2015 Worlds Ladies Free Skate March 28

[ks777]

Wow, really? Actually, neither Satoko, Radionova, or Tukt skated better than either Gracie, Ashley or Polina in the free program. Satoko had one major error. Radionova had a series of errors and poor form, and Tukt had several minor mistakes. Obviously, Tukt knew she had the cushion from the sp, and decided to play it safe. All of the final skaters were nervous about the fact that all 3 U.S. ladies had skated very well and Gracie and Ashley had been given fairly high scores, although they both deserved a bit higher on both TES and PCS. The U.S. ladies' scores were clearly held down a bit and most will say because they skated early, but it's also due to politics and perception. Ashley did have a couple of minor miscues (slight double-footed landing on one combo), but clearly Ashley deserved much higher PCS than she received, and Satoko, Radionova and Tukt received higher PCS than they deserved, especially Tukt. My goodness, just because Tukt is landing a 3-axel and she's Russian that means she deserves high PCS out the wazoo.

I love Satoko, but she is not at a point where she deserved a silver medal at Worlds. Both Gracie and Ashley are right now overall better skaters. Satoko has tremendous potential, but she needs to refine her technique and work more on getting better height on her jumps. She's a lightning fast rotator, but I question how high her overall score was. If anything, Satoko's score should have been no higher than 189, and Radionova's score for the free skate is just an example of how some skaters can mess up and not be heavily penalized, while others have to continually prove themselves and if they make the slightest mistake their scores drop. And, in the case of Gracie and Ashley, when they skate exceptionally well, their scores are still held down. It's at bottom about politics, and the fact that the U.S. Fed has historically not known how to politically support their skaters. In the current environment, U.S. Fed has little to no clout politically, especially with the fact that skating money and popularity is overseas and television contracts in the U.S. are meaningless.

Another thing: Polina, for whatever reasons was jobbed in the sp. And then with her teammates skating very well in the fp, and Polina skating almost equally as well, the decision was to keep Polina's scores down and examine her with a fine tooth comb. Why didn't they examine Satoko with a fine tooth comb? While Satoko has the potential to become a great skater, neither she, nor Tukt, nor Radionova are so great that they are better than the U.S. ladies. They simply are not. At this point, I'm tired of fans' constant criticisms of U.S. skaters too. U.S. skaters should be unconditionally supported and encouraged. BTW, Polina won 4CC over Satoko and the other Japanese ladies, so now why wasn't she given more cred at Worlds? Polina should have placed higher in both sp and fp. She skated better than Hongo and Kanako who are placed in front of her. Skating very well and coming in as the 4CCs champ, Polina was kept in 7th in both sp and fp and still overall dropped a spot to 8th!? No way. If all the ladies who came after the U.S. ladies had skated their best without significant mistakes, okay, But that's not what happened.

I give my congratulations and great props to the U.S. Ladies for going out there and showing what they are made of!!! Now consistently show just how good you are and make the asinine politics of figure skating work for you!

I don't know why you putting Satoko down. Ashley and Gracie would have beaten Satoko had they skated clean SP. It's not Satoko or the judges fault. They always seem to fall apart when it matterd the most. Maybe you should complain if they skated clean and still lost to Satoko.

 

[jenaj]

ita...

I agree, too. COP doesn't have a downgrade for "puny" jumps. Height and distance are just one feature among 6 (8?) for GOE.

 

[minze]

U

Wow, really? Actually, neither Satoko, Radionova, or Tukt skated better than either Gracie, Ashley or Polina in the free program. Satoko had one major error. Radionova had a series of errors and poor form, and Tukt had several minor mistakes. Obviously, Tukt knew she had the cushion from the sp, and decided to play it safe. All of the final skaters were nervous about the fact that all 3 U.S. ladies had skated very well and Gracie and Ashley had been given fairly high scores, although they both deserved a bit higher on both TES and PCS. The U.S. ladies' scores were clearly held down a bit and most will say because they skated early, but it's also due to politics and perception. Ashley did have a couple of minor miscues (slight double-footed landing on one combo), but clearly Ashley deserved much higher PCS than she received, and Satoko, Radionova and Tukt received higher PCS than they deserved, especially Tukt. My goodness, just because Tukt is landing a 3-axel and she's Russian that means she deserves high PCS out the wazoo.

I love Satoko, but she is not at a point where she deserved a silver medal at Worlds. Both Gracie and Ashley are right now overall better skaters. Satoko has tremendous potential, but she needs to refine her technique and work more on getting better height on her jumps. She's a lightning fast rotator, but I question how high her overall score was. If anything, Satoko's score should have been no higher than 189, and Radionova's score for the free skate is just an example of how some skaters can mess up and not be heavily penalized, while others have to continually prove themselves and if they make the slightest mistake their scores drop. And, in the case of Gracie and Ashley, when they skate exceptionally well, their scores are still held down. It's at bottom about politics, and the fact that the U.S. Fed has historically not known how to politically support their skaters. In the current environment, U.S. Fed has little to no clout politically, especially with the fact that skating money and popularity is overseas and television contracts in the U.S. are meaningless.

Another thing: Polina, for whatever reasons was jobbed in the sp. And then with her teammates skating very well in the fp, and Polina skating almost equally as well, the decision was to keep Polina's scores down and examine her with a fine tooth comb. Why didn't they examine Satoko with a fine tooth comb? While Satoko has the potential to become a great skater, neither she, nor Tukt, nor Radionova are so great that they are better than the U.S. ladies. They simply are not. At this point, I'm tired of fans' constant criticisms of U.S. skaters too. U.S. skaters should be unconditionally supported and encouraged. BTW, Polina won 4CC over Satoko and the other Japanese ladies, so now why wasn't she given more cred at Worlds? Polina should have placed higher in both sp and fp. She skated better than Hongo and Kanako who are placed in front of her. Skating very well and coming in as the 4CCs champ, Polina was kept in 7th in both sp and fp and still overall dropped a spot to 8th!? No way. If all the ladies who came after the U.S. ladies had skated their best without significant mistakes, okay, But that's not what happened.

I give my congratulations and great props to the U.S. Ladies for going out there and showing what they are made of!!! Now consistently show just how good you are and make the asinine politics of figure skating work for you!

Satoko delivered both segments, her skating skills are on par to Gracie and above Ashley. You seem to forget that Gracie got 60 points for and SP with a missed combo. She was over scored in the sp. Her LP one of the best of the night was not 100% flawless. Satoko earned.

 

[aftertherain]

You can decide not to understand what I'm saying. Yes, I'm emotional about it at the same time that I am looking at the sport without rose-colored glasses. I truly expected after Ashley and Gracie and Polina skated that they might end up in maybe 5th, 6th and 7th. But quite clearly, none of the skaters who skated after them actually skated lights out better. The fact is the U.S. ladies are all better skaters overall than a number of the ladies who were in front of them in the sp, and the politics is that Polina's scores were held down in both segments. Re Ashley and Gracie, sure they both should and could have been on the podium had they not messed up in the sp, but the fact remains that the top three were given higher PCS than deserved, and also Satoko's tech score was a bit higher than she performed. As well, Radionova truly messed up and was given too high PCS as usual. Polina did not skate poorly in the sp.

LOL. And what did you think of Gracie's score in the SP? That she was scored "just right"?

"The fact remains" that there were some cushion points in there as well, so how are you going to sit there and say that the "U.S. ladies are all better skaters overall than a number of the ladies who were in front of them in the sp" and then acknowledge that "had they not messed up in the sp," that they could have been on the podium and then accuse only the top three of having inflated scores?

It's nice to see that Gracie has finally skated a good long program this season, but in case you're going to sit there and tell me that she hasn't had a nice cushion in every single one of her competitions this season or that it's okay that she had that cushion because she just "so much better," save it. I don't want to hear it.

I can swallow (deserved) criticism of the top three, but from what I can tell, everything you've said in the last three or four posts is a result of sour grapes--not "without rose-colored glasses" like you've claimed. So sit down, have a drink, and enjoy watching the U.S. ladies' free skating performances again.

 

[SaraM]

random question... dont see many of the ladies doing 2 tripple tripples in a fs anymore??

 

[dhjh811]

Wow, really? Actually, neither Satoko, Radionova, or Tukt skated better than either Gracie, Ashley or Polina in the free program. Satoko had one major error. Radionova had a series of errors and poor form, and Tukt had several minor mistakes. Obviously, Tukt knew she had the cushion from the sp, and decided to play it safe. All of the final skaters were nervous about the fact that all 3 U.S. ladies had skated very well and Gracie and Ashley had been given fairly high scores, although they both deserved a bit higher on both TES and PCS. The U.S. ladies' scores were clearly held down a bit and most will say because they skated early, but it's also due to politics and perception. Ashley did have a couple of minor miscues (slight double-footed landing on one combo), but clearly Ashley deserved much higher PCS than she received, and Satoko, Radionova and Tukt received higher PCS than they deserved, especially Tukt. My goodness, just because Tukt is landing a 3-axel and she's Russian that means she deserves high PCS out the wazoo.

I love Satoko, but she is not at a point where she deserved a silver medal at Worlds. Both Gracie and Ashley are right now overall better skaters. Satoko has tremendous potential, but she needs to refine her technique and work more on getting better height on her jumps. She's a lightning fast rotator, but I question how high her overall score was. If anything, Satoko's score should have been no higher than 189, and Radionova's score for the free skate is just an example of how some skaters can mess up and not be heavily penalized, while others have to continually prove themselves and if they make the slightest mistake their scores drop. And, in the case of Gracie and Ashley, when they skate exceptionally well, their scores are still held down. It's at bottom about politics, and the fact that the U.S. Fed has historically not known how to politically support their skaters. In the current environment, U.S. Fed has little to no clout politically, especially with the fact that skating money and popularity is overseas and television contracts in the U.S. are meaningless.

Another thing: Polina, for whatever reasons was jobbed in the sp. And then with her teammates skating very well in the fp, and Polina skating almost equally as well, the decision was to keep Polina's scores down and examine her with a fine tooth comb. Why didn't they examine Satoko with a fine tooth comb? While Satoko has the potential to become a great skater, neither she, nor Tukt, nor Radionova are so great that they are better than the U.S. ladies. They simply are not. At this point, I'm tired of fans' constant criticisms of U.S. skaters too. U.S. skaters should be unconditionally supported and encouraged. BTW, Polina won 4CC over Satoko and the other Japanese ladies, so now why wasn't she given more cred at Worlds? Polina should have placed higher in both sp and fp. She skated better than Hongo and Kanako who are placed in front of her. Skating very well and coming in as the 4CCs champ, Polina was kept in 7th in both sp and fp and still overall dropped a spot to 8th!? No way. If all the ladies who came after the U.S. ladies had skated their best without significant mistakes, okay, But that's not what happened.

I give my congratulations and great props to the U.S. Ladies for going out there and showing what they are made of!!! Now consistently show just how good you are and make the asinine politics of figure skating work for you!

Tukt is a far better skater than Gracie in terms of almost everything. Ashley's artistry is better though.

 

[SaraM]

LOL. And what did you think of Gracie's score in the SP? That she was scored "just right"?

"The fact remains" that there were some cushion points in there as well, so how are you going to sit there and say that the "U.S. ladies are all better skaters overall than a number of the ladies who were in front of them in the sp" and then acknowledge that "had they not messed up in the sp," that they could have been on the podium and then accuse only the top three of having inflated scores?

It's nice to see that Gracie has finally skated a good long program this season, but in case you're going to sit there and tell me that she hasn't had a nice cushion in every single one of her competitions this season or that it's okay that she had that cushion because she just "so much better," save it. I don't want to hear it.

I can swallow (deserved) criticism of the top three, but from what I can tell, everything you've said in the last three or four posts is a result of sour grapes--not "without rose-colored glasses" like you've claimed. So sit down, have a drink, and enjoy watching the U.S. ladies' free skating performances again.

 

[whatif]

Art&Sport's anti-Russian vitriol is so tiresome and old. Of course Radionova is going places because she is Russian. What other explanation....
Some people still live in 80s.

 

[minze]

random question... dont see many of the ladies doing 2 tripple tripples in a fs anymore??

Ashley, Polina, Elena and Anna had it on their LP is just that I think they missed

 

[minze]

Tukt is a far better skater than Gracie in terms of almost everything. Ashley's artistry is better though.

How all of the sudden Ashley became THE artist?

 

[whatif]

How all of the sudden Ashley became THE artist?

Some people confuse maturity with artistry.

 

[SaraM]

Ashley, Polina, Elena and Anna had it on their LP is just that I think they missed

i thought the 3loop half loop, 3 salchow was a SEQ? dont see anyone doing 3lutz3toe and 3flip3toe in one fs any more... kostner did that in 2003

 

[minze]

Some people confuse maturity with artistry.

Agree.

 

[aftertherain]

How all of the sudden Ashley became THE artist?

I dunno. Maybe if you say it enough times, people start to believe it. In this current crop, I don't think she's THE artist, but I think she's one of the best ones.

 

[3T3T]

On the whole it was a disappointing Ladies competition. Liza T was the deserved winner, clear leader in the short and did enough to win the free. Her performance was not as good as Europeans but enough to win here. For me I would rank Miyahara 3rd of the Japanese ladies, I'm just not a fan of hers.

There is no one to blame for the US position but the US ladies themselves. If Wagner or Gold skated clean shorts they would both be on the podium. I thought both were marked a bit generously in their error strewn short programmes. In the Free they got the job done but it was more about the jumps (which is understandable), I felt the performance quality was slightly lacking.

Disappointing for Rad, it was not her best performance, but if she was sick she done great to get herself on the podium at her first worlds. I enjoyed both Murakami and Hongbo, when both were skating I thought they were going to threaten Rad but they both dropped. I think Hongbo was my favourite performance.

 

[gotoschool]

I am so happy for Satoko, totally unexpected!

At least someone is happy for her.

I am happy for her too. I really liked her freeskate, especially the last minute ending in the multi-directonal spins. She has very graceful movements steps and spins, and nice musicality and skating skills. Hopefully, she is successful in getting a bit more height on her jumps, but what a great finish for her season.

Great come back for Liza this year.

 

[andromache]

I dunno. Maybe if you say it enough times, people start to believe it. In this current crop, I don't think she's THE artist, but I think she's one of the best ones.

None of the current crop has the Michelle Kwan factor of being The Artist, but we shouldn't hold that against Ashley. This season, I found her Moulin Rouge program to be the most compelling. She emotes throughout, and for those four minutes she is embodying the character of Satine. I think the music/choreography is also constructed well to make the "artistry" of the program effective--when the music cuts to "The Show Must Go On" it gives me chills. I also think she connects the best with her music among this season's ladies.

That said, I'd really like to see what Liza could do with a better program. Her programs this season were fun, but there was a little too much arm waving that didn't go with the music. She may have the potential to develop into a more artistic skater given the right material. I think that's what has worked for Ashley this season.

 

[Sabrina]

Both Wagner and Gold had good programs with some UR for one of them. They are wonderful skaters but well known for lacking consistency. Even this time, they made too many mistakes in the short to have real chances for a medal. In a way it is easier to skate when you know you do it mostly for a better placement, not for a certain medal. It is a less pressure and that helps. Russian skaters are amazing. They have now a large group of very talented girls. But they lost the men, and even more weird dance and pairs. But in women they are almost unbeatable. My guessing is their training is more intense... They also make mistakes, but are not considered inconsistent, at least on the short run. What Radionova did in the LP was something just a few can do. She missed the 3Lz3T for whatever reason, did a some steps, spins, another jump, and then came in the same spot and did her 3Lz3T. Wow, and she is so young...she must be quite bright.

 

[Amei]

Elena got bronze at her first senior Worlds :shocked:

Yulia got silver in her first senior Worlds I don't mean to put words in SarahSynchro's mouth - but I think she is talking performance-wise, like how the girls actually skated - Elena got bronze because of her SP and poor Anna had a bad competition. All of the Russian competitors probably breathe a sigh of relief when they see one of the other Russian ladies have rough competitions because of how difficult it is to get on the Worlds/European team.

 

[Art&Sport]

I dunno. Maybe if you say it enough times, people start to believe it. In this current crop, I don't think she's THE artist, but I think she's one of the best ones.

Yeah, exactly. People and media overly touting the Russians as far superior than anyone else does make everyone believe it. Landing 3-axels and 3/3s and coming from Russia obviously does count for a lot. Credit to Tukt for her great comeback which took courage. She's got the jumping down, plus mastering the 3-axel is a big deal, but that doesn't mean her PCS should automatically be so high.

Of all the Russian ladies, I had been drawn to Radionova the most, but in her debut senior season she has just shown how much she needs to slow down, improve her posture and technique, as well as her costuming and music selection. Okay Radio brings fierce desire which is huge, but her PCS are so OTT. As far as Pogo, her weaknesses were always evident, but got lost in all the over-hype. Truly a shame that Alena Leonova could not make it out of Russian Nationals instead.

Anyways whatever. The sport is what it is, and the results are what they are. Again politics plays a huge role in this sport, and politics are always a factor that make the difference when the performances and levels of abilities are close.

I'm glad the U.S. ladies were able to go out there with their backs against the wall and deliver when few observers believed they would. I hope that Gracie and Ashley placing second and third in fp will be the wake-up call they need to walk softly and carry a big stick. Give no excuses and take no prisoners. U.S. ladies are highly talented and they need to add that extra fire, determination and belief and tune out the naysayer fans and negative media.

The skaters can't afford to overly concern themselves with politics either. They just need to keep their mojos fueled. However, fans should realize whether they want to or not that politics exists in this sport no matter which skaters you enjoy watching, and no matter what you think about the results.

@Sabrina, I seriously doubt it is less pressure to go out and skate after skating poorly in the sp. It is all about how you are able to handle it. That was some serious pressure and the U.S. ladies answered it, and in the process they put pressure on everyone who skated after them.

Of course maturity is not artistry, but maturity can help skaters gain a better sense of their identity on the ice. And that process can thus help them develop better presentation skills. That is if they work hard at it and pay attention to finding good choreography, music and costumes.