national culture, or vice versa.

Also, the presence of parents does not necessarily negate excesses in methods (i.e., abuse, if people wish to use the term). I am not saying that this is true in Eteri's case. I am just saying that such a blanket statement does not of itself support your assertion.
 
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