2018-19 Japanese Ladies' figure skating | Page 124 | Golden Skate

2018-19 Japanese Ladies' figure skating

chopinskate

chopinskate

Joined
Dec 9, 2017
lzxnl said:
If Kaori gets a consistent 3A next season, she would certainly be one to beat. However, Rika without her 3A is still on a pretty similar level to Kaori, except she doesn't have lutz edge issues. Kaori's skating is a little more fluid than Rika's, but I personally quite like Rika's interpretation of the music (whether that was innate or trained by coaches is a different story).

Then, of course, we have Sasha to deal with, who could possibly swarm the rest of the field with an insurmountable TES lead. Three quad Sasha will not be easy to beat, especially if she somehow lands her own 3A.
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This season, I would place Sakamoto behind Kihira based on jumping, because of her flutz and lack of 3A. For the edge jumps they share Sakamoto delivers better, IMO. For her PCS, I think Sakamoto has better SS, but also she has matured a lot this season. In comparison, Kihira comes off a little immature though still very good. If both clean, I think Kihira should win it based off jumping.

Next season, of course, it is possible that the gap I see in maturity will be entirely diminished next season if Kihira works at it, and then Kihira will be ahead of Sakamoto even without a quad. Or it could be widened or stay the same, which would place Sakamoto ahead of Kihira if she doesn't get a quad/some large gap in BV. It also depends on the kind of programs they each get.

Trusova could be ahead based off insurmountable jumping for sure. In terms of all-around quality (instead of just quantity), though, I'd place Kihira and Sakamoto ahead (although of course, Trusova could also work on her skating and become very good all-around herself, then she would easily be first).
 
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Baron Vladimir

Record Breaker
Joined
Dec 18, 2014
chopinskate said:
This season, I would place Sakamoto behind Kihira based on jumping, because of her flutz and lack of 3A. For the edge jumps they share Sakamoto delivers better, IMO. For her PCS, I think Sakamoto has better SS, but also she has matured a lot this season. In comparison, Kihira comes off a little immature though still very good. If both clean, I think Kihira should win it based off jumping.
Click to expand...

Sakamoto is deffinitely faster accros the ice and has better ice coverage as a product of that. But she is skating with two foot a lot which is a problem. Kihira has a lot more multidirectional skating and one foot skating as more different steps and turns and body movements which is helping her SS score and also other components score.
 
chopinskate

chopinskate

Joined
Dec 9, 2017
Baron Vladimir said:
Sakamoto is deffinitely faster accros the ice and has better ice coverage as a product of that. But she is skating with two foot a lot which is a problem. Kihira has a lot more multidirectional skating and one foot skating as more different steps and turns and body movements which is helping her SS score and also other components score.
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You are free to make that argument as to why Kihira deserves scores close to Sakamoto's on SS. But what you've said doesn't go against my point of Sakamoto having better SS.
 
L

lzxnl

Final Flight
Joined
Nov 8, 2018
chopinskate said:
You are free to make that argument as to why Kihira deserves scores close to Sakamoto's on SS. But what you've said doesn't go against my point of Sakamoto having better SS.
Click to expand...

I always thought two-footed skating did not display a high degree of skating skills. Maybe I'm thinking wrong.

chopinskate said:
This season, I would place Sakamoto behind Kihira based on jumping, because of her flutz and lack of 3A. For the edge jumps they share Sakamoto delivers better, IMO. For her PCS, I think Sakamoto has better SS, but also she has matured a lot this season. In comparison, Kihira comes off a little immature though still very good. If both clean, I think Kihira should win it based off jumping.

Next season, of course, it is possible that the gap I see in maturity will be entirely diminished next season if Kihira works at it, and then Kihira will be ahead of Sakamoto even without a quad. Or it could be widened or stay the same, which would place Sakamoto ahead of Kihira if she doesn't get a quad/some large gap in BV. It also depends on the kind of programs they each get.

Trusova could be ahead based off insurmountable jumping for sure. In terms of all-around quality (instead of just quantity), though, I'd place Kihira and Sakamoto ahead (although of course, Trusova could also work on her skating and become very good all-around herself, then she would easily be first).
Click to expand...

There's too many unknowns, as well as the inconsistency that inevitably accompanies a triple axel or a quad for the first season. I would give Rika the highest chance of placing ahead of the other two right now due to her roundedness and technical content, but a lot could happen in the next six months. Any of the scenarios you suggest is possible. I think Rika will certainly work on her skating and expression next season, given that technically, she doesn't need to worry about too much aside from two jumps. I do believe Trusova will want that 3A, although I don't know what'll happen to her quads. She would need a quad and another quad and/or a 3A to stay competitive with/ahead of Rika, unless her components rise dramatically from this year. I haven't followed Kaori long enough to see her strengths and weaknesses in any detail, unfortunately.
 
chopinskate

chopinskate

Joined
Dec 9, 2017
lzxnl said:
I always thought two-footed skating did not display a high degree of skating skills. Maybe I'm thinking wrong.
Click to expand...

Low-quality two-footed skating doesn't display a high degree of skating skills. Just like low-quality one-footed skating doesn't display great skating skills. All else equal, sure, someone who does more one-foot skating should get higher SS scores.

To me, Kaori has better speed and control of edges. And even with the one-foot skating argument, she does do stuff on one foot. That puts her ahead of Rika, who's got great SS for age anyway.
 
B

Baron Vladimir

Record Breaker
Joined
Dec 18, 2014
chopinskate said:
You are free to make that argument as to why Kihira deserves scores close to Sakamoto's on SS. But what you've said doesn't go against my point of Sakamoto having better SS.
Click to expand...

I think i already did that. In 1/2 of Skating Skills categories defined by ISU (which i mentioned above - steps and turns, one foot skating and multidirectional skating) Kihira's demonstration is better than Sakamoto (who just didn't have that in her programs as she is skating fast on two foot). Even if Sakamoto is better in rest of the categories, that just means their general SS score will be most likely equal.
 
chopinskate

chopinskate

Joined
Dec 9, 2017
Baron Vladimir said:
In 1/2 of Skating Skills categories defined by ISU
Click to expand...
That the judges themselves don't follow.

Baron Vladimir said:
Kihira's demonstration is better than Sakamoto (who didn't have that in her programs). Even if Sakamoto is better in rest of the categories, that just means their general SS score will be most likely equal.
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Is Kihira's ability to do more steps and turns/one-foot skating/multidirectional skating than Sakamoto enough to trump the better quality on those categories that Sakamoto brings, even if with slightly lower quantity?

I don't follow what part of this blows people's minds.
 
S

Shedi0806

On the Ice
Joined
Mar 22, 2018
chopinskate said:
Low-quality two-footed skating doesn't display a high degree of skating skills. Just like low-quality one-footed skating doesn't display great skating skills. All else equal, sure, someone who does more one-foot skating should get higher SS scores.

To me, Kaori has better speed and control of edges. And even with the one-foot skating argument, she does do stuff on one foot. That puts her ahead of Rika, who's got great SS for age anyway.
Click to expand...

I haven't seen Rika live so I cannot comment on her, I just looooved Kaori's speed and ice-coverage at Helsinki. There is something about her that is just so lovely, she is very relatable and her energy is contagious.
 
amarjargal

amarjargal

Rinkside
Joined
Oct 21, 2017
skatenewbie said:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VAiyCGuptIc - here her video practicing it. Its close, less than 1/2 rotation. She need to rotate faster and get higher height i think. She can work on it in off season and try it next season for sure
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I so want her to add 3A to her arsenal and have it already stable at the time of next Olympics. Same hope for Wakaba too. Next Olympics will be battle of 3As and quads.

A rough translation of the video:

She keeps training 3A with the goal to include it in her programs.
Kaori: (Right now) there are only few (who do 3A). But I think that around the time of next Olympics, the number might double or even triple. To be honest, I'm in a haste, I believe it'll feel great if I could officially include it in my program since I'm constantly training it.
 
I

irriya

On the Ice
Joined
Mar 31, 2016
I'm afraid that Kaori's speed entering jump and exit is a little too fast. It would be really hard to control 3A. Good luck and keep healthy which is most important.
 
rikaquegira

rikaquegira

On the Ice
Joined
Nov 30, 2017
amarjargal said:
I so want her to add 3A to her arsenal and have it already stable at the time of next Olympics. Same hope for Wakaba too. Next Olympics will be battle of 3As and quads.

A rough translation of the video:

She keeps training 3A with the goal to include it in her programs.
Kaori: (Right now) there are only few (who do 3A). But I think that around the time of next Olympics, the number might double or even triple. To be honest, I'm in a haste, I believe it'll feel great if I could officially include it in my program since I'm constantly training it.
Click to expand...

ooooh, so she IS training the 3A??? Interesting!!
Maybe that's why she had trouble with the 2A? It wasn't the first time she messed up that combo.
I would love to see a 3A from Kaori, I think she's a pretty good jumper(flutz aside). Her edge jumps seem to be her strength, maybe she could start practicing 4S too? :love:

I think the Japanese Ladies are great this season and if they keep improving I can see they being very competitive by next Olympics.
What worries me a bit is not the current crop of skaters but the next.
The Junior ladies didn't do well this season, although some of them are clearly very talented(Tomoe and Yuhana are the ones who caught my attention the most). I think Tomoe is the one to keep an eye on. The problem is that with her 0 pre-rotation on toe jumps she seems to struggle to get them fully around at times, this could become a problem so I hope they're working on that. She has beautiful jumps, some of The most beautiful jumps. If she can get a 3A or quad(it seems the future is already here), she will be competitive in Senior. Of course she'll need to work on packaging as well, I feel like she's not an all around skater yet and needs to mature a lot, which is obviously understandable but shouldn't be overlooked.

Anyway, I'm rambling here. :laugh:
 
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