Olympic figure skater, coaches being investigated for allegations | Page 4 | Golden Skate

Olympic figure skater, coaches being investigated for allegations

Ophelia

Record Breaker
Joined
Dec 6, 2013
Social media as a credible source of evidence? Are IG and its consorts even required to keep server logs on all hundreds of millions of accounts? Privacy laws, child protection laws, many of which are poorly implemented or not implemented at all, going back to 2017?

Yes. Why do you think FB has so many data centers? In Cipres' case you can easily check log in info if he ends up claiming he was hacked.
 

Edwin

СделаноВХрустальном!
Record Breaker
Joined
Jan 5, 2019
Those D pics are one thing, but the threats are far more scarier in my mind. Was the girl a pair skater in training with him? One 'accidental' drop in a late night private training session could leave her a quadriplegic or even dead?

Male partners in pair skating are highly sought after in the west, and most know their 'market value' and make full use of it.

Is that rink offering pair skating lessons and development programs to interested parties, i.e. parents?
 

Sugar Coated

Final Flight
Joined
Apr 20, 2018
Mentioning presumption of innocence is not "victim blaming". There was a line used in this thread:

"If Cipres, Zimmerman, Fontana and the third coach are innocent of these allegations, well, they're grown adults. They'll survive, one way or another."

So, let's imagine a situation in which truly innocent person is blamed publicly, his name turns into a muck, his career is completely destroyed and at the end they will say to him "sorry, it turned out you are innocent, but you are grown adult, deal with it." No, thanks.

If he and the coaches are guilty, then they deserve harsh punisment. But that's the matter of the police and justice, not the public outcry. We are proud of civilization, but people still tend to live in times of lynch law.

Presumption of innocence is for a court of law. This was a journalistic article that relies on journalistic research. The paper puts itself at risk for libel by publishing unverified stories. And he is absolutely allowed to sue if his reputation had been damaged by baseless lies. But a prestigious paper, with several lawyers, felt the journalistic standard was met and there was enough evidence to support this story. The public has a right to know if someone is harassing and abusing children but the legal system takes time to catch up or the girl has decided not to press charges to avoid needing to testify. Just because a 13 year old doesn’t want to testify in court doesn’t mean she doesn’t want to hold someone publicly accountable.
 

theharleyquinn

Medalist
Joined
Feb 25, 2014
OK, and thanks. But first this case should turn into a criminal investigation and the court should order a release of those server logs, or the defense of the accused?

At the very least, the therapist and USFSA would have been required as mandatory reporters to submit the case to law enforcement as well, so I would not be surprised if authorities in Florida are involved and investigating even if SafeSport can't take action against Cipres. The sending of the pictures to a minor is in and of itself a crime.
 

Ophelia

Record Breaker
Joined
Dec 6, 2013
^the request for information would need to come from a legal court, so yes, the courts would have to be involved.
 

believed

On the Ice
Joined
Apr 20, 2018
At the very least, the therapist and USFSA would have been required as mandatory reporters to submit the case to law enforcement as well, so I would not be surprised if authorities in Florida are involved and investigating even if SafeSport can't take action against Cipres. The sending of the pictures to a minor is in and of itself a crime.

It states that they did report to the authorities.
 

macy

Record Breaker
Joined
Nov 12, 2011
if safe sport can't investigate Cipres, can they or USFSA alert the french fed and they can investigate him?
 

andromache

Record Breaker
Joined
Mar 23, 2014
if safe sport can't investigate Cipres, can they or USFSA alert the french fed and they can investigate him?

I am sure the French fed has been alerted by now.

Whether or not they will care to investigate is the real question.
 

Edwin

СделаноВХрустальном!
Record Breaker
Joined
Jan 5, 2019
I am sure the French fed has been alerted by now.

Whether or not they will care to investigate is the real question.

Probably not, until more cases of abuse emerge and Cipres cannot defend himself anymore against the accusations.
 

flanker

Record Breaker
Joined
Feb 10, 2018
Country
Czech-Republic
The presumption of innocence is a matter for court. It doesn't mean that people can't evaluate the evidence outside of a legal context and decide who they believe.

I'm glad people have all the evidence needed for an evaluation at their disposal to make strong claims about the guilt...:sarcasm:

Just today, there was a terrible mass shooting in my country in the city of Ostrava, shooter came to a waiting room in hospital, shot 6 people dead and wounded another 3. In those things we are quick learners it seems. Police chased the shooter and when the capture was inevitable, he commited suicide. But why I'm mentioning this. Before that a picture of a "suspect" was published, but for some mistake it was completely different man. For a half of an hour all servers here showed the face of innocent guy making him a perpetrator in the eyes of the public. And it seems that just this half hour was ehnough that him and his family started to be bullied, terrorized and all the beauty that righteously indignant crowd is capable of.

So, spare me of conclusions made out of the newspapers. Justice doesn't belong to the crowd.
 

Colonel Green

Record Breaker
Joined
Mar 3, 2018
Country
Canada
I'm glad people have all the evidence needed for an evaluation at their disposal to make strong claims about the guilt...
Brennan was literally shown the images Cipres sent. Unless you're saying she's a liar (and everybody else at USA Today who would have had to vet this story also lied), there's no real ambiguity there.
 

flanker

Record Breaker
Joined
Feb 10, 2018
Country
Czech-Republic
Brennan was literally shown the images Cipres sent. Unless you're saying she's a liar (and everybody else at USA Today who would have had to vet this story also lied), there's no real ambiguity there.

I have very little idea about who Brennan is and I don't care. It has no relevance. The only relevant thing is the proper judgement and nothing else.
 

Ophelia

Record Breaker
Joined
Dec 6, 2013
I'm glad people have all the evidence needed for an evaluation at their disposal to make strong claims about the guilt...:sarcasm:

Just today, there was a terrible mass shooting in my country in the city of Ostrava, shooter came to a waiting room in hospital, shot 6 people dead and wounded another 3. In those things we are quick learners it seems. Police chased the shooter and when the capture was inevitable, he commited suicide. But why I'm mentioning this. Before that a picture of a "suspect" was published, but for some mistake it was completely different man. For a hals of an hour all serverrs here showed the face of innocent guy making him a perpetrator in the eyes of the public. And it seems that just this half hour was ehnough that him and his family started to be bullied, terrorized and all the beauty that righteously indignant crowd is capable of.

So, spare me of conclusions made out of the newspapers. Justice doesn't belong to the crowd.

Annnnd here we go with the "whataboutism" arguments.

GS really needs to start highlighting the victim blamers on this forum.
 

mrrice

Record Breaker
Joined
Jul 9, 2014
Brennan was literally shown the images Cipres sent. Unless you're saying she's a liar (and everybody else at USA Today who would have had to vet this story also lied), there's no real ambiguity there.

Is he sending these pictures to Minor Children? Lord knows, I've had some racy pictures sent to me but, I'm in my 50's and just brush them aside. This is a serious situation and needs to be handled with strict justice. Cleary, people haven't learned from John's Coughlin's mistake.
 

frida80

Record Breaker
Joined
Feb 13, 2014
There a definite problems with figure skating. Kids can peak early and share the same place as much older athletes, creating a feeding ground for abusive situations. Considering past accusations as well as scandals like US gymnastics, it’s high time children are protected. ISU and national federations need to come together and make new rules to protect children. Access to kids should be limited, specific rules and standards should be created and punishments should be clear and prompt.
 

Colonel Green

Record Breaker
Joined
Mar 3, 2018
Country
Canada
I have very little idea about who Brennan is and I don't care. It has no relevance. The only relevant thing is the proper judgement and nothing else.
Brennan is the one reporting the evidence of misconduct with which one can make a proper judgement.
 

nussnacker

one and only
Record Breaker
Joined
Mar 16, 2019
I think flanker‘s argument is part valid, but I‘d like to say a few things:
Journalists often conduct their own investigations, and although not trialed, they help to uncover some schemes and lies.
Harvey Weinstein thing blew up because of the journalist, the pedofile priests of Bostan investigation was done by journalists as well, same thing about Theranos being a massive fraud. Without journalists those crimes might have never been uncovered and investigated by authorities.
In some cases, they act faster and do a better investigative job, do they are not all that untrustworthy.

The other thing is how the court can sometimes come to wrong decisions. At times they acquit people who are guilty or punish the ones who are innocent.
So in some cases we can base our judgement not solely on court decisions, and look for reports and try to make our minds based on the.
 

jenaj

Record Breaker
Joined
Aug 17, 2003
Country
United-States
The article does not indicate how they found out, just that they did. This may not be information that can be shared yet.

The article says the girl told her tutor who told her therapist. The therapist reported it.
 

Metis

Shepherdess of the Teal Deer
Record Breaker
Joined
Feb 14, 2018
Dispenza wasn’t trying to “entrap” Cipres. (And entrapment is when law enforcement is the entity facilitating a crime for the purpose of arresting you for it and precedent on the issue has made that defense largely non-existent at this point.) It’s very likely Dispenza was also engaged in sexually exploiting minors and received a ‘thrill’ from this.

Not hard to fit the pieces together, but exceptionally gross and not uncommon if you have the misfortune of understanding how these offenders work.
 
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