The Season in Review - Up Until Now...

[Violet Bliss]

[/B]

denis had two.. he w/d

Jason is the beneficiary of Denis' withdrawal, maybe even Adam or Bychenko a remote possibility. How long has it been since an American Man competed in the GPF? eta. I checked. It was with Jeremy in 2011

Kevin Reynold, with a silver medal, has only one assignment.

 

[Scrufflet]

I haven't read the entire thread but wanted to add 2 cents.

There are skaters being set up for Olympic gold medals. They are getting PCS and GOEs that are top level, regardless of what they put on the ice. It's become more apparent as the GP season has progressed, though if you saw Euros and Worlds last year you would have known too. So far the list is as follows:

Ice dance - Papadakis/Cizeron
Pairs - Savchenko/Massot
Ladies - Evgenia Medvedeva

Men there is no clear favourite for gold because the nature of the elements and how common falls are. But know that if next season Shoma Uno and Nathan Chen show up doing all their quads and triple Axels and go clean their PCS will skyrocket. For now, Hanyu and Fernandez will continue to be the top contenders, with Shoma close behind.

For the record I have no horses in this race. The judges have already made it clear any horses I would have bet on are to be put down.

Oh mango, this is so depressing! I hope you are wrong but...

 

[HanDomi]

I haven't read the entire thread but wanted to add 2 cents.

There are skaters being set up for Olympic gold medals. They are getting PCS and GOEs that are top level, regardless of what they put on the ice. It's become more apparent as the GP season has progressed, though if you saw Euros and Worlds last year you would have known too. So far the list is as follows:

Ice dance - Papadakis/Cizeron
Pairs - Savchenko/Massot
Ladies - Evgenia Medvedeva

.

Why not Fernandez in men ? He is getting even +1 GOE on step out elements. The same for Shoma

 

[Tavi...]

Jason is the beneficiary of Denis' withdrawal, maybe even Adam or Bychenko a remote possibility. How long has it been since an American Man competed in the GPF? eta. I checked. It was with Jeremy in 2011

Kevin Reynold, with a silver medal, has only one assignment.

Yes, it's great that a US man has a good shot to make the GPF this year, but I like to think it's because our guys are working hard, improving, and scoring better, not just because other skaters aren't in the running.

FYI, Denis Ten has been competing on the Grand Prix Circuit since 2009, and has never made the GPF; he's only medaled one other time, taking bronze at TEB in 2014. Given his past record at Skate America (9, 4, 11) there's no guarantee he would have medaled there this year, either, despite his silver in France.

Also, I think you've forgotten that Yuzuru, not Kevin took silver at SC; Kevin was third. He's in a similar position to Mariah Bell - they both did very well in their assignments, and it's very unfortunate that neither received a second one.

 

[Violet Bliss]

Yes, it's great that a US man has a good shot to make the GPF this year, but I like to think it's because our guys are working hard, improving, and scoring better, not just because other skaters aren't in the running.

FYI, Denis Ten has been competing on the Grand Prix Circuit since 2009, and has never made the GPF; he's only medaled one other time, taking bronze at TEB in 2014. Given his past record at Skate America (9, 4, 11) there's no guarantee he would have medaled there this year, either, despite his silver in France.

Yes, the US Men are working up the ranks these last couple of years. You have Adam and Jason slowly getting their quads done and then there is Nathan debuting the Senior circuit with 5 quads. Unfortunately for Max and Karne, Max with his quads but lack of artistry is getting passed by.

And Denis has never shone during a season but has put out peak performances at the biggest events.

Also, I think you've forgotten that Yuzuru, not Kevin took silver at SC; Kevin was third. He's in a similar position to Mariah Bell - they both did very well in their assignments, and it's very unfortunate that neither received a second one.

Ah, I was looking at points and made a momentary mistake of taking his 11 points as a silver medal. Anyway, he and Denis would have the chance to compete against Adam, Jason and Alexei for a spot at the GPF if they had another GP event, as would Mariah.

 

[rosy14]

I haven't read the entire thread but wanted to add 2 cents.

There are skaters being set up for Olympic gold medals. They are getting PCS and GOEs that are top level, regardless of what they put on the ice. It's become more apparent as the GP season has progressed, though if you saw Euros and Worlds last year you would have known too. So far the list is as follows:

Ice dance - Papadakis/Cizeron
Pairs - Savchenko/Massot
Ladies - Evgenia Medvedeva

Men there is no clear favourite for gold because the nature of the elements and how common falls are. But know that if next season Shoma Uno and Nathan Chen show up doing all their quads and triple Axels and go clean their PCS will skyrocket. For now, Hanyu and Fernandez will continue to be the top contenders, with Shoma close behind.

For the record I have no horses in this race. The judges have already made it clear any horses I would have bet on are to be put down.

Then, if it's so, if the judges, and ISU, have already decided who will get the gold medal at Olympics, why do the Games ? Why don't they assign it immediately, save a lot of money and transform the whole competition in shows ? If it's true, it's a shame, not fu us fans, but for the other skaters who train, train and train, the whole life on ice, forgetting all other things, including studying, preparing for a future job, families, love, etc. I have already decided not to watch the Olympics, due to the competiton hours (it will be 2a.m. when they start), but quite probably, if it's as you write, I won't watch the replicas too.
Me too, no horses in the race.

 

[Mango]

Why not Fernandez in men ? He is getting even +1 GOE on step out elements. The same for Shoma

I think you snipped my post in the part where I mentioned both Fernandez and Uno. I'm even predicting Uno and Chen to potentially massively breakthrough next season. But know that if Yuzuru regains his 2015 NHK and 2015 GPF form and enters that zone there is no one else in the world, not even Fernandez, who can beat him. Fernandez has stated that fact as well - the judges will always choose Yuzuru over Javier if both compete to their full potential. The marks you see Javier getting now are from European events. If you saw Euros 2016 you know they are inflated a good amount. This season Javier has been smart to not compete outside of Europe. Next season is an entirely different story with GPF and Olympics all outside of Europe.

Then, if it's so, if the judges, and ISU, have already decided who will get the gold medal at Olympics, why do the Games ? Why don't they assign it immediately, save a lot of money and transform the whole competition in shows ? If it's true, it's a shame, not fu us fans, but for the other skaters who train, train and train, the whole life on ice, forgetting all other things, including studying, preparing for a future job, families, love, etc. I have already decided not to watch the Olympics, due to the competiton hours (it will be 2a.m. when they start), but quite probably, if it's as you write, I won't watch the replicas too.
Me too, no horses in the race.

Rosy14 you are stating something that is being repeated amongst ice dance fans the world over. We as fans may feel sad, upset, or disgusted. But at the end of the day, it's the skaters and their families who will be hurt the most. You dedicate your life to a sport in the pursuit of Olympic glory only to be told you will have to take a backseat to the chosen ones. No one goes out there with the goal of winning bronze or silver. But it's hard to overcome a barrier in the minds of those who judge your sport. And these barriers exist. You see that in ice dance especially - there are tiers for PCS.

The marking system will be revamped in 2018-2019 so I expect more conservative marking when that comes in effect (as we saw with COP when it first came about) but we'll have to survive the 2018 Olympics in the mean time.

 

[rosy14]

Things were the same with the old scoring system, the"6", at least for dance. No matter how good and clean you skated, there were the others, always the same, coming from a longer way than you. You're younger, you should wait your turn, no matter what. In the meanwhile you could go injured or your partner changed idea and stop skating, or new, more attractive couples (aesthetically attractive) arrived, and so on and so forth.
So, why to keep on training and hoping ? and spending lots of money ? For a silver or bronze medal ? and if everyone knows that, I mea, Trainer, families and skater all together, why don't scream from the roofs regarding all that ? For fear Of losing the silver/bronze medal ? So things can go forevet that way ?
And I can' t see all this magnificence and technics and artistry and poem etc.etc. I am dumb, but nauseated too.

 

[noskates]

I think speculation about what will happen at any country's Nationals much less World competitions is frivolous. Yes it makes for conversation and contentiousness on this board but on any given day a skater will either make you happy or disappoint you. What's gone on so far is over and each new competition is a new day. But for anyone to imply that a competitive skater doesn't "want it bad enough" to me is inane. Given the amount of time and effort that goes into training to suggest that it's all for naught is ridiculous. Just my opinion. There are so many factors that impact a skater - nagging injury, not feeling well, not adjusting to the new time zone. fight with a boyfriend or girlfriend or coach, or any number of things that can be influential on a skate. Someone who lands every quad today could miss them all tomorrow - or likewise. But speculate away if it's that much fun................

 

[Mango]

You've missed the point of the discussion. A skater could miss levels, fall on or pop quads, have ankle spraining failed throws and still get top tier PCS and GOEs. What does that tell you? For me it's clear the field is not equal for anyone to take any title, be it a GP, GPF, Euros, 4CCs, Worlds, or Olympics. There are chosen skaters, above the rest of the field, that will get higher marks even with mistakes. That goes against the spirit of competition. Athletes will still compete of course, but it's a pity they are having to do it in these kinds of situations. And fans are free to express their discontent.

Well, we'll see more of it next season but it's already in progress this season.