2016-17 State of Canadian Ladies Skating

[Skatergal101]

Yes, but people complain about Osmond always doing a tango program, when it's actually Gabby

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Didn't she skate to Vivaldi's Four Season in the 2014-15 season? Her SP last season is a jazz piece by the way.

Yes but people always complain about osmond doing a tango, when its actually Gabby

 

[Skatergal101]

Just my opinion, everyone is entitled to their own

 

[Blades of Passion]

I shudder to think Bausback and Tamura are being guided by Joanne McLeod. McLeod previously "guided" Mira Leung to no avail.

Mira Leung was underrated and should have won 2007 Canadian Nationals. Biased judging against her when she delivered the technical goods and Rochette was making mistakes all over the place. Mira's program to Terracotta Warriors in 2006 was a total gem, one of the most unsung programs ever I'd say. She also did a very nice Pink Panther and Transylvanian Lullaby (which Lori Nichol then recycled and gave to Carolina Kostner, but Leung actually got the music better...too bad she wasn't able to compete that program more). I also liked Leung's 2006 Olympic SP a lot and would like to get more info about that music; on Wikipedia it just says "Freedom" and doesn't list a composer.

 

[chuckm]

Mira's head-down posture into jumps was horrible---it resulted from her mother's demands that she wear a helmet when training in her early years. Perhaps that was part of the reason why she got low PCS scores, from the high 4s to mid 5s.

Here were her Olympic 2006 performances, which were some of her better ones:

SP: 14 Mira LEUNG CAN 50.61 29.38 21.23 5.39 5.14 5.32 5.36 5.32 0.00 7 3f, 3z+2lo, 2a

She got -GOE on the 2a and on two combination spins, and her footwork got L2.

FS: 12 Mira LEUNG CAN 94.55 51.83 42.72 5.50 5.11 5.36 5.36 5.36 0.00 3f, 3z, 2s, 3t+2t, 1a, 3z+2lo, 3f+2lo+2lo

All of her jump elements from the 3t+2t on got -GOE. Her footwork got L2.


No matter HOW many mistakes Rochette may have made at Nationals, the quality of her elements was far above Mira's. Except for her layback, Mira was getting -GOE on her combo spins and low levels on her footwork, and her posture was bad. Joannie knew how to sell her programs, while Mira just soldiered her way through hers.

 

[withwings]

Unfortunately, we cannot change anything in the past...though I am more than sure, that even a bad experience may bring some good fruit in the future. And I am sure that Mira is successful now in whatever she is doing now. Keep going Mira Leung!

Somehow my heart is in pain about Kaetlyn... She has to be able finally to skate at least half of her potential... I wish some changes in her coaching team or whatsoever. Also, judges have been very careful to give her deserved PCS, she is always underscored in my opinion. Even cold skate of Gracie Gold is scored higher than Kaetlyn's skate from and with heart/soul.Kaetlyn is a real flower, while Gracie, although nice and beautiful, artistry wise is only a paper flower.

Last year Chartrand was a wonderful, wonderful surprise to me. The same Gabby- she has made incredible progress. Anyway- good luck to the Canadian Trio!

 

[Blades of Passion]

No matter HOW many mistakes Rochette may have made at Nationals, the quality of her elements was far above Mira's.

Most of Mira's spins were better than Rochette's, her positions were WAY more difficult. Rochette had better jump technique but when you're botching the jumps, that doesn't help much.

Pointing to her marks at the Olympics doesn't say anything. The scores were super low in general back then and Mira basically went into the Olympics as a "nobody". She was underscored there by a lot, in my opinion. Throughout her career Mira was unfairly treated as a pariah because of various factors.

Joannie knew how to sell her programs, while Mira just soldiered her way through hers.

Mira didn't just "soldier her way through", she had excellent musicality and enthusiasm and attention to detail in many of her performances. Nor did Joannie always sell her programs either; she was often times overwhelmed by pressure. 2007 Nationals wasn't good for her, whereas Mira was technically her best ever at that competition.

Compare their performances:

Mira Leung SP

Mira Leung LP

Joannie Rochette SP

Joannie Rochette LP

 

[Taan]

I also liked Leung's 2006 Olympic SP a lot and would like to get more info about that music; on Wikipedia it just says "Freedom" and doesn't list a composer.

freedom by 12 girls band
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fYpMVtK6uGg&feature=youtu.be

 

[SarahSynchro]

Unfortunately, we cannot change anything in the past...though I am more than sure, that even a bad experience may bring some good fruit in the future. And I am sure that Mira is successful now in whatever she is doing now. Keep going Mira Leung!

The latest update we had on Mira was from two years ago, when she was interning in Sillicon Valley for Google! She was majoring in Software Engineering at UBC. Say what you want about her skating, but she must have a pretty good head on her shoulders for a career like that.

 

[Crossover]

The latest update we had on Mira was from two years ago, when she was interning in Sillicon Valley for Google! She was majoring in Software Engineering at UBC. Say what you want about her skating, but she must have a pretty good brain on her shoulders for a career like that.

Software Engineering, interesting. She can perhaps meet Petri Kokko in a convention or forum who works for Google in the future.

 

[Mango]

The latest update we had on Mira was from two years ago, when she was interning in Sillicon Valley for Google! She was majoring in Software Engineering at UBC. Say what you want about her skating, but she must have a pretty good brain on her shoulders for a career like that.

Good for her! That's great to hear. I love hearing about skaters who've done well for themselves outside of the sport (like Petri Kokko).

Going back to coaching: Is there any way to be sure about a coach's potential? A coach like Orser, who was untested prior to 2007, helped guide Yuna Kim to Olympic gold. Within the year, they had split. Then along came Hanyu who became a super star as well. A decade ago, he was not a coach. Now, he's one of the world's most sought after coaches.

There's another thing I forgot to mention. Junior level skaters (and prospects) do attend national training camps annually. These are separate from the national team's high performance camp. I think if it was noticed that some skaters had awful technique then some solutions and guidance could be offered by other coaches. Brian was one of the coaches attending last year. These camps were not around when Kevin and co. were going through the ranks.

 

[chuckm]

Blades of Passion, if you think Mira was undermarked at the 2006 Olympics, have a look at her marks at SKATE CANADA 2005, where she had pretty much the same technical content, and where she was skating on home ice.

Mira Leung Skate Canada 2005
SP
3F -1.00
3Z+2Lo -0.80
2A -0.42
LSp1 0.00
SpSt2 0.00
FCSp1 -0.30
CiSt1 0.00
CCoSp1 +0.20
8 Mira LEUNG CAN 42.74 24.78 17.96 4.55 4.30 4.70 4.45 4.45 0.00

FS
3F+2Lo 0.00
3Z -1.40
2A -0.42
FCSp1 0.00
3S -1.60
LSp1 0.00
3Z+2Lo (fall) -3.00
3T -0.20
USp2 +0.10
SlSt2 -0.28
SpSt2 +0.40
3F 0.00
CCoSp1 +0.40

8 Mira LEUNG CAN 81.22 47.10 35.12 4.55 4.30 4.40 4.40 4.30 1.00

Mira did not finish last (there were 12 skaters) but she had the lowest PCS scores of all the competitors.

 

[Blades of Passion]

3 big mistakes including a fall, and less jump combos, is hardly "pretty much the same content". Her program on the Grand Prix that year was also totally different than what she used at the Olympics. Quoting the PCS doesn't mean anything, you should look at the performances themselves - Here is Mira's 2006 Olympic LP

I think it's a wonderful, completely unique program and technically it was solid. She did 2 Lutzes and 2 Flips with correct edges on both of them, which is quite rare, even if the overall technique wasn't the best. The gutsy jump combos at the end of the program really stand out and that last combination spin is insanely difficult, she does 5 difficult variations and multiple edge changes.

 

[chuckm]

The "gutsy jump combos" at the end of her program got -GOE, and she got only L3 on her final spin--she got +0.29 on it, which wasn't enough to offset all the -GOE she got for all the jumps in the second half of her program. The base value of her FS was 52.5 and after all the GOE, she wound up with 51.83. Maybe Mira's program looked good to you, but it didn't look that great to the judges.

BTW, one of the judges was Benoit Lavoie, who is known for giving high scores to Canadian skaters. He's probably the judge who gave Mira 6s in PCS, and he didn't give her any -GOE. OTOH, he gave her 1s for 3 spins and 0 for everything else. Even he was not impressed by Mira's free program.

 

[scs]

I thoroughly enjoy the skating of our top 3 ladies but my thoughts on who will be most successful have changed over the past few years. While I agree that Katelyn is very talented and charismatic on the ice, I fear that her injuries over the past few years have impacted her career to the extent that she may not return to the level of international success that she seemed to be on track for prior to the injuries. I do hope I am wrong with this thought as I truly like watching her and find her charming.
I have enjoyed Alaine's skating but have found her to be inconsistent. As mentioned in a previous post, I wonder if having a consistent training location/team would help her. I thought that she had settled with Michelle Leigh coaching her over the past two (?) years, but from other comments here, that may not be so.
As recently as two years ago, I did not care for Gabby's skating. That has changed and I find myself drawn to watch her with my full attention any time I see her skate. I feel that she has developed and matured into our leading female skater. In particular, over the past year, I have been impressed with her attention to the artistic side of her skating. At the moment, I feel that she has the momentum to regain the Canadian title and, hopefully, achieve international success. I was not aware of her medical issues and hope that she is able to work through them and continue to develop as a world class skater.
Although these ladies are not readily mentioned as podium contenders at the world level, I hope that they all continue to develop as I believe that they all possess such talent and bring great joy to the ice. It has been a while since Canada has had three ladies like Alaine, Gabby, and Katelyn to cheer for.

 

[Osmond4gold]

In a word, confused...don't know what to think about my girl this season. Wild Rose was painful to watch...got to get those triples practiced and the timing down in competitions. As I say to my kids, never over promise and under-deliver, and...to be fearless in your attempts, regardless of the outcomes. Was def. cringeworthy to watch.

I was thinking, like some, that perhaps a change in venue/coaches this season, just to get a new perspective and being 2 years out, this might have been the best time to make dramatic changes prior to the Olympics.

Perhaps there is a game plan in place, but I remain confused. I hope to see more of an attack at Thornhill,...maybe...

 

[chuckm]

Kaetlyn just did 3f+3t, 3z(to), 2a in the SP at Thornhill. That was an improvement over the 3f+2t at Wild Rose.

 

[nadster]

The main thing holding Osmond back is not coaching but injuries. She even got injured after Skate Canada last season.

We really need to see her injury free for a couple of seasons before we can properly look at the coaching situation.

A little off topic but speaking of her coach Ravi Walia, I was very impressed by his student Brian Chiem in pre-novice men. He landed 3 triples including a triple loop in the Thornhill free skate.

 

[blue_ice]

Kaetlyn just did 3f+3t, 3z(to), 2a in the SP at Thornhill. That was an improvement over the 3f+2t at Wild Rose.

This is amazing news!:luv17::thumbsup: Go Kaetlyn! Wishing all canadian ladies the best this season.

 

[Blades of Passion]

she got only L3 on her final spin

That has nothing to do with the choreographic impact of it and how objectively difficult it was. Spins levels in the scoring system are about a very specific set of rules. The calls at that point in time were very confused anyway, there wasn't much of a memorandum on how long spin positions needed to be held. Some of the spins from Arakawa and others that were called as L4 shouldn't have actually been called as such. Mira's spin had everything in it to be given L4 by those standards and they just didn't give it to her.

Maybe Mira's program looked good to you, but it didn't look that great to the judges.

Oh please, the judges mainly graded on reputation and at that point in time of CoP the scores were very low to begin with. The top skaters were only being given 7's and low 8's. You need to put some actual reasoning and analysis of the performance itself into your argument. Only quoting a meaningless number doesn't say anything about the skating.

If you want to talk numbers correlation, then the fact that Matt Savoie's LP was receiving low scores for transitions (or really any component), when it had by far the most difficult transitions of anyone at the Olympics, tells us everything we need to know about how off-base the judging was.

 

[4everchan]

i have watched some of the videos of Mira.... i also think she was lowballed. I think judges are doing a better job nowadays....