Coronavirus and the new season | Page 23 | Golden Skate

Coronavirus and the new season

surimi

Onward and forward, Sota!
Record Breaker
Joined
Nov 12, 2013
I wonder if it would be possible to just hold more small Challengers if the GP gets cancelled. So that skaters get an opportunity to compete but don't have to travel very far.
 

Alex D

Record Breaker
Joined
Sep 23, 2013
Sweden didn't have so strict measures like other countries. They will and already getting some pressure on that but I hope their policy will not change. Also, everyone upfront knows the dates and I hope the procedure to reach Sweden. The fact that they are part of EU helps with traveling. Most likely the EU will have a common agreement with the traveling restrictions without testing. So many teams can reach European countries a couple of weeks before, train there in some facilities and during the competition week go to Stockholm. Avoiding this way any possible quarantines etc..

Being part of the EU, won´t save you. Many european countries disagree with Swedens philosophy of herd immunity, therefore they are warning their citizens from travel to Sweden. Finland, Denmark and Norway, are not very amused about the swedish way either and could restrict travel through their borders.

Worlds would be at Stockholm, a city that is considered high risk since June, also something that plays a major part here. It´s not some isolated place, it´s the epicentre of Corona in Sweden, at least right now.

March is still several months away, but we saw in Tennis during the Adria tour, what Corona can do. Serbia believed that having crowds was safe, but it wasn´t. The event had to be cancelled due several infections, while being at the second stop of the tour. It´s not only about what happens at Stockholm, it´s also about what happens back home?! Skaters have parents and grandparents, they might catch the Virus and bring it back home.

As much I understand the desire for sports, the health of athletes, their families, organizers and fans, must come first and unless we are 100% sure, nobody will be at risk, having worlds is not an option in my books.

F1 took place this weekend ( in Austria). Why shouldn't figure skating?

Figure skating is an indoor event, I explained before why that is a big issue. It has to do with the vent system used. It must have a special filter, used in hospitals, as else the air will not be properly recycled and the Virus will hover inside the venue for hours, infecting a huge amount of people, as the Virus loves these cooler, humid conditions.

Outdoor events, won´t have these problems, besides that, the Formula One is much more capable of coming up with a hygiene concept, as they have pretty much unlimited funds.

During Corona, we must look at the city / country where an event takes place, but also at the financial background of those hosting it. Football, Forumula One has a much larger support than smaller sports like figure skating, gymnastics and the like.


Last but not least, read the "refund policy" and ask yourself if you would accept it, even if it could conflict with EU law, the money might be lost forever.
 

drivingmissdaisy

Record Breaker
Joined
Feb 17, 2010
I wonder if it would be possible to just hold more small Challengers if the GP gets cancelled. So that skaters get an opportunity to compete but don't have to travel very far.

I think this would be ideal. Russia will certainly have domestic competitions that will include its top skaters, and the US (and other countries) will be at a big disadvantage if our skaters aren't given competitive opportunities. These club events, where you might have one or two top-tier competitors and very small audiences, aren't enough.
 

Jeanie19

Record Breaker
Joined
Oct 20, 2017
Country
United-States
I think this would be ideal. Russia will certainly have domestic competitions that will include its top skaters, and the US (and other countries) will be at a big disadvantage if our skaters aren't given competitive opportunities. These club events, where you might have one or two top-tier competitors and very small audiences, aren't enough.

The U.S. and Canada could have 2 events, one on the east coast and one on west coast. Both countries have foreign skaters training there, so it would be a competitive competition.
 

NanaPat

Record Breaker
Joined
Oct 25, 2014
Country
Canada
The U.S. and Canada could have 2 events, one on the east coast and one on west coast. Both countries have foreign skaters training there, so it would be a competitive competition.

That's assuming the US/Canadian border is open. It is currently closed (with exceptions) until July 21. The agreement is for one month at a time, and so far it has been renewed every time it is set to expire. I would not be at all surprised to have to renewed again (and again, and again....)
 

StitchMonkey

Record Breaker
Joined
Jul 31, 2014
I wonder if it would be possible to just hold more small Challengers if the GP gets cancelled. So that skaters get an opportunity to compete but don't have to travel very far.

I have suggested this and still think it is the better idea.

Assuming we have 4CC/Euros/Worlds in 2021, I want skaters to get a chance to earn the minimum TES... especially in a pre Olympic year. Grand Prix skaters don't really need to worry about that.

Stop the madness or trying to fix the damn plane while it is in flight! We should take a step back and work with the new normal and skip the old normal for this season.

I will add there is no reason we could not have a junior component of challenger events. Heck alot do already. So juniors would still have some opportunity to compete. Perhaps the ISU should give them some world ranking points as well for fairness.

Really something more like the Challenger series would fit better. it is more flexible, more open, and less populated. Heck we could even hold them in small/localish rinks and skip the audience if need be. We could have a season of some sort with some flexibility and patience (ie no final location decisions till very late to take trends and such into account), but this GP or bust attitude feels like we are about to toss the baby out with the bathwater.
 

Alex D

Record Breaker
Joined
Sep 23, 2013
I have suggested this and still think it is the better idea.

Assuming we have 4CC/Euros/Worlds in 2021, I want skaters to get a chance to earn the minimum TES... especially in a pre Olympic year. Grand Prix skaters don't really need to worry about that.

Stop the madness or trying to fix the damn plane while it is in flight! We should take a step back and work with the new normal and skip the old normal for this season.

I will add there is no reason we could not have a junior component of challenger events. Heck alot do already. So juniors would still have some opportunity to compete. Perhaps the ISU should give them some world ranking points as well for fairness.

Really something more like the Challenger series would fit better. it is more flexible, more open, and less populated. Heck we could even hold them in small/localish rinks and skip the audience if need be. We could have a season of some sort with some flexibility and patience (ie no final location decisions till very late to take trends and such into account), but this GP or bust attitude feels like we are about to toss the baby out with the bathwater.

While I agree with the "wait and see" attitude, it is not that easy in sports to go that path. If you organize an event, you need a couple of months in advance, as bigger the event as more time is needed. First you must find a location that is available, while meeting the required standarts for sports events.
While each country has different rules that an OC must met, it will take time to even receive permission to host an event. There are folks from the local authorities coming over and they will check everything from the toilets to the emergency exit.

Security protocols must be met, but you also need a budget that you can work with, quite often said budgets need sponsors and once you have that, you most likely still need volunteers. Also keep in mind, judges are not "phone me and I come" either. There are people at the federations who have to organize their travel, accomodation and that can be quite difficult as we saw a few years back at Oberstdorf where a judge had to stay in the cold outside all night.

Of course if everyone would want to host their event at the same time, a judges shortage could happen, but also skaters and coaches could run into difficulties, which is why many OC´s take a very close look at other events and their dates, so that things don´t happen at the same time too often. A common issue we had with our skating events at Dortmund.

So, I am afraid that time is running out slowly. :(
 

Moxiejan

Medalist
Joined
Jan 11, 2014
Country
United-States
I’ve just been reading reports from local news outlets in Las Vegas & there apparently is a huge virus spike there that isn’t yet getting national attention, likely due to the current focus on Florida, Texas, Arizona, etc. Folks there think the casinos/hotels soon will be shut down again. With an Aug. 1 deadline coming up soon to make a decision on Skate America (and likely the rest of the GP), I’m sadly thinking that we won’t be seeing any elite skating this fall.
 

surimi

Onward and forward, Sota!
Record Breaker
Joined
Nov 12, 2013
^ Looks like the page no longer exists... what did it say?
 

surimi

Onward and forward, Sota!
Record Breaker
Joined
Nov 12, 2013
I see. As for big events, it looks like he's going to be right. I am still holding out hope the ISU will figure out something to help skaters stay competitive and motivated, like more smaller and cheaper events where skaters wouldn't have to travel big distances to get to and where practically only skaters from nearby countries would show up. But it's all risky, so who knows.
 

sillylionlove29

Rinkside
Joined
Sep 27, 2017
My sister in law lives in California and my father in law lives in Nevada. The numbers are getting pretty high that in California they are starting to shut down things again and I’m guessing Nevada will soon follow. I live in New Jersey and it’s suggested that if we travel to states with high numbers that when we come back that we self quarantine for 14 days. Nevada and California are on that list along with like 20 other states. In addition, there’s talk that the Canadian border with the US won’t open until next year and the EU won’t let people from the US in and no one knows when that restriction will be lifted. It would be hard to have any kind of competitions when people can’t get there or if they do they can’t get back home.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
 

Finley

Record Breaker
Joined
Feb 19, 2014
I see. As for big events, it looks like he's going to be right. I am still holding out hope the ISU will figure out something to help skaters stay competitive and motivated, like more smaller and cheaper events where skaters wouldn't have to travel big distances to get to and where practically only skaters from nearby countries would show up. But it's all risky, so who knows.

Don't they have to hold WCs in 2021 order to determine Olympic qualifications for Beijing? If Beijing ends up being postponed until later in 2022 maybe that will influence the timing of Worlds?

I guess at this point the answer to every question is - Who knows? Maybe? :(
 

AshWagsFan

Edges for days.
Final Flight
Joined
Oct 14, 2017
Country
United-States
This may have already been discussed (not sure), but should the ISU consider creating a “bubble” like the NBA in the US did for the Grand Prix? It’s a system where all of the athletes who would like to compete would go to one country or city (with multiple rinks) and train and compete together. No fans. No outsiders allowed in other than coaches, skaters, judges, officials, etc. Everyone would be housed in empty hotels, and everyone must be required to wear masks at all times (unless competing or practicing I believe but I’m not sure). Would it work?

Article on NBA “bubble”: https://www.espn.com/nba/story/_/id/29436643/first-teams-take-court-practice-nba-bubble

The only reason I could see this not happening is because of travel bans, but, unlike the NBA, the ISU has until late September/early October to create something like this, and travel restrictions may be lightened by then.
 

believed

On the Ice
Joined
Apr 20, 2018
The only reason I could see this not happening is because of travel bans, but, unlike the NBA, the ISU has until late September/early October to create something like this, and travel restrictions may be lightened by then.

Also the NBA has a lot more money.
 

Smith16

Rinkside
Joined
May 30, 2016
MLS (Major League Soccer) is currently having a "MLS is back tournament" in Florida and they're also using the bubble and it doesn't seem to be working. Two teams have already had to pull out of the tournament (Dallas & Nashville) because of bunch of players ( 9 alone on the Dallas team) still contracted covid and another team announced earlier today that some of their players have also contracted the virus. So now they're thinking the bubble might not help that much. Which is interesting when compared to EPL (The english premier league) who've been playing for longer and don't necessarily have a bubble but their players are tested every two days and since the epl has been back no one's tested positive.
 

karne

in Emergency Backup Mode
Record Breaker
Joined
Jan 1, 2013
Country
Australia
Don't they have to hold WCs in 2021 order to determine Olympic qualifications for Beijing? If Beijing ends up being postponed until later in 2022 maybe that will influence the timing of Worlds?

Yes, Worlds 2021 then Nebelhorn 2021 would determine the Beijing spots. That's a problem in and of itself, and the ISU hasn't even announced how they're going to figure out GP slots and Worlds spots for this coming season, let alone looking ahead to the Olys. Of course, since we're not going to get a GP the point about GP slots is moot, but the Worlds spots will be an interesting argument.

This may have already been discussed (not sure), but should the ISU consider creating a “bubble” like the NBA in the US did for the Grand Prix? It’s a system where all of the athletes who would like to compete would go to one country or city (with multiple rinks) and train and compete together. No fans. No outsiders allowed in other than coaches, skaters, judges, officials, etc. Everyone would be housed in empty hotels, and everyone must be required to wear masks at all times (unless competing or practicing I believe but I’m not sure). Would it work?

No, it won't work.

The MLB and the NBA are American-only series. The bubble only has to worry about taking in people from other states of the US. Border closures don't impact the bubble. The MLB and the NBA are also incredibly rich sports with tons of money floating around.

The Grand Prix involves skaters from multiple countries, most of whom have shut borders. There are multiple skaters who are legally minors and would need chaperoning. Almost all of them would need to quarantine on return to their home country anyway. Some, like Brendan and Kailani, would actually not be allowed to leave their home country. And then the big question: where would you hold it?. Obviously the US is out. And then who pays? Who is in the bubble? Remember also that a lot of the international coaches and judges are older; additionally, judges and officials are all volunteers - are we going to ask them to take three months off their paid work in this uncertain economic time??
 

Alex D

Record Breaker
Joined
Sep 23, 2013
Yes, Worlds 2021 then Nebelhorn 2021 would determine the Beijing spots. That's a problem in and of itself, and the ISU hasn't even announced how they're going to figure out GP slots and Worlds spots for this coming season, let alone looking ahead to the Olys. Of course, since we're not going to get a GP the point about GP slots is moot, but the Worlds spots will be an interesting argument.



No, it won't work.

The MLB and the NBA are American-only series. The bubble only has to worry about taking in people from other states of the US. Border closures don't impact the bubble. The MLB and the NBA are also incredibly rich sports with tons of money floating around.

The Grand Prix involves skaters from multiple countries, most of whom have shut borders. There are multiple skaters who are legally minors and would need chaperoning. Almost all of them would need to quarantine on return to their home country anyway. Some, like Brendan and Kailani, would actually not be allowed to leave their home country. And then the big question: where would you hold it?. Obviously the US is out. And then who pays? Who is in the bubble? Remember also that a lot of the international coaches and judges are older; additionally, judges and officials are all volunteers - are we going to ask them to take three months off their paid work in this uncertain economic time??

I agree with Karne here,

to keep a "bubble" for weeks or months, can work if you have the infastructure for it and if the athletes are willing to sacrifice some of their freedom, but it´s pretty hard to do if multiple nationalities and rules will come together. In Soccer our national federation the DFB, always sends school teachers with our soccer youth teams to tournaments, something like that could be considered doable for the minors at skating too, but I somehow doubt, that national figure skating federations all have the money for that.

You also have to ask yourself, if it´s good to seperate kids from their home for months. Yes, during the season they might travel a lot or be at camps, but they always can go back and some actually do even if it´s just for a short amount of time or their parents come over from time to time. But with Corona, they wouldn´t be able to do this and the risk is always there, that they might become stranded when the borders close.

Figure skating without volunteers won´t work, Karne explained the issue there very well, nothing to add.

And if we talk about the adults, then I somehow question if all would keep the bubble and if not some would try to break out from it. We saw it at F1, German Bundesliga and other sports before. Adults are stubborn :), we can witness that in the news everyday.
 
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