New JW blades | Golden Skate

New JW blades

Ic3Rabbit

Former Elite, now Pro. ⛸️
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Jan 9, 2017
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Just came across these - they look very interesting! Might solve some of the issues people had with the design of the revolution blades while still being light.

https://iceboxskating.co.uk/blades/john-wilson/john-wilson-pheonix-gold-blades.html

https://iceboxskating.co.uk/blades/john-wilson/john-wilson-pheonix-99-blades.html

Thoughts?

No thank you. They are too much like the Matrix blades with the separate runner and needing the special jig to sharpen them and a tech that knows how without completely wrecking the entire blade.

I had Matrix Supreme at one point and ended up hating them.

BTW: Those are nothing like a Rev blade and aren't designed to be. IDK why they would be compared to one.

I'll keep my traditional P99's.
 

Elija

On the Ice
Joined
Mar 25, 2019
I was just commenting on the weight. I know several people who went to revolution for the weight but found the shape of the revolutions difficult. This might solve that issue.
 

Ic3Rabbit

Former Elite, now Pro. ⛸️
Record Breaker
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I was just commenting on the weight. I know several people who went to revolution for the weight but found the shape of the revolutions difficult. This might solve that issue.

Yes, Revs are a pain when you want to do catch foots and such.

But why would they go to these if matrix already exists and is technically the same?
 

Elija

On the Ice
Joined
Mar 25, 2019
Yes, Revs are a pain when you want to do catch foots and such.

But why would they go to these if matrix already exists and is technically the same?

No idea. I’ve never tried/seen matrix, they aren’t really available here. I tried googling these new blades to find out more, but there doesn’t seem to be much about them yet. Was just curious what other people’s initial thoughts were.
 

tstop4me

Final Flight
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Oct 2, 2015
Country
United-States
But why would they go to these if matrix already exists and is technically the same?

Here's one possible reason. Ultima Matrix, Eclipse Titanium, and Paramount make lightweight two-part (chassis + runner) blades with runners that are "comparable" to the runners (or equivalent portions) of Wilson blades; but they are not clones. The differences may be significant for some skaters.
 

Elija

On the Ice
Joined
Mar 25, 2019
Here's one possible reason. Ultima Matrix, Eclipse Titanium, and Paramount make lightweight two-part (chassis + runner) blades with runners that are "comparable" to the runners (or equivalent portions) of Wilson blades; but they are not clones. The differences may be significant for some skaters.

Yeah, if you’re used to p99 or gold seal and like it and want a lighter version but not revolutions this could be a good option.
 

Ic3Rabbit

Former Elite, now Pro. ⛸️
Record Breaker
Joined
Jan 9, 2017
Country
Olympics
Here's one possible reason. Ultima Matrix, Eclipse Titanium, and Paramount make lightweight two-part (chassis + runner) blades with runners that are "comparable" to the runners (or equivalent portions) of Wilson blades; but they are not clones. The differences may be significant for some skaters.

Yeah, if you’re used to p99 or gold seal and like it and want a lighter version but not revolutions this could be a good option.

The only thing is, my former matrix was like my p99 and I still hated it, which was my point.
 

kolyadafan2002

Fan of Kolyada
Final Flight
Joined
Jun 6, 2019
I think until they are properly announced / released, we can only speculate on what they will be like.
 

1111bm

Final Flight
Joined
Dec 31, 2016
Never mind the lighter weight, I'd be more interested in the materials used, is it stainless steel? Because that would be awesome. Longer sharpening life and I was under the impression that it has a better glide too, especially noticable on rough ice, but maybe I'm wrong about that one.

Only thing is, I'm not too fond of the design :p I prefer the revolutions or a classic blade.
Also, don't you hit the holder on deep edges?

(our sharpener specialises in Matrix blades, so getting them sharpened at home wouldn't pose a problem)
 

Yannis94

Rinkside
Joined
Dec 31, 2019
Honestly I'd rather by a pair of Paramount Gold Seals or Paramount Pat99. For one, they're made from one piece of metal so no chassis, no bolting or melting the blade part to the sole plates. But right now I'm in revolution gold seals and I freaking love them. Sure catch foot spins take adjusting for sure but otherwise I love them.
 

tstop4me

Final Flight
Joined
Oct 2, 2015
Country
United-States
Honestly I'd rather by a pair of Paramount Gold Seals or Paramount Pat99. For one, they're made from one piece of metal so no chassis, no bolting or melting the blade part to the sole plates. But right now I'm in revolution gold seals and I freaking love them. Sure catch foot spins take adjusting for sure but otherwise I love them.
<<Emphasis added.>> I have the Paramount Gold Seal version. Your statement is wrong. Paramount has a two-piece construction: a one-piece aluminum-alloy chassis with a separate one-piece runner (fabricated from plain carbon steel, 420 stainless steel, or 440 stainless steel, depending on the grade of blade). The attachment procedure is not mentioned on their website or in their printed literature, but their patent (which I've retrieved and read) specifies adhesive. So it is correct that there are no bolts, brazes, or welds. But it is not correct that the entire blade is fabricated from a single piece of metal and that there is no chassis.
 

Sibelius

On the Ice
Joined
Mar 28, 2017
First hands on look at the Phoenix blade with the P99 profile.

Went to our tech for a sharpening and while waiting I spied them on the blade rack. Oh my are they light. Compared to a regular P99 they weighed next to nothing, regular P99 felt like an anchor. They look complicated with the runner and blade. Tech said they aren't that much more difficult to sharpen.

I took a photo and showed it to my skater, she said they're ugly. Guess that will save me some money. As for the question as to why someone would want these over the Paramount or Ultima versions, I guess you'd get an authentic Wilson blade with the authentic GS or P99 profile, not a clone. As I've said in our (granted low level) experience, a clone ain't the same thing. I asked if they'd sold many, he said nope, mostly Covid related he expects.

I think mine will stick with her regular Gold Seals for now as heavy as they are.
 

WednesdayMarch

Nicer When Fed
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Mar 24, 2019
Country
United-Kingdom
First hands on look at the Phoenix blade with the P99 profile.

Went to our tech for a sharpening and while waiting I spied them on the blade rack. Oh my are they light. Compared to a regular P99 they weighed next to nothing, regular P99 felt like an anchor. They look complicated with the runner and blade. Tech said they aren't that much more difficult to sharpen.

I took a photo and showed it to my skater, she said they're ugly. Guess that will save me some money. As for the question as to why someone would want these over the Paramount or Ultima versions, I guess you'd get an authentic Wilson blade with the authentic GS or P99 profile, not a clone. As I've said in our (granted low level) experience, a clone ain't the same thing. I asked if they'd sold many, he said nope, mostly Covid related he expects.

I think mine will stick with her regular Gold Seals for now as heavy as they are.
Totally the best plan. Because if she can do the jumps with the regular ones, she'll have an advantage later on when she really needs it. Go to the lighter ones too early and that advantage has been lost.
 

gliese

Final Flight
Joined
Oct 31, 2020
Country
United-States
I took a photo and showed it to my skater, she said they're ugly. Guess that will save me some money.
They're the same price as the traditionals. Still agree with @WednesdayMarch that waiting is the best plan.

Unrelated, but my tech says they don't require a special jig, so don't make that part of your concern when thinking about whether to switch or not.
 

Sibelius

On the Ice
Joined
Mar 28, 2017
Totally the best plan. Because if she can do the jumps with the regular ones, she'll have an advantage later on when she really needs it. Go to the lighter ones too early and that advantage has been lost.
Kind of what I thought, an extra boost when (if) she gets to triples. I always thought the revs were light (and frankly stylish) but these felt completely feather weight, but not stylish to me in any way. Each to their own I guess.
 

Sibelius

On the Ice
Joined
Mar 28, 2017
They're the same price as the traditionals. Still agree with @WednesdayMarch that waiting is the best plan.

Unrelated, but my tech says they don't require a special jig, so don't make that part of your concern when thinking about whether to switch or not.
I thought they'd be more, but you're right same price. I'm still hoping against hope that we can keep the current GS's on the next boot since her feet are still about the same size.
 

Elija

On the Ice
Joined
Mar 25, 2019
First hands on look at the Phoenix blade with the P99 profile.

Went to our tech for a sharpening and while waiting I spied them on the blade rack. Oh my are they light. Compared to a regular P99 they weighed next to nothing, regular P99 felt like an anchor. They look complicated with the runner and blade. Tech said they aren't that much more difficult to sharpen.

I took a photo and showed it to my skater, she said they're ugly. Guess that will save me some money. As for the question as to why someone would want these over the Paramount or Ultima versions, I guess you'd get an authentic Wilson blade with the authentic GS or P99 profile, not a clone. As I've said in our (granted low level) experience, a clone ain't the same thing. I asked if they'd sold many, he said nope, mostly Covid related he expects.

I think mine will stick with her regular Gold Seals for now as heavy as they are.
Interesting! I thought the silver ones were ugly too from the pictures I saw. Black ones look like they would look pretty cool against white skates though. Have heard positive things on Instagram from people who have tried them. Unfortunately I have phantoms and it seems MK aren’t making a Phoenix version of their blades as of yet, so not even an option right now. Does anyone remember if the Wilson and MK revolutions came out at the same time? I was on my 12 year break from skating at that time lol, and didn’t even know anything about revolutions until I got back into it a few years ago.
 

gliese

Final Flight
Joined
Oct 31, 2020
Country
United-States
I thought they'd be more, but you're right same price. I'm still hoping against hope that we can keep the current GS's on the next boot since her feet are still about the same size.
Hopefully! If you don't sharpen often, that's certainly a possibility. I rarely swap out my boots and blades at the same time because blades usually last just a couple months longer. It's certainly a positive that I don't have to get used to completely new boots and blades at the same time.
 

kolyadafan2002

Fan of Kolyada
Final Flight
Joined
Jun 6, 2019
Blade profile slightly different as well - don't have tapered edges of Gold seal and I think there are differences to the secondary rocker.
Either way I'd either go for Gold seal or Matrix Supreme, I don't need to spend a lot of money for limited benefit.
 
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