2014 Olympics Free Dance

[Alba]

It really looks like Russian Federation loves some of their athletes more then other no matter how their results look like.

This is common for all federations that have more than just one couple, single skater etc., available and competitive. Nothing strange with that.
However, I was surprised not to see Adelina in the team event. I think she should've been there.

 

[Alba]

BTW, I feel that B&S were treated shamefully by their Fed, and the whole thing is reminiscent of the screwing around done with Khoklova and Noviski in 2010

Why do you think that? They won the Russian nationals, and partecipated in the team event.
My impression is that their Fed always thought that I&K was the future, but B&S the real contenders for the bronze in Sochi.

 

[sisinka]

It could also be that Adelina has struggled with her nerves and consistency for the last two years. This format would not be good for her. They didn't want to chance the judges seeing a bad skate. Added bonus maybe she skates better in this psychological state.

Adelina struggles with nerves all the time, but she skates great short programs whole season. It would be more logic to let her skate at Team Event.

Julia is young but more importantly that girl has nerves of steel.

Unfortunately those nerves of steel didn’t help her in Individual Event. We will never know if she would skate clean without skating both programs in Team Event and she has many years to get another medals and achievements.
I am more curious what is playing the main role in Russian Federation decisions? A placement? No. If they would like to get better placement they would make a replacement in Ladies Team Event, which wouldn’t lead to such tiredness for Lipnitskaya and still one more skate for 2 minutes and 40 seconds wouldn’t hurt Adelina so much.

Both of I/K's programs have scored consistently better than both of B/S's programs this season and both have had a couple costly falls. B/S are returning to an old free dance that is good but for which they have not scored over 100 points, they've only had a month and a half to prepare or thereabouts. They are playing with dynamite. Whom do they support? B/S's last best showing of their old free dance was EC 2013. I/K had a stellar showing at TEB in 2013. They had an unfortunate fall that cost them the gold at EC 2014. This is B/S' second Olympic games I/K's first. Maybe they think B/S should be able to deal with the pressure. I/K's only chance to get in the judges favour is to skate well and super clean, otherwise all hopes of a medal are gone. B/S's FD has scored less than C/L, W/P,I/K, and P/B this season. Pressure a little bit?

The RUS FED rolled the dice and the gamble paid off. B/S had apparently too many mistakes in both the F/D and the S/D. They had no-one to blame but themselves. If V/M are not going to worlds what is to stop B/S from making the podium? If they skate great can't they podium just the way they did at last years worlds?

Bobrova & Soloviev lost levels in twizzles in both dances, which was right. They get other levels which they usually get while other couples got better levels than they usually get. In short dance B&S lost two points in levels, but another more then one point for GOE and component marks (which is surprising that I&K could win components over top 7 couples with such attributes like choreo, timing, transitions). But in free dance the main distance was made by GOE and component marks. While B&S lost 2,5 points in levels to I&K and P&B, and only 1 point in levels to W&P, they lost another 3,14 points in GOE to I&K, but only 0,16 in GOE to P&B, and component mark for B&S meant another loss of 1,85 points to I&K (once again – with such components like choreo, timing, transitions?). And while B&S lost levels in twizzles, which was fair thanks to mistake they made in it…but Lena and Nikita didn’t loose a level or GOE while Nikita was doing a piruette during twizzles (looking at Handbook a level should go down)…even P&B with clean and superb skate didn’t get over I&K. So, in my opinion this result talks more about judges decision to put I&K on third place then about B&S or P&B loosing levels.

 

[sisinka]

Bobrova/Soloviev got better results than Pechalat/Bourzat (CoC and GPF), Capellini/Lanotte (GPF) in short dance but Ilinykh/Katsalapov got better results than Pechalat/Bourzat (TEB) and Capellini/Lanotte (Europeans-they didn't but clearly without a fall they are going to) in free dance. Why this selection is bad?

This selection is quite logic if we would take into account Dance Event only, but this selection in dance caused that a possible Gold Medal contender Lipnitskaya had to skate four programs and got tired and lost an Individual Medal (Lipnitskaya’s falls were the third biggest surprise and sensation after Denis Ten’s Bronze Medal and I&K's Bronze Medal Win).
While Tutberidze noticed that such situation with Lipnitskaya skating four programs happened because Russian Federation wanted I&K to relax more before an Individual Event.

 

[elif]

This selection is quite logic if we would take into account Dance Event only, but this selection in dance caused that a possible Gold Medal contender Lipnitskaya had to skate four programs and got tired and lost an Individual Medal (Lipnitskaya’s falls were the third biggest surprise and sensation after Denis Ten’s Bronze Medal and I&K's Bronze Medal Win).
While Tutberidze noticed that such situation with Lipnitskaya skating four programs happened because Russian Federation wanted I&K to relax more before an Individual Event.

Russian Federetion probaby just didn't want to embarrass themselfs with Bobrova/Soloviev's free dance attempt.

 

[Alba]

While Tutberidze noticed that such situation with Lipnitskaya skating four programs happened because Russian Federation wanted I&K to relax more before an Individual Event.

I don't understand what I&K got to do with Yulia in skating both team events honestly. Sotnikova should've skated the SP, and she wanted so much and was bitter about the decision. I don't understand why pointing the figure to the Ice Dance choices.
Anyway, I don't think Yulia was tired and didn't skate well because of the team event. The pressure and the hype by the Russian press (International as well) was wild and this was too much for her. It's true that she has nerves of steel for a girl in her age, but still she's too young and this was her first international season.
Tara Lipinski won in Nagano at the same age but there are some big differences in terms of pressure and experience:
a) She won the World title and GPF the previous year.
b) She was skating in Japan and not in her home country
c) Kwan was the no.1 fav. to win that year.

Russian federation and her coach failed to isolate her from the crowd, the hype and the press. In other words to "protect" her.
In the end she couldn't handle all this, that's natural.
A 5th place in your first Olympics at age 15 it's a very good placement, and the disappointement of the press and the complains of her coach now tells a lot about the pressure that was put on Yulia.
I would suggest her coach that instead of trying to find justification of why she lost (lost what?), she should try and praise Yulia for her performance and placement.

 

[sisinka]

I don't understand what I&K got to do with Yulia in skating both team events honestly. Sotnikova should've skated the SP, and she wanted so much and was bitter about the decision. I don't understand why pointing the figure to the Ice Dance choices.
Anyway, I don't think Yulia was tired and didn't skate well because of the team event. The pressure and the hype by the Russian press (International as well) was wild and this was too much for her. It's true that she has nerves of steel for a girl in her age, but still she's too young and this was her first international season.
Tara Lipinski won in Nagano at the same age but there are some big differences in terms of pressure and experience:
a) She won the World title and GPF the previous year.
b) She was skating in Japan and not in her home country
c) Kwan was the no.1 fav. to win that year.

Russian federation and her coach failed to isolate her from the crowd, the hype and the press. In other words to "protect" her.
In the end she couldn't handle all this, that's natural.
A 5th place in your first Olympics at age 15 it's a very good placement, and the disappointement of the press and the complains of her coach now tells a lot about the pressure that was put on Yulia.
I would suggest her coach that instead of trying to find justification of why she lost (lost what?), she should try and praise Yulia for her performance and placement.

From the beginning it was obvious that the second replacement in Team Event can be in Ladies or Dance cathegory. The Russian Federation prefered to help I&K to be more relax than Lipnitskaya. It was Russian Federation‘s choice if they will help ladies to be less tired or if they will help dancers to be less tired. Federation chose dance teams - I&K, but we know that dancers were fighting for Bronze Medal, only a miracle and a very very unfair judging could help them to earn Silver Medal. While situation in Ladies cathegory was quite different, both Sotnikova and Lipnitskaya were one of those who could fight for any medal, and with mistakes from other competitors, they could fight for gold (this can’t be said about Ice Dance cathegory).

Yes, Julia got a massage from media but she was tired and it played a role. She told later that already in short program before flip jump, she didn’t feel her legs, which is a symptom of tiredness, not media pressure. The same was in free skate. She was the only lady from all medal contenders who skated two programs in Team Event, while others skated none or one program only. This is Julia’s second season at international senior level, last season she finished second and third at Grand Prix, this season she won two Grand Prix, finished second at Grand Prix Final and won European Championships. Such results are far to tell she is an unexperienced skater. It was Lipnitskaya‘s first Olympics (but the same for Sotnikova, Stolbova & Klimov, Ilinykh & Katsalapov, Sinitsina & Zhiganshin, Volosozhar & Trankov – like Russian couple together). Once again, nobody knows how she would skate without participating in two programs in Team Event, maybe she would do some minor mistake. I seriously doubt that Russian Federation didn’t expect what can possibly happen if a single skater gets tired and still has to jump many triples. But with or without any doubt they decided like that. Why?

Tutberidze didn’t punish anybody. She said that the choice was good finally, because Russian Federation got what they planned. They wanted Gold Medal in Teams, they got it. They also got two medals in Pairs. They wanted Bronze in Dance and they got it. And Adelina became an Olympic Champion. Tutberidze didn’t complain. But other people complains, why was Lipnitskaya sacrificed for changement in Dance cathegory.

There is one more thing which was not discussed. Julia is in very similat position like Lipinski and Hughes were at their Olympics. She still has child body, which means that her jumps are easily done even with some technical mistakes. Nobody knows if she will be able to jump triples with grown-up body (for example with Kostner’s body building). Maybe four years later she will fight with her jumps like Tukhtamysheva does last two years. It is great for SENIOR figure skating to have senior looking and senior skating ladies (at least at second and third position, if I count Adelina to still be a teenage girl more then adult one). In Ice Dance cathegory girls are growing up also, but it usually doesn’t mean that they loose their qualities like skaters/dancers. Lena and Nikita will be 23 and 26, Sinitsina & Zhiganshin will be 22 and 25 years old in 2018 Olympics, I am sure that their skating will be better in 2018 than it is today with another four years of training. But girl like Lipnitskaya, Radionova, Proklova, also Edmunds, who knows if they will jump triples with grown-up body? How much different is jumping with child body and grown-up body – so many girls know this – Flatt, Nagasu, Zhang, Meissner, Shelepen, Korobeinikova, Gedevanishvili – they all easily jumped triple-triple combinations with child or teenage body, and today?
Russian Federation didn’t notice that it is probably the only chance at same Olympics for Lipnitskaya to easily execute all difficult jumps while she still benefits from child body? But they choose ice dancers for replacement, those ice dancers who can be only better at next Olympics.

Try to imagine….2018 Olympics, the same situation in Ladies and Dance in Team Event. But this time try to imagine that the main contenders for Gold in Ice Dance are Ilinykh & Katsalapov, while Sinitsina & Zhiganshin are slightly behind them in result‘s page through last two years. But this time Russian Federation choose Ladies for replacement and I&K have to skate two programs in Team Event and two programs in Individual Event, while S&Z are resting and preparing for Individual Event. Dancers are not so tired like single skaters usually, it would be no catastrophe but let’s imagine that during Individual Event I&K loose some levels, while S&Z would outskated them and finally take a medal. Thanks to judges in Ice Dance cathegory I&K would be kept at the podium but not with Gold Medal, maybe Bronze Medal behind S&Z and W&P (in any order). What would you think…that I&K were so much in stress that they coudn’t handle the pressure…or you would think that they got tired, because they lost energy in Team Event and now they had less energy for Individual Event.

Situation with only two replacements in Team Event will never be absolutely fair for every skater, unfortunately. I am only surprised that Russian Federation is not working for the best possible placements in every competition in every cathegory, while I feel that this is a part of their work as well.

 

[sisinka]

Just wondering, did that anything include a trip to L'Equipe? #idlespeculation

And the article said nothing about the ladies, which is the only discipline where I noticed any really debatable stuff. No one at all is questioning the order of the medals in the team event. The Question in pairs is whether Pang and Tong deserved the bronze. Frankly, I feel there is no reason at all to believe that the Russian coach would tell L'Equipe the whole truth about things, since it would likely call into question his/her own students' results. My guess is still that the coach is Morozov.

Yes, Morozov is one of those who knows how to intrigue so well.
In the beginning I was voting for him, but I denied later…he is not doing things which are going to help him. And this situation didn’t help him…in the first look…

I was asking myself whether this article changed anything. No. All people noticed in the article won their competition, but it was already expected before Olympics – Volosozhar & Trankov and Davis & White were last World Champions, they won Grand Prix or Grand Prix Final or European Championships this season, they were the main contenders for Gold Medals for sure. Team Russia had strong athletes in all disciplines, they were the biggest contenders for Gold Medal as well. And even with such provocative article with announced results…nothing changed. So why that Russian coach told it when nothing had changed?

How about asking in opposite way? Who got hurt with this article? Davis & White or Russian pair couple? No. They were reigning World Champions. Judges? No. Nothing happened to them…

Try to imagine…. being on judges‘ and official‘s places… what would you thing about a person – Russian coach who would say that you intrigue…more exactly what would you think about a Russian coach who you suppose to say it... Probably you would be angry on him/her, no? And if you judged him/her students, what would you tend to do?
Who were the ones from Russian coaches who really lost althought it was expected that their students would get a medal…Zhulin with B&S…and Sphilband with P&B. And who is supposed to be a Russian coach with some French connections? Zhulin who trained French team a few years ago. Morozov who was married to a French. Sphilband who is training a French Team now. But Morozov didn’t loose anything because his team surprisingly got superb marks and finish six points above who?...Sphilband’s P&B…and almost eleven points above who?…Zhulin’s B&S. No, judges didn’t think that it was Morozov who told all this things about collaboration …and it sounds quite logic…he is a choreographer of Volosozhar & Trankov, so why he would like to hurt them, and he says every time that he is a big patriot because he helps Russian team and he came back to Russia to train there. No, judges didn’t think that that person was Morozov. And as well that “mystic“ Russian coach didn’t expect that judges would come to Morozov, probably.

So, we are looking for somebody who doesn’t like Zhulin or Sphilband. Yes, despite the fact that judges didn’t think it was Morozov, it could be Morozov talking to French interviewer about collaboration, because that information could probably help him to get better placement for I&K (with judges to be angry at Sphilband or Zhulin).
But there is another coach who is connected with a problematic relationships with one of those two coaches (Zhulin, Sphilband)…Zueva versus Sphilband. After they split Zueva had World and Silver Medalists, she was more successfull than Sphilband. He didn’t have medals from World Championships coaching alone, but here he could get a medal, a Bronze Medal only, but still any medal. Pechalat & Bourzat skated a programs of their life but thanks to judges GOE and component marks they lost Bronze Medal. Maybe judges think that that Russian coach is Sphilband and they wanted to show him that such articles and informations are not allowed any more. If it was Zueva who talked to a French interviewer because of making Sphilband looking bad in judge’s eyes…she would loose nothing making such attempt…she is not interested in pairs cathegory, she is not training anyone there, and Davis & White were winning every competition last two years, the article didn’t hurt them anyway, Virtue & Moir’s no Gold Medal situation was prepared as well during last two seasons while they lost every competition to Davis.
Another Russian coach who may not like Sphilband or Zhulin could be Platov, but he would gain nothing from this situation, his couple finished far from the podium. The same situation with Rostislav Sinitsin.

So, finally my personal choice stays between Morozov or Zueva…

 

[sisinka]

Really interesting, sisinka, particularly the motivation/ desperation for Morozov to medal with I&K and that he would do anything

Morozov sometimes runs over the board with some comments…
There were rumours that Nikita tries to skate with Khokhlova (I heard it was after 2010/11 season), just a try out, but Morozov was very strict about it, this is a part of interview from April 2012.
http://news.sportbox.ru/Vidy_sporta...orozov-Kacalapov-s-Hohlovoy-Puskay-staraya-zh
Morozov: “I heard that people want Nikita to skate with Khokhlova. Let’s allow an old woman to try it. She was never the best figure skater. It is not possible to compare Jana with Lena Ilinykh, who looks like a star on ice….The fact that Lena Ilinykh will become a World Champion – it is obvious.“

I don’t agree with Morozov, I doubt that people from Russian Federation would pair a team with woman 6 year older than Nikita is. But it doesn’t mean that Jana is old, Nikita was 19 or 20 years old that time, he was too young for her. But no matter how Jana’s results looked like, she was a very expressive and a great dancers with fantastic lifts and she was able to improve her skating skills throught years. Yes, she was not the best dancer in those times, Domnina was better, but those were times where dancing was important, not just performing elements and many couples had great qualities. Morozov shouldn’t try to shoot all other people in attempt to help Lena and Nikita rise (the same for Russian Federation).

By the way Khokhlova was something like a main coach for Russian Ice dancers in 2011/12 and 2012/13 season, I don’t know whether she is still. This position means that she had to travell from one ice ring to another and control and help dancers with programs, lifts, with everything what was needed.

 

[sisinka]

Morozov sometimes runs over the board with some comments…
There were rumours that Nikita tries to skate with Khokhlova (I heard it was after 2010/11 season), just a try out, but Morozov was very strict about it, this is a part of interview from April 2012.
http://news.sportbox.ru/Vidy_sporta...orozov-Kacalapov-s-Hohlovoy-Puskay-staraya-zh
Morozov: “I heard that people want Nikita to skate with Khokhlova. Let’s allow an old woman to try it. She was never the best figure skater. It is not possible to compare Jana with Lena Ilinykh, who looks like a star on ice….The fact that Lena Ilinykh will become a World Champion – it is obvious.“

Some videos of Khokhlova's qualities from shows in 2012 (with Tikhonov and Shabalin) to compare with silly Morozov's words.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3pcsECM_4Nc
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=b7jNmmHsMt4
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FGzMLbfbd3o

 

[elif]

Oh yes, french media helped Morozov so he can take a bronze, which also Pechalat/Bourzat wants Just imagine Morozov and L'Equipe reporter, Morozov: ''We fixed pairs and ice dance golds and I want whole world to know this, this way we can get ice dance bronze too''

 

[sisinka]

Oh yes, french media helped Morozov so he can take a bronze, which also Pechalat/Bourzat wants Just imagine Morozov and L'Equipe reporter, Morozov: ''We fixed pairs and ice dance golds and I want whole world to know this, this way we can get ice dance bronze too''

Do you really think that an anonymous Russian coach would open his mind and said why he/she is saying such things? Come on. If we would handle somebody with such low inteligency... than people wouldn't discuss it here for so long.

By the way all journalists start to be popular with their no knowledge about figure skating...they are changing names, for the last time I heard that Yagudin was Alexander and Trankov was Oleg. How do you expect from any journalist to know what comes across mind of some coach who spend many and many years in this sport and who knows all circumstances.

By the way all chaos with this articles started already BEFORE the competition. But as I know in other cases of unfair judging, articles and people complaining about things start AFTER the competition.
It supports the idea that it was really calculated to change some results but obviously not the results of skaters mentioned in the article.

 

[elif]

Do you really think that an anonymous Russian coach would open his mind and said why he/she is saying such things? Come on. If we would handle somebody with such low inteligency... than people wouldn't discuss it here for so long.

By the way all journalists start to be popular with their no knowledge about figure skating...they are changing names, for the last time I heard that Yagudin was Alexander and Trankov was Oleg. How do you expect from any journalist to know what comes across mind of some coach who spend many and many years in this sport and who knows all circumstances.

By the way all chaos with this articles started already BEFORE the competition. But as I know in other cases of unfair judging, articles and people complaining about things start AFTER the competition.
It supports the idea that it was really calculated to change some results but obviously not the results of skaters mentioned in the article.

Sorry but If there is a fix why a russian national team coach (not just a russian coach) want to say this thing to whole world? Why? For a mere bronze? Especially Morozov, who I believe doing programs for Volosozhar/Trankov so this scandal going to hurt their olympic gold medal too. You know this L'Equipe could be a big big scandal but except Canadians, nobody really interested or believed. What If this scandal become like 2002? Do you really think Russian Federation going to risk it, in their home olympics? I don't think there is a fix considering how strong D/W and V/T are but If you are really believing there is why russian federation coaches want to say that to everyone, I will never understand.

I don't even like Morozov, I don't want to see Ilinykh/Katsalapov with him. Yes this article writed before the competition but this is first time I'm reading they did it because they want to ice dance bronze. So this is one of the ''AFTER the competition'' articles as you say.

 

[dorispulaski]

Do you really think that an anonymous Russian coach would open his mind and said why he/she is saying such things? Come on. If we would handle somebody with such low inteligency... than people wouldn't discuss it here for so long.

By the way all journalists start to be popular with their no knowledge about figure skating...they are changing names, for the last time I heard that Yagudin was Alexander and Trankov was Oleg. How do you expect from any journalist to know what comes across mind of some coach who spend many and many years in this sport and who knows all circumstances.

By the way all chaos with this articles started already BEFORE the competition. But as I know in other cases of unfair judging, articles and people complaining about things start AFTER the competition.
It supports the idea that it was really calculated to change some results but obviously not the results of skaters mentioned in the article.

The journalist never told and probably never knew what exactly the coach's motivation was. The journalist had covered skating for about 20 years.

I think there are only 2 facts in the article.

1. The coach was important enough a coach that the journalist recognised him or her, and was indeed a Russian coach.

2. The coach told the journalist a bunch of stuff before the Olympics.

The coach was a rat. If the coach were a hero, he/she would have gone to the ISU. If he/she were an ordinary person who feared retribution but wished to right a wrong, he would have named names as to what officials were involved in the fixing. Instead, he/she cast shade on the skaters' medals and placing in 3 separate events that do not appear to have been fixed. He/she almost surely is or has been paid to train some of those skaters.

He smeared the Russian, American, Italian, and French federations in the process.

I wonder whether the outcome was what he desired.

 

[sisinka]

I think there are only 2 facts in the article.

1. The coach was important enough a coach that the journalist recognised him or her, and was indeed a Russian coach.

2. The coach told the journalist a bunch of stuff before the Olympics.

The coach was a rat. If the coach were a hero, he/she would have gone to the ISU. If he/she were an ordinary person who feared retribution but wished to right a wrong, he would have named names as to what officials were involved in the fixing. Instead, he/she cast shade on the skaters' medals and placing in 3 separate events that do not appear to have been fixed. He/she almost surely is or has been paid to train some of those skaters.

:thumbsup::thumbsup::thumbsup:

 

[sisinka]

Sorry but If there is a fix why a russian national team coach (not just a russian coach) want to say this thing to whole world? Why? For a mere bronze? Especially Morozov, who I believe doing programs for Volosozhar/Trankov so this scandal going to hurt their olympic gold medal too. You know this L'Equipe could be a big big scandal but except Canadians, nobody really interested or believed. What If this scandal become like 2002? Do you really think Russian Federation going to risk it, in their home olympics? I don't think there is a fix considering how strong D/W and V/T are but If you are really believing there is why russian federation coaches want to say that to everyone, I will never understand.

It means that we would have Gold Medalists – Volosozhar & Trankov and Stolbova & Klimov, Davis & White and Virtue & Moir? Interesting idea.

No words about Russian Federation, they didn’t agree with it, I am sure they were angry because of this article. Morozov was always working for himself on the first place, not for Russian Federation, no matter how much paid he was (he trained so many foreign skaters - Takahashi, Amodio, Cappellini & Lanotte – not with happy faces of people from Russian Federation). Btw Cappellini took Gold Medal from Ilinykh at this year European Championships, Takahashi was beating Russian men constantly, Amodio won European Champinships in 2011 and got Bronze medal next year and Silver Medal in 2013 (Kovtun was 5th there). Morozov can be hardly call a Pro-Russian coach only. But I never said that it surely WAS Morozov, he was one of my two possibilities – which is a speculation only.

I don't even like Morozov, I don't want to see Ilinykh/Katsalapov with him. Yes this article writed before the competition but this is first time I'm reading they did it because they want to ice dance bronze. So this is one of the ''AFTER the competition'' articles as you say.

Connection with Ice Dance cathegory comes easily into one’s head, because that is the cathegory where falls and missed elements are not so usual. You can understand that a pair couple looses a victory with program including three falls (Savchenko & Szolkovy lost Silver Medal because of two falls in elements), the Team competition includes Pairs and single cathegories where a falls may change a results dramatically (Mao Asada jumped to 16th place after short program and jumped back to 6th place after free skate in Individual Event – who could predict it?). Ice Dance skaters are making less mistakes and falling less so even with clean skate, not everybody will go for medal. With possibly ten dance couples skating clean programs – who will judges choose for a podium? The ones who were medalling at Grand Prix Final? Reigning World Medalists? The best level skaters? The most supported skaters? Or surprisingly those who were the best overall? It is much more about personal preferences of judges, more than in any other cathegory.

I am reading interesting things at Golden Skate Forum…but there is not even 10 percents of similarity with “behind the scene“ talks during competitions. And judges are at those “behind the scenes“ atmosphere. Things which are not discussed here…those things are discussed there…and judges live in it and they can be easily influenced by it.

I remember that one of ice dance judge persisted in comments towards Faiella & Scali and Khoklova & Novitski, one year that judge was saying that Faiella and Khoklova are great and partners are not on their level, second year the same judge was swearing that Scali and Novitski are so great but they are poor boys of having not so good woman partners and third year that judge came back to previous talks about Khoklova being better then Novitski. The same judge was singing of happiness about Coomes & Buckland that they have so deep edges because it is a British school of Torvill & Dean. If you watch C&B edges, you will see no angle, because they have no deep edges and almost no edges overall. Such experts are hidden on judges places. Those are nice examples how are judges influenced by “behind the scene“ talks when Platov and British Federation are propagating their couple.

 

[Matt K]

I remember that one of ice dance judge persisted in comments towards Faiella & Scali and Khoklova & Novitski, one year that judge was saying that Faiella and Khoklova are great and partners are not on their level, second year the same judge was swearing that Scali and Novitski are so great but they are poor boys of having not so good woman partners and third year that judge came back to previous talks about Khoklova being better then Novitski. The same judge was singing of happiness about Coomes & Buckland that they have so deep edges because it is a British school of Torvill & Dean. If you watch C&B edges, you will see no angle, because they have no deep edges and almost no edges overall. Such experts are hidden on judges places. Those are nice examples how are judges influenced by “behind the scene“ talks when Platov and British Federation are propagating their couple.

What a silly, silly judge! Some of these ice dance judges should be sanctioned. What idiocy! It does not surprise me that some of these inane judges still sit on the panel.

I'm disappointed with Platov's approach with C/B, how the "choreography" is done to have them do as little skating as possible. Since C/B have no edges, Platov is hiding this with his choreography. Their SD is especially atrocious, and the marks ridiculous. In an article, Platov said they are very "Russian" skaters with a British style (since when does Torvill/Dean and Russian skaters have no edges and non skating choreography?) I don't take what Platov says seriously.

At least Pushkash/Guerreiro, who don't have great edges either, are doing more skating with edges, which has improved a bit. This is probably why they aren't rising up the ranks as fast. When they were with Linichuk, she drilled them on their skating skills all the time, and the choreography showed it, not hid it.

 

[BlackPack]

It means that we would have Gold Medalists – Volosozhar & Trankov and Stolbova & Klimov, Davis & White and Virtue & Moir? Interesting idea.

No words about Russian Federation, they didn’t agree with it, I am sure they were angry because of this article. Morozov was always working for himself on the first place, not for Russian Federation, no matter how much paid he was (he trained so many foreign skaters - Takahashi, Amodio, Cappellini & Lanotte – not with happy faces of people from Russian Federation). Btw Cappellini took Gold Medal from Ilinykh at this year European Championships, Takahashi was beating Russian men constantly, Amodio won European Champinships in 2011 and got Bronze medal next year and Silver Medal in 2013 (Kovtun was 5th there). Morozov can be hardly call a Pro-Russian coach only. But I never said that it surely WAS Morozov, he was one of my two possibilities – which is a speculation only.



Connection with Ice Dance cathegory comes easily into one’s head, because that is the cathegory where falls and missed elements are not so usual. You can understand that a pair couple looses a victory with program including three falls (Savchenko & Szolkovy lost Silver Medal because of two falls in elements), the Team competition includes Pairs and single cathegories where a falls may change a results dramatically (Mao Asada jumped to 16th place after short program and jumped back to 6th place after free skate in Individual Event – who could predict it?). Ice Dance skaters are making less mistakes and falling less so even with clean skate, not everybody will go for medal. With possibly ten dance couples skating clean programs – who will judges choose for a podium? The ones who were medalling at Grand Prix Final? Reigning World Medalists? The best level skaters? The most supported skaters? Or surprisingly those who were the best overall? It is much more about personal preferences of judges, more than in any other cathegory.

I am reading interesting things at Golden Skate Forum…but there is not even 10 percents of similarity with “behind the scene“ talks during competitions. And judges are at those “behind the scenes“ atmosphere. Things which are not discussed here…those things are discussed there…and judges live in it and they can be easily influenced by it.

I remember that one of ice dance judge persisted in comments towards Faiella & Scali and Khoklova & Novitski, one year that judge was saying that Faiella and Khoklova are great and partners are not on their level, second year the same judge was swearing that Scali and Novitski are so great but they are poor boys of having not so good woman partners and third year that judge came back to previous talks about Khoklova being better then Novitski. The same judge was singing of happiness about Coomes & Buckland that they have so deep edges because it is a British school of Torvill & Dean. If you watch C&B edges, you will see no angle, because they have no deep edges and almost no edges overall. Such experts are hidden on judges places. Those are nice examples how are judges influenced by “behind the scene“ talks when Platov and British Federation are propagating their couple.

That is ridiculous. Some judges aren't educated, not particularly adept at logic and objective observation. Some of them just go with their gut and emotions. When challenged to defend their decisions, they whip out any old feeble excuse without much regard for reality.

C&B are one of the weakest teams around whose only commonality with T&D is their nationality.

 

[Alba]

From the beginning it was obvious that the second replacement in Team Event can be in Ladies or Dance cathegory.

What I don't understand it's why this was obvious. I mean this could've been done with the ladies as well no? They could've choosen Sotnikova for the short, just as they did for the pairs and the ice dance.

Yes, Julia got a massage from media but she was tired and it played a role. She told later that already in short program before flip jump, she didn’t feel her legs, which is a symptom of tiredness, not media pressure.

Well yes, but this could happen because of nerves/pressure as well. Anyway, the pairs did their Tem event comp. and had less days off available to rest.
Yulia has time, and if she could not handle her development I would be really sorry because I like her very much, but she has to go through all this just like the other skaters had.

About l'Equipe: I think it was just a gossip, a sensational article on the judges. Basically saying that D&W would win, something that a lot of people new since they were no.1 fav. and unbeatable during the whole the year, and why not put doubts on the judges about the russians since they were the direct rivals of the french couple for the bronze.

About Elena&Nikita: I have to agree with Morozov. They are a perfect match. Khokhlova's age in figure skating is considered old usully, Kostner it's the same. I don't think it was meant as an offense, althoug I don't know Morozov.

 

[Alba]

Btw Cappellini took Gold Medal from Ilinykh at this year European Championships,

Well, if not for the fall on the twizzels I&K would've won the European title this year.

Takahashi was beating Russian men constantly, Amodio won European Champinships in 2011 and got Bronze medal next year and Silver Medal in 2013 (Kovtun was 5th there). Morozov can be hardly call a Pro-Russian coach only

Hardly Morozov fault. A coach should be pro their skaters, whether they are russian, french, USA etc.