Raising minimum age for seniors from 15 to 17? | Golden Skate

Raising minimum age for seniors from 15 to 17?

moonvine

All Hail Queen Gracie
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I know an age change has been discussed a lot, but I hadn’t heard of any specific proposals. I was just watching the World Junior Figure Skating Championships and Ted Barton said there was a proposal to change the age to skate seniors from 15 to 17. Does anyone know anything about this?
 
Joined
Jun 21, 2003
I believe that the idea is still being batted around, but if I remember correctly the last we heard from the ISU Technical Committee is that they are not going to recommend a change at the next congress.
 

CaroLiza_fan

EZETTIE LATUASV IVAKMHA
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I was surprised when Ted said the proposal was to raise the Senior minimum to 17. Because two years is a lot to raise it by.

I have long argued that a 4 year overlap between the two levels is too much. So, I would be all for decreasing it to 2 years. However, I do think there is a better way to do it than what is being proposed.

If it was me, I would have the lower age limit for Senior Singles at 16 and the upper age limit for Junior Singles at 18. That way the overlap between the two levels would still be decreasing by 2 years, but the age ranges of each of the two levels would only be changing by 1 year.

But, I really have no idea what would be best for Pairs and Ice Dance. Because I can see the pros and cons for every possible suggestion.

CaroLiza_fan
 

Ziotic

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Dec 23, 2016
Does anyone have statistics for the average age of men and women for when they turn senior?

When speaking of raising the limits it’s almost always about the ladies discipline but I’d be curious to know what the effect would be on the men’s if both were set at 16.
 

Harriet

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Having thought about this quite a bit over the past six weeks or so, I've come to the conclusion that I'd rather they created an intermediate level of competition between junior and senior. Make Juniors 14-16, Intemediates 16-18 and Seniors 18+, with only one year of leeway for pairs/dance teams and no early advancement allowed. It would allow a more staggered introduction of high-danger elements like triple axels and quads and triple/quadruple twists and throw jumps too: say, no 3As or quads permitted in the junior level, one 3A permitted in the Intermediate SP and one 3A/one quad in the FS, and then the current rules for seniors stay in place for both men and women. Some lift restrictions for Juniors and Intermediates too, and more staggered pattern dance progression for ID.

Oh, and change the names so that Juniors and Intermediate are 'boys' and 'girls' and Seniors are 'men' and 'women', thanks ever so, ISU.
 

NaVi

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Oct 30, 2014
I was getting ready to bumb up an old thread to ask about this, but I think it would be kind of dumb to try to vote on raising it up to 17 without also asking people about raising it up to 16.
 

noskates

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Jun 11, 2012
I have always believed - and still do - that unless a skater is old enough to compete on the senior level internationally they should not be able to compete on the senior level nationally. So whatever age is decided on - let's make it universal.
 

Shani

On the Ice
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Jan 11, 2014
It may not happen, today I read an 11 year old from Syria has qualified from the Summer Olympics and a 12 year old from UK is qualified in skateboarding for Tokyo. Some uniformity is in order.
 

KOBOT37

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Dec 9, 2019
I have no clue what they are going to solve with this.

Champions retiring early? It wont. Lets face it, if there is not enough money in it for them,they are going to retire anyway.
3A type domination? It wont. 15 years old 3A would dominate 15 years old anybody else, I don't know why some people think that 17 years old 3A or 20 years old 3A won't dominate in a similar fashion. It's not the age, they are just... better than anybody before them.
Quads dominating the sport? it simply wont.

If 3A lost their jumps... this discussion would make some sense, but right now idk why even discuss that.
 

moonvine

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It may not happen, today I read an 11 year old from Syria has qualified from the Summer Olympics and a 12 year old from UK is qualified in skateboarding for Tokyo. Some uniformity is in order.

I would raise it to 16 across the board for the Olympics. I was reading on a 12th grade level in the 6th grade. I wasn’t emotionally mature enough to go to high school or college. An 11 or 12 year olds brain is not equipped to understand what dangers may be inherent in what they are doing and the adults around them may or may not have their best interests in mind. Just because a thing can be done doesn’t mean it should be.
 

KOBOT37

Match Penalty
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Dec 9, 2019
I would raise it to 16 across the board for the Olympics. I was reading on a 12th grade level in the 6th grade. I wasn’t emotionally mature enough to go to high school or college. An 11 or 12 year olds brain is not equipped to understand what dangers may be inherent in what they are doing and the adults around them may or may not have their best interests in mind. Just because a thing can be done doesn’t mean it should be.

11 and 10 years old novices are jumping Quads in Figure Skating. 4-5 years before they become eligible for Olympics.

What makes you think raising age to 16 (or even 36) will change that?
 

moonvine

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I have no clue what they are going to solve with this.

Champions retiring early? It wont. Lets face it, if there is not enough money in it for them,they are going to retire anyway.
3A type domination? It wont. 15 years old 3A would dominate 15 years old anybody else, I don't know why some people think that 17 years old 3A or 20 years old 3A won't dominate in a similar fashion. It's not the age, they are just... better than anybody before them.
Quads dominating the sport? it simply wont.

If 3A lost their jumps... this discussion would make some sense, but right now idk why even discuss that.

Right now....all the young girls doing quads are participating in an unpaid experiment to see if they are crippled by 20. I’m trying to work out the math on eating disorders of skaters vs the general public
I’m horrible at math but I bet it is 1000 fold and that’s just the ones we know about. Something needs to be done and I don’t care what it is at this point. If they have to go back to doubles, I don’t care. Eating disorders can kill a person.
 

moonvine

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11 and 10 years old novices are jumping Quads in Figure Skating. 4-5 years before they become eligible for Olympics.

What makes you think raising age to 16 (or even 36) will change that?

I was talking about all Olympic sports. The Olympics aren’t for 11 year olds in skating or downhill skiing or equestrian or track and field. They aren’t for 11 year olds period. It’s ridiculous.
 

KOBOT37

Match Penalty
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Right now....all the young girls doing quads are participating in an unpaid experiment

Unpaid? Really ?

Serfdom has been abolished in Russia since 1861.

if they are crippled by 20

Midori Ito, Mirai Nagasu, Tonya Harding, Mao Asada and Liza Tukhtamisheva doesn't seem to be crippled from 3 Axel, is that addition 1/2 turn that cripples people?!

Something needs to be done and I don’t care what

ok then.

p.s you still didn't answer how would raising age to 17(or even 37) make Veronika Zhilina or Sofya Akatyeva rethink jumping quads at the age of 10-12.
 

TT_Fin

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I was surprised when Ted said the proposal was to raise the Senior minimum to 17. Because two years is a lot to raise it by.

I have long argued that a 4 year overlap between the two levels is too much. So, I would be all for decreasing it to 2 years. However, I do think there is a better way to do it than what is being proposed.

If it was me, I would have the lower age limit for Senior Singles at 16 and the upper age limit for Junior Singles at 18. That way the overlap between the two levels would still be decreasing by 2 years, but the age ranges of each of the two levels would only be changing by 1 year.

But, I really have no idea what would be best for Pairs and Ice Dance. Because I can see the pros and cons for every possible suggestion.

CaroLiza_fan


I 100 % agree with you. What Harriet proposes would be good idea, but I will there be interest, time and money enough to organize 3 different WC competitions? Or could the competitions be combined to same? But, in many other sports there are junior competitions to more than one different age levels, why not at FS as well? But, they have not had those competitions every year and some of those competitions have been also abolished or combined, maybe just money or lack of audience interest?
 

moonvine

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Unpaid? Really ?

Serfdom has been abolished in Russia since 1861.



Midori Ito, Mirai Nagasu, Tonya Harding, Mao Asada and Liza Tukhtamisheva doesn't seem to be crippled from 3 Axel, is that addition 1/2 turn that cripples people?!



ok then.

p.s you still didn't answer how would raising age to 17(or even 37) make Veronika Zhilina or Sofya Akatyeva rethink jumping quads at the age of 10-12.

Devalue quads to where they’re worth what triples are. That should help.
 

KOBOT37

Match Penalty
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Dec 9, 2019
If it was on me, I would abolish age limits altogether,Nadia Comăneci was 14 years old when she did 'perfect 10', did sport lose from that?

and make maximum jumping elements get from 7(in SP from 3 to 6) to 10-12(and make programs longer),that would bring stamina into the game,for example Zagitova would have much better chance against 3A if this was the case. Same goes for step sequences and spins.

+start awarding skaters with higher average speed.

+start measuring speed of spins and award points for it.

+actually start awarding people with better skating skills, preferably with something measurable and not "Sorry, I see it that way", for example start giving bonus for more seconds on one leg.

+make step sequences much harder and measure them in slo-mo.

+remove restrictions like number of jumps in combo, if somebody can do 20 jumps in a combo, that means s/he is very good at that and s/he deserves to be awarded for it.

If 12 years old kid can do all these and win, so be it.
 

kolyadafan2002

Fan of Kolyada
Final Flight
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Jun 6, 2019
Unpaid? Really ?

Serfdom has been abolished in Russia since 1861.



Midori Ito, Mirai Nagasu, Tonya Harding, Mao Asada and Liza Tukhtamisheva doesn't seem to be crippled from 3 Axel, is that addition 1/2 turn that cripples people?!



ok then.

p.s you still didn't answer how would raising age to 17(or even 37) make Veronika Zhilina or Sofya Akatyeva rethink jumping quads at the age of 10-12.

Tonya harding and early axle crew werent forced onto powdered nutrients or "legal drugs"(basically new ones that havent been banned yet designed to delay puberty or prevent injury).

Nobody knows what will happen - tutberetzi academy have admitted to given zagitova drugs, so we should all be watching zagitova closely over the years to see what happens...
 
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