2019 Worlds: Ice Dance Pregame Chat | Page 5 | Golden Skate

2019 Worlds: Ice Dance Pregame Chat

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CanadianSkaterGuy

Record Breaker
Joined
Jan 25, 2013
The Spanish situation seems to be the most vexing. Why hasn’t S/D been outscoring the other team? Real difference in quality or politics?

Agreed. Smart/Diaz can't seem to catch a break - they were essentially robbed of the Olympics, and due to injuries/errors this season, they've lost ground to H/K. H/K also got some momentum with their silver (first dance medal for Spain) on the Grand Prix -- although they were super lucky to go to the easiest GP event at Rostelecom (where them getting even 165 points would have been enough for bronze)... S/D performing as well as they can would have also gotten silver there too.

But yeah, also S/D can do better than their freedance shows. I fully expect them to overtake H/K next season if they stay healthy because they truly are the better team, IMO.
 

LaArdilla

Medalist
Joined
Sep 21, 2017
Note to Choreographers and Coaches: Befriend a theater queen who will be able to give you suggestion after suggestion after suggestion for little known but potentially wonderful Broadway songs and scores. They'll love to help and you'll have a far wider range of options than PoTO, Les Miz, WSS, Disneyeverything. And give those poor overworked warhorses a much deserved rest!
They could also listen to the girls from the Flutzes and Waxels podcast, who are HUGE musicals and Broadway nerds and have already been hinting that they will have the whole list of suggestions prepared at the end of this season :D
 

WeakAnkles

Record Breaker
Joined
Aug 1, 2011
They could also listen to the girls from the Flutzes and Waxels podcast, who are HUGE musicals and Broadway nerds and have already been hinting that they will have the whole list of suggestions prepared at the end of this season :D

Theater queens cross all borders of gender and location and age and the like. I'd love to hear their suggestions.
 

dorispulaski

Wicked Yankee Girl
Joined
Jul 26, 2003
Country
United-States
Here are the top total scores, following 4cc's and Europeans. I have removed teams that are definitely not going to Worlds. H/B do have a good chance for top ten, especially if they can hit more key points in the rhythm dance than they did at 4cc's. They are in the top 10 here.

http://www.isuresults.com/isujsstat/pbsdto.htm



PlaceNameNat.EventDate (dd.mm.yyyy)Score
1Gabriella PAPADAKIS / Guillaume CIZERONFRAISU European Championships 201926.01.2019217.98
2Madison CHOCK / Evan BATESUSAISU Four Continents Championships 201910.02.2019207.42
3Alexandra STEPANOVA / Ivan BUKINRUSISU European Championships 201926.01.2019206.41
4Madison HUBBELL / Zachary DONOHUEUSAISU Grand Prix Final 2018/1908.12.2018205.35
5Kaitlyn WEAVER / Andrew POJECANISU Four Continents Championships 201910.02.2019203.93
6Piper GILLES / Paul POIRIERCANISU Four Continents Championships 201910.02.2019202.45
7Victoria SINITSINA / Nikita KATSALAPOVRUSISU Grand Prix Final 2018/1908.12.2018201.37
8Charlene GUIGNARD / Marco FABBRIITAISU European Championships 201926.01.2019199.84
9Kaitlin HAWAYEK / Jean-Luc BAKERUSAISU Four Continents Championships 201910.02.2019189.87
10Laurence FOURNIER BEAUDRY / Nikolaj SORENSENCANISU Four Continents Championships 201910.02.2019186.91
11Natalia KALISZEK / Maksym SPODYRIEVPOLISU European Championships 201926.01.2019185.35
13Lilah FEAR / Lewis GIBSONGBRISU European Championships 201926.01.2019182.05
15Sara HURTADO / Kirill KHALIAVINESPISU European Championships 201926.01.2019180.67
17Marie-Jade LAURIAULT / Romain LE GACFRAISU GP Skate Canada International 201827.10.2018180.32
19Olivia SMART / Adrian DIAZESPISU CS Finlandia Trophy Espoo 201807.10.2018180.07
26Shiyue WANG / Xinyu LIUCHNISU Four Continents Championships 201910.02.2019169.11
27Juulia TURKKILA / Matthias VERSLUISFINISU European Championships 201926.01.2019168.34
32Shari KOCH / Christian NÜCHTERNGERISU CS Golden Spin of Zagreb 201808.12.2018165.31
 

moonvine

All Hail Queen Gracie
Record Breaker
Joined
Mar 14, 2007
Country
United-States
Thanks. H/B are my faves:) I did prefer their choreography last year. But overall the move has been good for them, I think. I just hope for better choreography next year.
 

ancientpeas

The Notorious SEW
Record Breaker
Joined
Jan 11, 2014
If it went purely according to scores Poland would be within a hairs breath of getting two places.

I am really rooting for my disco brits and I actually have grown to love both P/C's RD (a first for me) and their Free(I have loved all of their free dances that I have seen). I really wish H/D would get a new free dance.

Still not getting the C/B love but more power to them. I think they have improved this year and have better material. I do not forgive them for Imagine however. :noshake:
 

dorispulaski

Wicked Yankee Girl
Joined
Jul 26, 2003
Country
United-States
The disco Brits and C/B have similar plusses in their FDs this year. Both teams project a sense of joy (and a good sense of timing) expressed in dance to music with a distinct upbeat flair... In today's ice dance world where there are so many almost beatless, lugubrious, tone poem-ish, emulations of P&C, both dances really stand out. Joy is infectious and rare. It invokes an overwhelming desire to reward it.

I still shake my head, trying to figure out Hubbell & Donohue's choices this season. Why did a pair of former lovers, closer to 30 than to their teens, choose to dance to R&J? Why did the beautiful Madison choose a costume that looks more appropriate for Juliet's nurse than for Juliet? and if they felt compelled to act out R&J, why "Kissing You?". :bang:

Perhaps they have fallen victim to the curse of silver. How do you stay motivated when you want that top step on the podium, but when there is a large score gap to it? What risks will you take? Both C/B and W/P, for example, fell victim to it in earlier seasons. Instead of moving up, attempts to make big changes, and/or to push too hard, caused them to fall in the standings instead for a while.

W/P have a very good RD, but unreliable twizzles this season. I am not crazy about their FD, and it feels to me like another attempt to look like P&C.

Meanwhile, Gilles & Poirier have a great FD, and are finally being recognized for it.

And, the two Russian teams, powered by the fact that there is now no clear Russian number one, are moving up. All three teams (G/P, S/B, and S/K) have the virtue of not looking like Montreal based teams.

It will be an interesting Worlds.
 
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WeakAnkles

Record Breaker
Joined
Aug 1, 2011
The disco Brits and C/B have similar plusses in their FDs this year. Both teams project a sense of joy (and a good sense of timing) expressed in dance to music with a distinct upbeat flair... In today's ice dance world where there are so many almost beatless, lugubrious, tone poem-ish, emulations of P&C, both dances really stand out. Joy is infectious and rare. It invokes an overwhelming desire to reward it.

I still shake my head, trying to figure out Hubbell & Donohue's choices this season. Why did a pair of former lovers, closer to 30 than to their teens, choose to dance to R&J? Why did the beautiful Madison choose a costume that looks more appropriate for Juliet's nurse than for Juliet? and if they felt compelled to act out R&J, why "Kissing You?". :bang:

Perhaps they have fallen victim to the curse of silver. How do you stay motivated when you want that top step on the podium, but when there is a large score gap to it? What risks will you take? Both C/B and W/P, for example, fell victim to it in earlier seasons. Instead of moving up, attempts to make big changes, and/or to push too hard, caused them to fall in the standings instead for a while.

W/P have a very good RD, but unreliable twizzles this season. I am not crazy about their FD, and it feels to me like another attempt to look like P&C.

Meanwhile, Gilles & Poirier have a great FD, and are finally being recognized for it.

And, the two Russian teams, powered by the fact that there is now no clear Russian number one, are moving up. All three teams (G/P, S/B, and S/P) have the virtue of not looking like Montreal based teams.

It will be an interesting Worlds.

Spot on. I love Sensitive White Guys with a guitar as much as the next emo nerd, but after this season I may spend the entire summer listening to nothing but punk and Irish folk songs.

Funny but true: I put on an Easy Listening Station for my Mom to listen to -- the kind of station that makes Muzak sound like Heavy Metal -- and I can't tell you how many warhorses I've heard today on it. Right now it's Les Miz in Full Schmaltz Strings Mode.

Still, it will be a very interesting Worlds.
 

dorispulaski

Wicked Yankee Girl
Joined
Jul 26, 2003
Country
United-States
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WeakAnkles

Record Breaker
Joined
Aug 1, 2011
Yes, Easy Listening.

Instead of Irish folk or Punk, how about the combination of the two?

It makes me yearn for someone to skate to the Dropkick Murphys:


Perhaps
Rose Tattoo
https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=x-64CaD8GXw

And

Shipping Up to Boston
https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=x-64CaD8GXw


But definitely
The Season's Upon Us for an EX at Christmas time
https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=qTx-sdR6Yzk

It would be quite a palette cleanser after all the saccharin and schmaltz.

LOVE Shipping Up to Boston.

I'm also a huge huge huge Pogues fan and would love to see someone skate to Fairytale of New York, but I'm afraid just posting some of the lyrics here would get me a warning (!), so I can only imagine the reaction it would get from the ultra-staid world of ID judges.
 

Ice Dance

Record Breaker
Joined
Jan 26, 2014
And, the two Russian teams, powered by the fact that there is now no clear Russian number one, are moving up. All three teams (G/P, S/B, and S/P) have the virtue of not looking like Montreal based teams.

Who are S/P? S/K? I would say that the first half of S/K's FD is rather Montreal-esque, but the second half has a better climactic build than your average Montreal program. I still feel that it's lacking a sense of unity and clear point of view.

I would add Guignard & Fabbri as having an FD program that stands out from the rest of the ice dance numbers this season. It is a character-based period piece and very successful at it.
 

dorispulaski

Wicked Yankee Girl
Joined
Jul 26, 2003
Country
United-States
That should be S/K

Guignard & Fabbri have an RD that is memorable, with a stunning, acrobatic lift, but I cannot recall their FD at all at this time. I will have to go look at it again. :eeking: La La Land
 
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cell

On the Ice
Joined
Feb 11, 2006
Still not getting the C/B love but more power to them. I think they have improved this year and have better material. I do not forgive them for Imagine however. :noshake:

I really don't get the hate for Imagine ... the singing may have been sappy but Dean's choreo was nice and they connected with the piece really well.

I don't like the Elvis part of the new FD, too much posing for me. I like the Fever part.
 

Scrufflet

Final Flight
Joined
Mar 1, 2010
LOVE Shipping Up to Boston.

I'm also a huge huge huge Pogues fan and would love to see someone skate to Fairytale of New York, but I'm afraid just posting some of the lyrics here would get me a warning (!), so I can only imagine the reaction it would get from the ultra-staid world of ID judges.

Re Fairytale of New York: This Hour Has 22 Minutes (Canadian comedy show) did a funny spoof on it for their Christmas show this past year. Nothing to do with skating but you might enjoy it.
 

Ice Dance

Record Breaker
Joined
Jan 26, 2014
That should be S/K

Guignard & Fabbri have an RD that is memorable, with a stunning, acrobatic lift, but I cannot recall their FD at all at this time. I will have to go look at it again. :eeking: La La Land

Yes, it's La La Land. It's the best; and I hope, the last for some while. If we are fortunate, it may save us from having 5 of them in the RD next year.
 

WeakAnkles

Record Breaker
Joined
Aug 1, 2011
Yes, it's La La Land. It's the best; and I hope, the last for some while. If we are fortunate, it may save us from having 5 of them in the RD next year.

Technically, they shouldn't use it as LLL has never been a Broadway musical.

At least yet.

I'm sure there's someone somewhere working on turning it into one!
 

NoNameFace

GS given name - Beatrice
Record Breaker
Joined
Nov 12, 2012
The disco Brits and C/B have similar plusses in their FDs this year. Both teams project a sense of joy (and a good sense of timing) expressed in dance to music with a distinct upbeat flair... In today's ice dance world where there are so many almost beatless, lugubrious, tone poem-ish, emulations of P&C, both dances really stand out. Joy is infectious and rare. It invokes an overwhelming desire to reward it.

I still shake my head, trying to figure out Hubbell & Donohue's choices this season. Why did a pair of former lovers, closer to 30 than to their teens, choose to dance to R&J? Why did the beautiful Madison choose a costume that looks more appropriate for Juliet's nurse than for Juliet? and if they felt compelled to act out R&J, why "Kissing You?". :bang:

Perhaps they have fallen victim to the curse of silver. How do you stay motivated when you want that top step on the podium, but when there is a large score gap to it? What risks will you take? Both C/B and W/P, for example, fell victim to it in earlier seasons. Instead of moving up, attempts to make big changes, and/or to push too hard, caused them to fall in the standings instead for a while.

W/P have a very good RD, but unreliable twizzles this season. I am not crazy about their FD, and it feels to me like another attempt to look like P&C.

Meanwhile, Gilles & Poirier have a great FD, and are finally being recognized for it.

And, the two Russian teams, powered by the fact that there is now no clear Russian number one, are moving up. All three teams (G/P, S/B, and S/K) have the virtue of not looking like Montreal based teams.

It will be an interesting Worlds.

That sums it about right:)

My few cents inspired by your thoughts - I also believe that the strenght of Chock/Bates & Fear/Gibson material comes from not only invoking joy, but presenting it in a matching dynamic & believable way, backed by suitable design and movement styling. Both choreographies for me achieve a rare thing being pleasant and 'easy' - looking balance between slower & quicker tempos: with Brits we have lots of Disco references, transitions in vein of the music, with Americans that jazzy/ballroom glam style lacing whole thing. And what's more for me-both teams seem to really enjoy that energetic, catchy aesthetic of program, adding to memorable performance in sea of ones you mentioned.

Hubbell/Donohue vs Chock/Bates - seeing now the dynamic in results shifting a bit, I think that what H/D lacked before this season was to look at themselves, where they currently are from some kind of 'distance' & with creative thoughfulness to it. There is no doubt that they are skilled skaters, but it could get lost in mediocre/uninspired or just plainly mismatched material, which is the case for me - there's a cognitive dissonance in basically everything about that FD. RD also looks kinda dated and too forced on expression. Meanwhile, Chock & Bates looks like have taken a good, re-juvenating perspective this season: they look competition-hungry & competition-ready, with enthusiasm over every time they cimpete; I cannot help, but gauge a bit of too much cockiness/overly confident stance in H/D this season - yes, they won everything up to 4CC, but I did not see that 'ruling' factor there, owning the material, pushing themselves more, it was more about keeping their status quo with little thought about competition. Then, 4CC comes, with 2 teams not competing at GP season, with steady push from Gilles/Poirier and they look even blander than before, even aside this trippy lift. I think that they could have misjudged this season before it started tbh, because I see quite a few teams hungry, pushing, up & going, having some idea for themselves at the beginning of this new quad while they seem a bit stuck. Few words about Hawayek/Baker while at US teams - I am curious what's next for AND from them. Seeing H/D as a bit stuck/stagnant team, C/B as more dynamic/progressive one, Kaitlin & Jean-Luc are ones in the middle I feel. Their RD for me is a bit of misopportunity and FD while fitting conceptually leaves me a bit unsatisfied, I just know they are capable of more, of making more of a 'statement' in terms of their material.

For me, even from Predictions standpoint, WeaPo & Russian teams will be the most wildcard-ish to place. I also think that WeaPo have superb RD, in rather classical Tango vein, but standing out, yet I am not entirely sure about reliance on their twizzles/levels & how their PCS will fare among the whole pack. I am not sure, but it could be about skating order, or it could have some influence. I don't know how much RD double fall at Euros will damage potential podium chances of Sinitsina/Katsalapov - up to that point, for me they were top 5 material almost surely, HOWEVER my personal opinion is that they are somehow a safer bet for Russian team on podium than Stepanova/Bukin (I know this is an unpopular opinion) - apart from these falls, I just sensed more stability/security in decent levels from them and just more consistency. Stepanova/Bukin sure has material that sets them apart visually from the pack, I am just not sure if this will be GPF or Euros as for tech calls, especially in RD. Personally, I am not convinced on being so 'out there' material-wise, it is too loud, flashy and while I appreciate being different/trying something new I wish it would have more nuance and less 'heavy-hitting' factor to it (also more eveness in height in holds/pattern).

Guignard/Fabbri are these who could benefit the most out of mistakes/lost levels of others. Apart from that freaky fall in FD at GPF (not sure?), they proved themselves as being very solid & reliable in execution this season. I don't mind LLL in all honesty, expected even more dynamic version of it, the can sell this kind of stuff and the program itself has its charm, not everything has to be about hot romance/sex or ethereal love.

Everyone probably knows already that I am biased towards Gilles/Poirier, I don't shy away from it - and after 4CC I am almost too scared to elevate my hopes:laugh:. Speaking more realistically, this is the team who will depend on tech calls (especially in RD) & their PCS being corelated with tech execution. They will have no room for error and none of slack cut if not perfect as for PCS score - after 4CC I do feel this is a bit of turning point in establishing some self-reputation: they showed at 4CC that they are capable of strong technical delivery of their material and adding the uniqueness of their programs (FD being particularly magical in its own creation self), they have their shot, just not as easy as some. What gives me joy (and hope) is the fact that they constantly work on these programs (RD in particular), challenging their status quo, turning up a bit different at each competition. I think that regardless of result at Worlds, Vincent FD will stay on many, many minds for a long time as iconic act encapsulating creative uniqueness and authentic emotion in every move, telling an universal story, passing universal message.
 
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