2019-20 Russian Ladies' Figure Skating | Page 574 | Golden Skate

2019-20 Russian Ladies' Figure Skating

Tolstoj

Record Breaker
Joined
Nov 21, 2015
Alexandra Trusova - She was perfect in the short, the gap with the top skaters is due to the lack of a 3a and the rules which don't allow quads in the short. The free will determine the color of her medal, she can still win this.

Evgenia Medvedeva - I'm sorry but i continue to not understand this strategy. I know that Brian Orser values certain things more than others, they build a particular type of skaters, but a good coach should know that in the end you should work more on what fits best for the skater. If you keep insisting on something that doesn't work in competition, it becomes too expensive.

In my opinion Evgenia should ditch the lutz in the short and go for this layout instead.

3lo
2a
3f-3t x

Her loop is potentially a +5, top skaters like Rika and Kaori also have flips and loops, it's not the end of the world not having a lutz, but Evgenia was trained to do backloaded combos, it's not that she forgot 5-6 years working on that.

It's a matter of practicing, at the end of the day hard work pays off.

Serafima Sakhanovich - looking at who's ahead of her and especially the components even from skaters behind, i'd say she was underscored by like 2-3 points. She has very good skating skills, insanely high speed on all the spins (which are all better than Medvedeva's spins, i'm sorry), she had a mistake in the combination, there's that. She will fight her way in the free for sure.
 

starla16

Medalist
Joined
Feb 3, 2017
I think it will be difficult for Liza if Bradie makes the podium tonight. Then it will be the combined score that separates them and Bradie had a pretty good score at SA and I expect a similar score tonight.

actually You pays the spolier not Bradie if she keeps on podium tonight and gets a second assignment then Cup of China can be a toss up
Tursy has withdrawn so You could get selected lets see.
 

starla16

Medalist
Joined
Feb 3, 2017
I think it will be difficult for Liza if Bradie makes the podium tonight. Then it will be the combined score that separates them and Bradie had a pretty good score at SA and I expect a similar score tonight.

she got 72 not so inflated as SA, Liza can get around 72-74 in SP and 145-149 Max in her next competition
that should put her in a higher total
 

Scott512

Record Breaker
Joined
Feb 27, 2014
Lol @ anyone rooting for any of these great athletes to fail.

Why don't they allow quads in the short program for the ladies? No quards in the SP seriously hinders Sasha's short program. Is that fair?
 

Good Vibes Only

On the Ice
Joined
Sep 22, 2019
Lol @ anyone rooting for any of these great athletes to fail.

Why don't they allow quads in the short program for the ladies? No quards in the SP seriously hinders Sasha's short program. Is that fair?

Well around the time of the olympics there were only a few ladies doing quads or triple axels, so they didn’t really need to make a rule about it. After this olympics I could totally see them drastically changing the rules around. Whether that be allowing quads or splitting the programs into artistic and jumps. I know that this would drag out competition a lot, but I really like the way Russia’s competitions for their little ones are set up. With having a judged step sequence, then performing their best jumps, then doing their programs. I don’t know if it would help the problem with the scoring gaps, but the ISU should look into it IMO.
 

medoroa

On the Ice
Joined
Dec 30, 2017
I cannot imagine a professional like Averbukh tearing down like that a principal cast member in his New Year ice show.

I don't know what he said and while I can imagine it was not sugar-coated, I'd have much more of a problem with him being nice out of nepotism. It would make me question his professionalism much more than harsh critique does.
 

Sugar Coated

Final Flight
Joined
Apr 20, 2018
You're just mincing words. They're both one and the same feeling.
Perhaps I should have clarified further. I’m never excited to see someone bomb. Let me start by saying I’m a fan of all the 3A but Alena is my favorite. So I’ll admit to being happy during last years JGPF when Sasha fell on a quad and that allowed Alena the upset. Because I knew that Sasha is Sasha, this was just one skate and she will still continue to dominate. However, seeing Anna’s performance at the final was so hard to watch. Even though I wanted Alena to win I never wanted Anna to have a skate like that.

To me, it’s best when my favorite eeks out a narrow victory. I may want a competitor to make a small mistake but overall still finish high on the podium. That seems to mean so much more than having my favorite win because her competitor had a complete and total meltdown that didn’t represent her true abilities. Like I respect Alinas victory over Rika last year so much more than Osmands win the year before. Rika still delivered a respectable performance. Osmand won because Alina skated disastrously and in no way represented her true ability. To me, that makes Osmonds victory hollow.
 

Bluediamonds09

Medalist
Joined
Sep 8, 2016
I just watched Trusova run through her free skate at practice this morning, and I have to say, that blue dress is beautiful! Is that her new costume or just a practice outfit?
I think Trusova will win today. Another victory by one of the 3A.
 

skatergurl7

On the Ice
Joined
Sep 29, 2019
Evgenia Medvedeva
In my opinion Evgenia should ditch the lutz in the short and go for this layout instead.

3lo
2a
3f-3t x

Her loop is potentially a +5, top skaters like Rika and Kaori also have flips and loops, it's not the end of the world not having a lutz, but Evgenia was trained to do backloaded combos, it's not that she forgot 5-6 years working on that.

Rika doesn’t have a lutz in the short bc she’s currently injured. Kaori’s loop is the best in the field. Evgenia needs the highest tech possible to compete with the other Russian ladies, but the lutz hasn’t worked out for her so I agree she should go back to the loop
 

zounger

Medalist
Joined
Jan 18, 2017
I think so, too. It seems inevitable. This is the theme for the 2019-2020 season. The 3A are higher, faster, stronger.

Doable but not so easy. She has a skater with two 3A ahead of her. A bit more difficult case than the previous week. Anyway, good luck to all the ladies.
 

monochrom3

On the Ice
Joined
Mar 29, 2015
I just watched Trusova run through her free skate at practice this morning, and I have to say, that blue dress is beautiful! Is that her new costume or just a practice outfit?
I think Trusova will win today. Another victory by one of the 3A.

Looks to be a new costume. The purple one was great but this new costume absolutely screams Sasha. It’s very her. I love it already
 
Joined
Jun 21, 2003
Why don't they allow quads in the short program for the ladies? No quards in the SP seriously hinders Sasha's short program. Is that fair?

I know that this question is intended to be rhetorical, but there is actually a well-established historical answer. The short program (then called the technical program) was intended to be a list of required technical elements (it varied somewhat from year to year -- one year there might be a required triple loop combination, for instance). The idea was that the list of requirements had to be something that all the top skaters could do, otherwise there could be no competition for who can do them best.

Little by little the SP lost that distinct role and became just another long program, only shorter. As Good Vibes points out, the ISU will probably change the rules to allow quads in the SP after the 2022 Olympics, since by that time there will be quite few ladies who can do them. Unless they re-exampine the whole two-program structure, as is being discussed at least informally in ISU circles lately.
 

Scott512

Record Breaker
Joined
Feb 27, 2014
Well around the time of the olympics there were only a few ladies doing quads or triple axels, so they didn’t really need to make a rule about it. After this olympics I could totally see them drastically changing the rules around. Whether that be allowing quads or splitting the programs into artistic and jumps. I know that this would drag out competition a lot, but I really like the way Russia’s competitions for their little ones are set up. With having a judged step sequence, then performing their best jumps, then doing their programs. I don’t know if it would help the problem with the scoring gaps, but the ISU should look into it IMO.
Thank you for that information and your opinion. I would love an artistic program and a jump program separately. But I think no matter what if you are allowed to do a triple axel in the short program you should be allowed to do a quad too.
I know that this question is intended to be rhetorical, but there is actually a well-established historical answer. The short program (then called the technical program) was intended to be a list of required technical elements (it varied somewhat from year to year -- one year there might be a required triple loop combination, for instance). The idea was that the list of requirements had to be something that all the top skaters could do, otherwise there could be no competition for who can do them best.

Little by little the SP lost that distinct role and became just another long program, only shorter. As Good Vibes points out, the ISU will probably change the rules to allow quads in the SP after the 2022 Olympics, since by that time there will be quite few ladies who can do them. Unless they re-exampine the whole two-program structure, as is being discussed at least informally in ISU circles lately.

Thank you for that information mathman. But we don't have time to wait until after the next Olympics to allow a quad in the short program. A skater should not they short-changed if their best jump is not allowed in the short program. then they should take the triple axel out of the short program too.

By the way I did like the idea of the original reasoning for short program.
 

Happy Skates

Final Flight
Joined
Feb 18, 2019
Your pretty sure I do what? Did you respond to the wrong comment? Your comment is so combative given the fact that all I said was that Rika is always complimentary of her competitors and I never root for someone to fail. I don't. I find failure heartbreaking. I don't like seeing anyone crushed.

And, as for the last year's world's. Frankly, Alina won because Rika fell twice. A clean Rika would have won. So, her victory did depend on another's failure. I guess that means you can't rely her and have to hope for another's failure? According to your logic?

Anyway, I was still happy for Alina. It was a great end to her bad year. And, a good learning experience for Rika. I don't root for others to fail, I root for my favorites to do well.

We never actually saw a clean Alina vs. clean Rika. At GPF they both made mistakes, and at worlds Rika did. And Alina does still have a higher best FP score, while Rika has the higher best sp score, but Rika's margin is by less. Not saying Alina would've won if both were clean, but we definitely don't know for sure the outcome of a competition where they both skate clean.
 

drivingmissdaisy

Record Breaker
Joined
Feb 17, 2010
Evgenia Medvedeva - I'm sorry but i continue to not understand this strategy. I know that Brian Orser values certain things more than others, they build a particular type of skaters, but a good coach should know that in the end you should work more on what fits best for the skater. If you keep insisting on something that doesn't work in competition, it becomes too expensive.

She usually gets pretty generous edge calls on her lutz; "!" and full credit are more common than "e" for her lutz. Here she got an "!" which, again, I think is lenient. It's strange too because the 3F-3T< was a strict call to me; I would have given the 3T full credit but an "e" for the lutz.

Having said that, I agree that a 3Lo is a better idea for the SP unless her team just wants her practicing the lutz under pressure and isn't worried about her results on the GP.
 

LiamForeman

William/Uilyam
Medalist
Joined
Nov 24, 2006
Thank you for that information mathman. But we don't have time to wait until after the next Olympics to allow a quad in the short program. A skater should not they short-changed if their best jump is not allowed in the short program. then they should take the triple axel out of the short program too.

I completely agree. I’d feel the same if 3a was not allowed but a quad combo was. It is very unfair.
 

fabienne1996

Medalist
Joined
Nov 24, 2018
Country
Germany
She usually gets pretty generous edge calls on her lutz; "!" and full credit are more common than "e" for her lutz. Here she got an "!" which, again, I think is lenient. It's strange too because the 3F-3T< was a strict call to me; I would have given the 3T full credit but an "e" for the lutz.

Having said that, I agree that a 3Lo is a better idea for the SP unless her team just wants her practicing the lutz under pressure and isn't worried about her results on the GP.
She needs to practice that lutz under typical competition pressure, besides in my eyes the go is not that important, for me rusnat, euros and worlds would be way more important. Zhenya has won everything besides the Olympic gold medal that there is to win, not only once but twice, she is and a double grand prix winner, mostly won all of her go events for 2 years after another, double Russian national champion, double European and world champion.so literally the go series is not the most important thing.
 

Scott512

Record Breaker
Joined
Feb 27, 2014
I completely agree. I’d feel the same if 3a was not allowed but a quad combo was. It is very unfair.
True. You should get involved with the legal profession and get this done!

She needs to practice that lutz under typical competition pressure, besides in my eyes the go is not that important, for me rusnat, euros and worlds would be way more important. Zhenya has won everything besides the Olympic gold medal that there is to win, not only once but twice, she is and a double grand prix winner, mostly won all of her go events for 2 years after another, double Russian national champion, double European and world champion.so literally the go series is not the most important thing.
All true.

Zhenya can and will find her world bronze medal form from March. But it has to be by Russian Nationals.
 
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