FFKKR appealed to ISU over inconsistency in judging at the GP stages | Page 4 | Golden Skate

FFKKR appealed to ISU over inconsistency in judging at the GP stages

Mishaminion

Record Breaker
Joined
Feb 12, 2014
They're not acting like that either.
It's how you perceive it.
They will only raise concerns about russian skaters, they have no business in skaters of other countries being subjected to unfair judging, and they shouldn't.
No federation in the world ever would.
They only care about interests of their skaters.

That is true.

And they certainly wouldn't protest unfairness if their skaters were not being called even if they deserved to be

No Fed would

That's just the way it works

It is hypocrisy in a way but they all do it
 

[email protected]

Medalist
Record Breaker
Joined
Mar 26, 2014
True. It has now reached the level of whining by the Russian federation.

Of course different judges will see things differently. That's what it means to have a "judged sport." If you want a scientifically measured sport, go downhill on skis.

This whining has materialized for the first time in how many years/decades? Just when 6:0 at GPF became a clear possibility. Coincidence? Sure, sure....
 

Fluture

Record Breaker
Joined
Apr 26, 2018
I honestly don't understand, do people actually think Rusfed should a) not say a word, even if they, like any other federation, have a right to do that
b) champion for skaters from other federations?
It's not rusfed's problem other federations aren't doing the same.

Neither the one nor the other. Like I said, I just found it decidedly funny that they‘re complaining so heavily now after just a few calls for their skaters they did not like. But good for them, I guess. If it makes the sport fairer, which it undoubtedly will of course, I‘m all for it. :agree:

I'm not understanding what you're trying to imply here? Explain?

Basically, that the ISU sat down at the beginning of the 2019/20 season, all serious, like: “Okay now. Danger. Russian juniors are moving up. We could have an all Russian GPF. But we don‘t want that! What to do? We have to stop this! First one to raise any ideas gets a promotion.“

“Edge calls!“

“Underrotations!“

Good, good. What brilliant ideas, would never have occurred to us. We‘re saved. Now Eteri’s evil Eterians might only get a total of 220-240 instead of 250. We also need to sacrifice someone to the skating gods, though. Hm. Let’s just take Tuktamysheva, she’s been skating long enough already! Then they chose their faithful hero, Mr. Jeroen Prins, to carry out the task. And the rest is history.


Sorry. I agree that the judging has been dodgy this season (when has it not been, though) but some of the implications here are just... :slink:
 

nussnacker

one and only
Record Breaker
Joined
Mar 16, 2019
Neither the one nor the other. Like I said, I just found it decidedly funny that they‘re complaining so heavily now after just a few calls for their skaters they did not like. But good for them, I guess. If it makes the sport fairer, which it undoubtedly will of course, I‘m all for it. :agree:

Yeah, well, when else should they have complained? :biggrin: I can't imagine them complaining about, let's say Medvedeva and Zagitova's WRs at Olympics, it's clearly not in their interest :laugh:

"ISU, my skaters are winning with WR scores, there's something wrong, there are inconsistencies with the judging". :laugh2:
 

Fluture

Record Breaker
Joined
Apr 26, 2018
Yeah, well, when else should they have complained? :biggrin: I can't imagine them complaining about, let's say Medvedeva and Zagitova's WRs at Olympics, it's clearly not in their interest :laugh:

"ISU, my skaters are winning with WR scores, there's something wrong, there are inconsistencies with the judging". :laugh2:

That‘s obviously not what I meant lol. But it‘s been, what, two events that they got some edge calls they didn‘t like? And they‘re already whining about unfairness? Sorry, but that‘s just either sad or hilarious. I‘m choosing the latter, makes the whole debate much easier to stand.
 

ruga

Final Flight
Joined
Oct 20, 2017
Ok but what even seems to be a problem? Is that that the calls are strict or that they're inconsistently strict? If it's the latter, I agree. How is a skater is supposed to know whether to work to fix a called problem or practise other things if one competition your jump is +5 standard and the other it gets negative GOE. Strict calls aren't exactly a problem and if a skater gets a call one competition and doesn't get in another, it doesn't mean that the lenient caller necessarily got it correctly. Inconsistent strictness for different skaters is another thing that one can complain about.

Also, here is an article/interview with Kogan. The name basically says the content of the whole thing:
Alexander Kogan: “I really hope that refereeing at the Russian Grand Prix will be more objective than at some other stages”

Source: https://m.sports.ru/figure-skating/1080111512.html
 

nussnacker

one and only
Record Breaker
Joined
Mar 16, 2019
That‘s obviously not what I meant lol. But it‘s been, what, two events that they got some edge calls they didn‘t like? And they‘re already whining about unfairness? Sorry, but that‘s just either sad or hilarious. I‘m choosing the latter, makes the whole debate much easier to stand.

I think they said about Liza too, and I think it's their concern over the season in general.
Well, they are quick to react. I think it only shows that rusfed is good at their job.
As an example, they're quite smart with jgp assignments, they always make them in a way that will benefit their skaters.
In general, I feel like, they just do a better job than other federations, and try hard to do as much as they can.

If others aren't able to strategize and vouch for their skaters, it only says something bad about other federations, but not something rusfed should be shamed about.
 

nussnacker

one and only
Record Breaker
Joined
Mar 16, 2019
Ok but what even seems to be a problem? Is that that the calls are strict or that they're inconsistently strict? If it's the latter, I agree. How is a skater is supposed to know whether to work to fix a called problem or practise other things if one competition your jump is +5 standard and the other it gets negative GOE. Strict calls aren't exactly a problem and if a skater gets a call one competition and doesn't get in another, it doesn't mean that the lenient caller necessarily got it correctly. Inconsistent strictness for different skaters is another thing that one can complain about.

Also, here is an article/interview with Kogan. The name basically says the content of the whole thing:
Alexander Kogan: “I really hope that refereeing at the Russian Grand Prix will be more objective than at some other stages”

Source: https://m.sports.ru/figure-skating/1080111512.html

the latter.
 

Baron Vladimir

Record Breaker
Joined
Dec 18, 2014
“At the same Tuktamysheva's grades for an element ranged from plus three to minus one. There is no single approach to assessing the quality of an element, and this is one of the biggest problems,” Kogan emphasized.

A new grading system for an element with a gradation from minus five points to plus five was introduced in the current Olympic cycle, earlier ratings ranged from minus three to plus three."


It was judges evaluation of 3A in FS from COC. Japanese judge gave her +3 and Korean judge -1. However, both those marks system didn't take into acount, but the rest of the marks which were all +2 across the board. I'm not sure why complain about it, when system itself is 'selfaware' that some of the judges may not see everything 'right' in real time and don't count some of those in the final scores :confused2:
 

rlopen

On the Ice
Joined
Jul 4, 2016
You can call it dislike, but in my opinion she is together with Karolina Kostner a good example how an average skater(not top 10) gets medals only because of the support of their federations.
There is no way there deserve high PCS. They are both boring to watch, because they are slow....very slow

Carolina Kostner...slow?! That’s the funniest lie I’ve heard all day!!!!
 

Baron Vladimir

Record Breaker
Joined
Dec 18, 2014

Lunalovesskating

Moonbear power 🐻
Record Breaker
Joined
Jul 3, 2018
I told you Mr. Prins before the free skating started that I'm looking at you, and to be careful what are you doing. Well, you didn't listen. Now we found out many others were watching you too :laugh2:
Mr. Prins was the technical controller and therefore not responsible for edge or underrotation calls, which is the job of the technical specialist and technical specialist assistant. Funny how people drag Prins name through the mud when he was not even the one to do these calls just because they have an agenda against him.
 

DSQ

Record Breaker
Joined
Apr 14, 2018
Country
United-Kingdom
That the work of tech panels has raised serious questions is the fact now rather than whining of Russian fans. Unfortunately, a reasonable explanation what lies behind this inconsistency, the one that I offered, is still considered to be a conspiracy theory.

Is that so? Why do you consider it a fact? Until there is an investigation I think it’s still up in the air.

Personally I don’t see what’s happening now as any more bizarre than it can usually be. At least I don’t think anyone has been penalised unjustly just that perhaps others were let off.
 

[email protected]

Medalist
Record Breaker
Joined
Mar 26, 2014
“At the same Tuktamysheva's grades for an element ranged from plus three to minus one. There is no single approach to assessing the quality of an element, and this is one of the biggest problems,” Kogan emphasized.

It was judges evaluation of 3A in FS from COC. Japan judge gave her +3 and Korean judge -1. However, both those marks system didn't take into acount, but the rest of the marks which were all +2 across the board. I'm not sure why complain about it, when system itself is 'selfaware' that some of the judges may not see everything 'right' in real time and don't count some of those in the final scores :confused2:

Kogan manifested that Rusfed is displeased with what's going on. He specifically mentioned selective approach towards edge calls. However, if he said that the tech panels selectively picked wrong edges for Russian skaters neglecting those of non-Russian skaters showing for example pictures of Satoko's lutz edge or Amber Glenn's flip edge he would like myself here be accused of conspiracy theory. "It's a judged sport - watch downhill skiing if you don't like it" or "go to downhill skiing Fed" in his case. That's why his only hard data is the variance in Liza's judges scores, the variance which in fact played no role whatsoever. The whole thing is not about judges. They are the same: country biased as usual. It's about tech panels.
 
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