Kevin Aymoz quad salchow | Page 2 | Golden Skate

Kevin Aymoz quad salchow

Lunalovesskating

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Jul 3, 2018
Everybody comparing kevin to Jason: you fail to realise Kevin has a consistent 4T for almost 2years, whereas Jason has never landed a quad in competition clean...

Jason has landed a clean 4T in 2016 Skate America, where his 4T was falsely called UR.
Also figure skating is more than jumps and both Kevin and Jason clearly show that.
 

kolyadafan2002

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Jason has landed a clean 4T in 2016 Skate America, where his 4T was falsely called UR.
Also figure skating is more than jumps and both Kevin and Jason clearly show that.

My point being that kevin with a quad has a chance of podium. Jason without quad doesnt unless the top 10 totally mess up and fall on every other jump. Somebody said they didnt get excited because jason could land two footed quads. I was stating that kevin had a clean consistent quad under his belt.

If both skate clean they are not in direct competition with each other. I'm afraid to say quads put you at another level entirely
 

CanadianSkaterGuy

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Jan 25, 2013
Jason has landed a clean 4T in 2016 Skate America, where his 4T was falsely called UR.
Also figure skating is more than jumps and both Kevin and Jason clearly show that.

It was super borderline. If he wasn’t given benefit of the doubt at Skate *America*. It was by far his best ever quad attempt in competition.

Jason brings a cleanliness and maturity to his skating but Aymoz is exciting to watch and is arguably the most expressive of anyone in the men’s field, you can tell he doesn’t just perform - he feels and breathes his music. His choreography isn’t just exciting to watch but it’s IJS friendly - especially the difficulty of some of his transitions.
 

el henry

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It was super borderline. If he wasn’t given benefit of the doubt at Skate *America*. It was by far his best ever quad attempt in competition.

Jason brings a cleanliness and maturity to his skating but Aymoz is exciting to watch and is arguably the most expressive of anyone in the men’s field, you can tell he doesn’t just perform - he feels and breathes his music. His choreography isn’t just exciting to watch but it’s IJS friendly - especially the difficulty of some of his transitions.

For many observers, including Jackie Wong, that quad was not ‘super borderline”, it was rotated, and nonetheless called UR. But that is water under the bridge now.:)

Kevin brings Kevin. Jason brings Jason. Both wonderful, passionate and authentic skaters.

I don’t know if this what you meant to say, but for me Jason, like Kevin, is not just a “performer”.. I never thought I would live to see the day that Jason could bring sizzle to the ice, and yet he did with “Love is a B****”. Completely seamlessly and naturally. With IJS transitions; if anyone knows a transition, it’s Rohene Ward ;)

I’m just happy I get to see both Kevin and Jason skate:hap85:
 

fzztsimmons

On the Ice
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Nov 14, 2018
aaaaaaand we're back to "kevin vs jason" despite the posts a page back saying why can't we appreciate both?

of course people can have favourites and yes one will go above the other in competition, but Jason is not the only skater out there competing. Isn't this meant to be about Kevin's quad salchow and his general standings in competition?
 

CanadianSkaterGuy

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Jan 25, 2013
For many observers, including Jackie Wong, that quad was not ‘super borderline”, it was rotated, and nonetheless called UR. But that is water under the bridge now.:)

Kevin brings Kevin. Jason brings Jason. Both wonderful, passionate and authentic skaters.

I don’t know if this what you meant to say, but for me Jason, like Kevin, is not just a “performer”.. I never thought I would live to see the day that Jason could bring sizzle to the ice, and yet he did with “Love is a B****”. Completely seamlessly and naturally. With IJS transitions; if anyone knows a transition, it’s Rohene Ward ;)

I’m just happy I get to see both Kevin and Jason skate:hap85:

Oh I absolutely think Jason is wonderfully expressive and brings out incredible emotions in those fortunate enough to watch him skate.... but you get the sense watching Aymoz that his programs are deeply emotional experiences for him too, and not in a contrived way. Part of me thinks he’s just more sensitive than other skaters (I mean he def puts the cry in kiss and cry whether he does well or not well, lol), but that emotional vulnerability elevates his performances.

That’s not to say I think Brown is lacking and arguably he still has the best overall skating quality of the entire field and has certainly had some of the best choreographed/entertaining programs. But Kevin’s higher difficulty and innovative moves and emotion really is something that you don’t see in many skaters, especially so relatively new to seniors.

I don’t see Kevin as a new Jason; both are wonderfully unique expressive skaters. But Kevin’s quads make him more competitive so in a sense it’s nice to see an expressive skater (no shade to strong jumpers like Jin/Zhou/Samarin) be in the mix to challenge the top guys because he’s got some firepower to back it up - and that’s something unfortunately Brown has always lacked (incidentally this was the case with skaters like Ward, Sandhu, Abbott, and Farris who really could have been the best in the world but couldn’t consistently bring hard elements to match their sublime artistic qualities). Aliev is also another potential great if he can get off the injury/inconsistency train.

Once Yuzuru and Chen retire these are the talents who will keep skating alive and interesting.
 

1111bm

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Dec 31, 2016
Even if he doesn't end up jumping three quads (possible reasons are not enough stamina, takes away too much focus, etc...), if he does one 4T and one 4S, that frees him up to do two +3Ts instead of one double (assuming he wants to keep his two 3As). That alone would earn him 2,9 more points, that's almost the difference between a 3Lz and a 4T.

I don't understand why Kevin makes some think of Jason or vice versa? I don't see similarities.

Kevin seems super emotional and theatrical in his presentation, even more so when I think of older performances from his junior days. He's very raw and throwing himself into his performances, sometimes seemingly not able to control it even.
His style and moves look more unusual, I get the sense that he wants to create a very artistic looking performance (I wonder if his style would be considered more common in France?). It's almost pretentious in a way and doesn't strike me as very mainstream.

For me Jason uses a repertoire of classic moves that is more common and universally more aesthetically pleasing. His performances look like a well rehearsed presentation and he seems very aware of his body and in control of what he's doing. He's precise and clearly wants to put out a cohesive feeling, well executed performance, but I don't see the kind of raw passion and abandon which Kevin shows.

Jason makes me think more of Rizzo, whose execution and general approach have a very similar feel imo.
 

fzztsimmons

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Even if he doesn't end up jumping three quads (possible reasons are not enough stamina, takes away too much focus, etc...), if he does one 4T and one 4S, that frees him up to do two +3Ts instead of one double (assuming he wants to keep his two 3As). That alone would earn him 2,9 more points, that's almost the difference between a 3Lz and a 4T.

I don't understand why Kevin makes some think of Jason or vice versa? I don't see similarities.

Kevin seems super emotional and theatrical in his presentation, even more so when I think of older performances from his junior days. He's very raw and throwing himself into his performances, sometimes seemingly not able to control it even.
His style and moves look more unusual, I get the sense that he wants to create a very artistic looking performance (I wonder if his style would be considered more common in France?). It's almost pretentious in a way and doesn't strike me as very mainstream.

For me Jason uses a repertoire of classic moves that is more common and universally more aesthetically pleasing. His performances look like a well rehearsed presentation and he seems very aware of his body and in control of what he's doing. He's precise and clearly wants to put out a cohesive feeling, well executed performance, but I don't see the kind of raw passion and abandon which Kevin shows.

Jason makes me think more of Rizzo, whose execution and general approach have a very similar feel imo.

That's why I dislike how the thread became Kevin vs Jason. As discussed previously, it seems to be this weird consensus that their can only be one "artistic" skater and there should be some fight to the death for that title. Whereas "artistic" encompasses many different styles with not one being better or the best, just a preference. Kevin and Jason have vastly different styles which have their merits and flaws, and unique qualities.

It gets boring when people continue to drag down one skater to prop another up - there is (or should be) room for more than one skater to be the PCS skater...
 

Casual

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Jan 26, 2018
It gets boring when people continue to drag down one skater to prop another up - there is (or should be) room for more than one skater to be the PCS skater...

Exactly. Also, the more PCS skaters we get, the more well-rounded all-around-great skaters we'll get. Because in view of increased comparison, non-PCS skaters will want to improve artistically, too.
 

4everchan

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any man, almost any day, can be top 10 at worlds... even some without quads.. i don't think this change anything. Kevin does start with a higher pcs mark (though i don't like his style much... ) but clean programs are necessary for anyone at this point to pretend to bronze or even top 5
 

kolyadafan2002

Fan of Kolyada
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Rizzo could smoke both of them.

No he couldn't.
Hes beautiful, and I love him, however he is really inconsistent with jumps, and his skating is simplistic compared to aymoz (though very nice dont get me wrong).
If Rizzo gets 4Lo than he could beat aymoz, but hes jumped a total of 4 clean quads last season, and I haven't seen him jump one clean this season.
+ Rizzo has never gotten to gpf and did worse in both gp events.
 

CanadianSkaterGuy

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Jan 25, 2013
Rizzo could smoke both of them.

Lol, and what are you smoking?!

Rizzo’s PB is 260.53

Brown’s is 263.42

Aymoz’s is 275.63

Rizzo has underperformed considerably this season whereas Aymoz is on the rise and favoured to win Euros.
 

MDIslander

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Mar 24, 2018
I'm just so excited to be in Graz for the historic Euros - I'm unapologetically rooting for Kevin to win Gold.

But given Shoma's exciting rejuvenation I'm not expecting Kevin to make it on the podium at Worlds. I'm pretty certain it will be a Chen, Hanyu & Shoma (not necessarily in this order) Worlds podium.
 

kolyadafan2002

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I'm just so excited to be in Graz for the historic Euros - I'm unapologetically rooting for Kevin to win Gold.

But given Shoma's exciting rejuvenation I'm not expecting Kevin to make it on the podium at Worlds. I'm pretty certain it will be a Chen, Hanyu & Shoma (not necessarily in this order) Worlds podium.

Remember, vincent zhou is also coming back for worlds, and combined with lee Barkell he should fix underrotation issues.
 

shine

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Jul 27, 2003
I much prefer Kevin’s presentation and programs to Jason’s.
 

Tavi...

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Feb 10, 2014
My point being that kevin with a quad has a chance of podium. Jason without quad doesnt unless the top 10 totally mess up and fall on every other jump. Somebody said they didnt get excited because jason could land two footed quads. I was stating that kevin had a clean consistent quad under his belt.

If both skate clean they are not in direct competition with each other. I'm afraid to say quads put you at another level entirely

I think you’re confusing the fact that Kevin is having a breakthrough season and Jason is having a poor one with their relative competitiveness. You may prefer Kevin, but both of them have exactly one championship bronze medal to their names. Having a clean quad is a competitive advantage only if you don’t give points away elsewhere - and regardless of how clean his 4T is, Kevin rarely skates anywhere close to “clean.” Until he adds harder quads to his rep and/or shows that he can consistently perform his current level of difficulty relatively cleanly, I wouldn’t put him on “another level entirely” than Jason.
 

kolyadafan2002

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I think you’re confusing the fact that Kevin is having a breakthrough season and Jason is having a poor one with their relative competitiveness. You may prefer Kevin, but both of them have exactly one championship bronze medal to their names. Having a clean quad is a competitive advantage only if you don’t give points away elsewhere - and regardless of how clean his 4T is, Kevin rarely skates anywhere close to “clean.” Until he adds harder quads to his rep and/or shows that he can consistently perform his current level of difficulty relatively cleanly, I wouldn’t put him on “another level entirely” than Jason.

Jason had the skate of his life at Worlds 2019. Kevin's bad programs this season got greater scores (overall combined score).

Jason can beat kevin without a quad, but jason cant medal without a quad. Kevin can medal as he has a quad consistent, however if he messes up he cant medal.

The sheer base value of a quad puts you on another level entirely. If you don't have one, to make the jump maths work you either have to only have 3-2 combos and then a solo 3T, or a planned double axel. 3.3 vs 9 t is a lot, and when you land quads you are perceived as a better skater so that will bias the judges towards you (this shouldn't happen, but for now you have to accept it does).

Anyways I am starting to wish Jason brown was never mentioned in this thread. He is kinda irrelevant to Kevin's success or lack of success.
 

sheetz

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Joined
Jan 10, 2015
If Rizzo gets 4Lo than he could beat aymoz, but hes jumped a total of 4 clean quads last season, and I haven't seen him jump one clean this season.

FYI, Rizzo landed clean 4Ts in both the SP and FS at Cup of China, as well as the SP at both Lombardia and Shanghai Trophy. I think a lot of his inconsistencies this season were due to trying to incorporate 4Lo into his programs.
 
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