2019-20 U.S. Men's Figure Skating

skatenewbie · Nov 17, 2019

NathanandMiraifan111 said:
Does anyone know if Yaroslav Paniot is skating for the US now instead of Ukraine? Wasn't he Ukraine's no.1 skater? It's weird that he is skating at the pacific coast sectionals and nationals if he is still skating for Ukraine...

DenissVFan said:
This is what I'm wondering too.

moonvine said:
I would think so. Cab skaters who compete at US regionals, sectionals and Nationals also skate for other countries?

i remember reading somwhere that Paniot had asked Ukraine Fed to release him to another country, so it could be he's switching to US just like Krasnozhon, but who knows its not yet confirmed i think. He last competed a year ago in NHK 2018

DenissVFan · Nov 17, 2019

skatenewbie said:
i remember reading somwhere that Paniot had asked Ukraine Fed to release him to another country, so it could be he's switching to US just like Krasnozhon, but who knows its not yet confirmed i think. He last competed a year ago in NHK 2018

I get that the Ukrainian federation may not be the best (see Bychenko) but why switch from a small fed to a big fed?

It's usually the other way round so that a sketer has a chance to compete internationally.

ice coverage · Nov 17, 2019

moonvine said:
I liked Daniel! Clearly he was not at the level of the other men but he definitely has performance quality, in my opinion. It also looked like he had no coach. Why did he quit ice dance, do you know? ...

What I think(?) I remember:

Some years ago, Daniel's dance partner Holly retired. I think it was soon thereafter that she started college.
(AFAIK, she had no dissatisfaction with the partnership, and they remained on friendly terms.)

I don't think Daniel ever formed a new dance partnership?
At least once or twice, he skated (without a partner) in Jordan Moeller's annual charity show, but AFAIK, for a number of years, Daniel was not competing at all (neither ice dance nor singles).
I think last season was when he first made a surprise return to sectionals in senior men -- for sheer love of the sport, it would seem.

Alegria · Nov 17, 2019

skatenewbie said:
i remember reading somwhere that Paniot had asked Ukraine Fed to release him to another country, so it could be he's switching to US just like Krasnozhon, but who knows its not yet confirmed i think. He last competed a year ago in NHK 2018

Yes, he asked. And it's confirmed by Ukrainian federation.

moonvine · Nov 17, 2019

This is what Sylvia Unseen says regarding Paniot.

https://twitter.com/sylviaunseen/status/1195946352368332800?s=21

DenissVFan · Nov 18, 2019

moonvine said:
This is what Sylvia Unseen says regarding Paniot.

https://twitter.com/sylviaunseen/status/1195946352368332800?s=21

The US men's team is one of the most competitive in the world so it'll be difficult for him to make the Olympics again but he must have had his reasons for switching. Good luck to him.

Ice Dance · Nov 18, 2019

Yes, I think it will be very hard for Paniot to make a World or Olympic team. Not that he doesn't have the talent. He has it in spades. Has at some point outjumped everyone in the U.S. men's field except Nathan & Vincent. Paniot just rarely gets the job done in competition. Tends to pop his jumps, which often makes them worth nothing; and doesn't have the presentation to prop up his score when the jumps don't happen. Having said that, he really should be able to earn international assignments and the level of competition here could be good for him. Best wishes to him because it would be good to see him continue to grow and develop as a skater and competitor.

gkelly · Nov 18, 2019

moonvine said:
Are the men that much worse than the ladies? Maybe - I don’t know.

What I noticed when I first started paying attention to the qualifying competitions:

To move on from regionals to sectionals at most levels, ladies have to be more or less in the top 5% of their field nationally -- some regions are much deeper than others, so there are skaters who get left home in deep regions while weaker skaters may get the opportunity to say they competed at sectionals just because they had a good day for their level at a regionals with a smaller field. In the deep regions, even getting from initial rounds to final rounds at the lower levels is an impressive accomplishment.

At sectionals, even with byes at junior and senior level, there are usually more than enough girls competing who are capable of keeping up with each other, and some solid skaters will not make the cut

For boys at all levels, qualifying rounds are not an issue. Sometimes fields are small enough that a skater only needs to finish in the top 50% to move on. In some regions at some levels, just signing up for the qualifying season is enough to qualify for sectionals automatically because there are four or fewer boys competing at that level in the whole region.

Some years at some levels the sectional men's competitions might be strong with more than 4 skaters worthy of moving on depending who skates best on the day. Other years there are only one or two strong skaters and the next few qualify as the "best of the rest" but girls of similar skill level would never have made it to sectionals in the first place, sometimes not even to final round in their region.

And sometimes there are so few junior or senior men in a section that everyone qualified automatically.

Yes, the average boys at a given level are more likely to be able to rotate difficult jumps than the average girls at the same level. But the quality of other skills is often weaker.

As an example, imagine a brother and sister who have similar overall average skill levels. When the boy has a good day at regionals, he moves on to sectionals. If he's really lucky, he might get farther than that.

If the girl has a good day at regionals, she qualifies for the final round but probably doesn't advance beyond that. There are too many other girls who are just as good as her or better.

It's all about the numbers.

However, because the above-average boys usually get to advance and have more opportunities to qualify for Nationals and for international assignments, if they get that far they have more incentives and more rewards to keep improving. Even more so for the really talented ones.

Whereas some really talented girls might have the bad luck never to make it past sectionals for various reasons, let alone get assigned to JGP or other internationals.

Mrs. P · Nov 18, 2019

DenissVFan said:
The US men's team is one of the most competitive in the world so it'll be difficult for him to make the Olympics again but he must have had his reasons for switching. Good luck to him.

I thought of a few reasons (mind you, speculation)

*Don't want to go into it cause of guidelines, but the political state of Ukraine might create a lot of uncertainty. Paniot has lived and trained in the U.S. for some time IIRC, so perhaps he wants to gain citizenship -- not necessarily just for the Olympics, but just in general.
* I cannot imagine the that the Ukrainian federation is flush with cash -- they're a small federation. So even though he had easy access to high-level international competitions, he probably didn't get a lot of financial support. Not that USFS is amazing, but at minimum if he got challenger events and GPs, USFS would likely cover some costs and he'd be eligible for envelope funding with a solid top 10 nationals ranking, which is probably better than whatever he got from Ukraine fed.
* I'd imagine it's lonely being from a small fed where there's just a few competitors. I attended Pacific Coast Sectionals this past weekend and it struck me how HAPPY he was to be on the podium with the other guys. He took photos with all the other medalists afterwards and was just giddy. Since he lives in the U.S. he is probably familiar with some of the U.S. men and just liked the idea of being around them more often. And I agree with Dobre, perhaps he wants to grow and he seese a tougher field as a way to do that.

Again all speculation, but since he's already gone to the Olympics, I can see him aiming for other things.

desertskates · Nov 19, 2019

I think Mrs P. is right about Yaro Paniot. I skate at the same rink as him from time to time. I'm not real sure what the official word is on him switching, but it's clear that this guy just loves to skate!
He works very hard. And when the quads are on, they're absolutely spectacular in person. But he's very tall, so I think maybe if something is just a little off it might be hard to save it.
No matter what his goals are, I think he's a big asset to USFS. As he spends more time here in a good stable training environment in Southern CA, who knows what he can accomplish? Plenty of talent there for sure!

el henry · Nov 19, 2019

I thought Yaro was pretty much training full time in SoCal for the past three years? I don’t know where I got that idea :think:

I can see why he would just want to permanently switch, and I had forgotten he was at the Olys. That is good, because with or without competitionfor the spots, he would never get citizenship in two years (I am presuming he did not start any process while competing for Ukraine).

TontoK · Nov 20, 2019

gkelly said:
What I noticed when I first started paying attention to the qualifying competitions:

To move on from regionals to sectionals at most levels, ladies have to be more or less in the top 5% of their field nationally -- some regions are much deeper than others, so there are skaters who get left home in deep regions while weaker skaters may get the opportunity to say they competed at sectionals just because they had a good day for their level at a regionals with a smaller field. In the deep regions, even getting from initial rounds to final rounds at the lower levels is an impressive accomplishment.

At sectionals, even with byes at junior and senior level, there are usually more than enough girls competing who are capable of keeping up with each other, and some solid skaters will not make the cut

For boys at all levels, qualifying rounds are not an issue. Sometimes fields are small enough that a skater only needs to finish in the top 50% to move on. In some regions at some levels, just signing up for the qualifying season is enough to qualify for sectionals automatically because there are four or fewer boys competing at that level in the whole region.

Some years at some levels the sectional men's competitions might be strong with more than 4 skaters worthy of moving on depending who skates best on the day. Other years there are only one or two strong skaters and the next few qualify as the "best of the rest" but girls of similar skill level would never have made it to sectionals in the first place, sometimes not even to final round in their region.

And sometimes there are so few junior or senior men in a section that everyone qualified automatically.

Yes, the average boys at a given level are more likely to be able to rotate difficult jumps than the average girls at the same level. But the quality of other skills is often weaker.

As an example, imagine a brother and sister who have similar overall average skill levels. When the boy has a good day at regionals, he moves on to sectionals. If he's really lucky, he might get farther than that.

If the girl has a good day at regionals, she qualifies for the final round but probably doesn't advance beyond that. There are too many other girls who are just as good as her or better.

It's all about the numbers.

However, because the above-average boys usually get to advance and have more opportunities to qualify for Nationals and for international assignments, if they get that far they have more incentives and more rewards to keep improving. Even more so for the really talented ones.

Whereas some really talented girls might have the bad luck never to make it past sectionals for various reasons, let alone get assigned to JGP or other internationals.

This is sensible reasoning.

I often tire of people advocating for skaters to switch citizenship so they can skate for another country, without regard to the magnitude of what it means to be a citizen.

And, in this case, the opposite can be true. He might be considering a change in citizenship for reasons that have very little to do with skating.

I wish him well. I think I've only seen him skate once, but I remember him.

MarkinBerkeley · Nov 20, 2019

I think Jason Brown will certainly make the GPF with a 2nd place at NHK, and very likely with either a 3rd or 4th place. He is out with a 5th place.

StitchMonkey · Nov 20, 2019

DenissVFan said:
The US men's team is one of the most competitive in the world so it'll be difficult for him to make the Olympics again but he must have had his reasons for switching. Good luck to him.

Some people thrive on that.

Anna Pogorilaya could have skated for Ukraine, but felt the depth of Russia is what helped her to be so good. Maybe he wants to train in a more competitive environment.

ice coverage · Nov 21, 2019

ice coverage said:
... For those like me who just want to dip their toes into catching highlights from regionals/sectionals, USFS has been posting short recap videos this season:

Week One: https://youtu.be/ZdwDsu4b5m0 (Oct 11, 6:49)

Week Two:

https://www.facebook.com/usfigureskating/videos/505051980047373 (Oct 24, 6:11)
https://twitter.com/USFigureSkating/status/1187470528375746560

Week Three:

https://www.facebook.com/usfigureskating/videos/2928501120496393/ (Oct 31, 6:07)
https://twitter.com/USFigureSkating/status/1189995459143585793

If anyone cares ... I will close the loop and add the links for the Week Four video, which recaps all three sectionals for singles, the U.S. Pair Final, and the U.S Ice Dance Final.

https://twitter.com/USFigureSkating/status/1197605600542093313 (posted Nov 21, 8:57)
https://www.facebook.com/usfigureskating/videos/561330767766493/?__tn__=-R

Seen among the program snippets in the Week Four video are the following sectional champs :bow:

: Midwestern's David Shapiro (junior) and Jordan Moeller; Eastern's Maxim Naumov (junior) and Jimmy Ma; and Pacific Coast's Samuel Mindra (novice), Eric Sjoberg (junior) and Joonsoo Kim.
[Bonus sighting of Joe Klein in the stands watching David Shapiro.]

I hasten to reiterate that I think it's great that some here on GS watched a lot more of sectionals than these snippets.
Sharing the recap video for those like me without an NBC pass.

ETA (on Dec 24):

On Dec 17, USFS finally posted YouTube versions of the recap videos for Weeks Two, Three, and Four. The links for posterity:

Week Two: https://youtu.be/NLjOXB5VW6A
Week Three: https://youtu.be/az1D4LLaYX4
Week Four: https://youtu.be/2UGXZUKUIbY

This classy message from Sebastien Payannet :bow:

made me cry :sad4::

https://www.instagram.com/p/B4_goK1lVW6/ (Nov 17)

I take comfort in the end of his comment: "I know there is more to come ..."

Good luck to Tomoki and Jason at NHK this week.

mrrice · Nov 21, 2019

Has anyone seen Vincent skate recently? He had such a great season in 2018 and I worry he could be knocked off the team by Tomoki. I still find Nathan to be a lock but, we do have some strong skaters this year.

Good Vibes Only · Nov 21, 2019

mrrice said:
Has anyone seen Vincent skate recently? He had such a great season in 2018 and I worry he could be knocked off the team by Tomoki. I still find Nathan to be a lock but, we do have some strong skaters this year.

All I know is that he withdrew from the Grand Prix series because he was too busy with school. I don’t know if he has done any smaller competitions in the US. We may not see him until nationals. Pretty soon he will have his winter break so he will have more time to practice before nationals.

starla16 · Nov 22, 2019

the Jason Brown "Japan" curse is indeed real.

skatenewbie · Nov 22, 2019

He might be 4th though since only 5 point difference and that will bring him into GPF. Also Voronov who is in 3rd place not the most consistent skater either

starla16 · Nov 22, 2019

He should refuse any future GP Japan invitations
somethings with the ice there and him, lol

2019-20 U.S. Men's Figure Skating

skatenewbie

DenissVFan

ice coverage

avatar credit: @miyan5605

Alegria

moonvine

All Hail Queen Gracie

DenissVFan

Ice Dance

gkelly

Mrs. P

Uno, Dos, twizzle!

desertskates

el henry

Go have some cake. And come back with jollity.

TontoK

Hot Tonto

MarkinBerkeley

StitchMonkey

ice coverage

avatar credit: @miyan5605

mrrice

Good Vibes Only

starla16

skatenewbie

starla16

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