2018 Olympic Figure Skating Team Event Day 2

[Shayuki]

But, she does display her SS.
SS are often "displayed" by how well you pick up speed in your elements. Carolina picks up speed from almost every element, every turn, and her speed and ice coverage are unrivaled. Even if you don't like Carolina, I don't think you can objectively not realize her SS are amazing.

The speed and ice coverage are easy to maintain when you don't have to perform any difficult turns or steps because you know the judges will reward you anyway. What's impressive is maintaining speed while performing them - And does Kostner exactly display that? It also is easier to pick up speed again if you don't make any attempt at a complicated exit.

"Her SS being amazing" and "her displaying amazing SS" are two different things. It's like an amazing interpreter skating through a program stone-faced with zero attempt at interpreting. Should they get a high inter mark because of the name on their passport?

I will always dislike how some skaters get a free pass to display pre-junior level connecting footwork and getting away with it with zero penalties. I dread the day that skating becomes all about crossovering from element to element.

Well, you asked for my reasoning and I gave it. I guess that's enough on that topic.

 

[Tolstoj]

Lack of speed, not centred and not holding those position enough? Any other day, but not today. Again, why are we still raging about flexibility? If that was the case, Javi would be getting level ones constantly.

Again you can get +3 in various ways, but when you don't have anything special or difficult i don't understand why you should get that much. Flexible positions are difficult period, especially nowadays that you have to hold it.

(right click for the slow motion)

flying camel
https://vk.com/video-99627412_456239282?t=1m32s
It is probably the best one out of the three: not sure if just one star can count as a difficult entry, the spin is well-executed, none of these positions are particularly difficult or creative though
(+2/+3 (depending on how you judge these positions, i'd give her a +2)

layback spin
https://vk.com/video-99627412_456239282?t=2m14s
nice entry but the leg on the illusion should be higher, she travels a little on the first variation (look at "Pyeongchang" on the back: she starts at "chang" and by the time she changes the variation she is at the "P" of Pyeong), then she visibly slows down on the haircutter and you can see by the logo of the Olympics on the back that she is still travelling.
(0/-1 (i'd give her a 0 just because of the creative position and the seamless transitions, otherwise it would have been a -1 for me)

combination spin
https://vk.com/video-99627412_456239282?t=3m8s
no difficult entry, the spin was fine in terms of speed and positioning, but none of these positions were particuarly creative or difficult, she slows down on the last one and she should have held it a little longer, and she travels just a little on the exit.
(0/+1)

Evgenia's spins for me were:
FCSp4 0/-1 (not sure if that turn does count as a difficult entry, she travels on the first part looking at the Olympics logo on the back, but then she recovers and increases the speed on the last part)
CCoSp4 +3 (difficult entry, fairly centered, difficult and flexible position the last one, and she didn't slow down)
LSp4 +2 (difficult entry, good speed and positioning on the haircutter, and she holds the position, i would have given her the +3 for that but the biellmann isn't fully extended)

Having said that i think other skaters for example Satoko have better spins than both of them.

 

[readernick]

The speed and ice coverage are easy to maintain when you don't have to perform any difficult turns or steps because you know the judges will reward you anyway. What's impressive is maintaining speed while performing them - And does Kostner exactly display that? It also is easier to pick up speed again if you don't make any attempt at a complicated exit.

"Her SS being amazing" and "her displaying amazing SS" are two different things. It's like an amazing interpreter skating through a program stone-faced without zero attempt at interpreting. Should they get a high inter mark because of the name on their birth certificate?

We are obviously not going to agree on this subject. But, I think the criteria for the ISU makes it quite clear why Carolina gets for high marks for SS.(it is listed below) If you make something look hard, like Med does that means you aren't as good at that skill. Figure skating is all about making difficult elements beautiful and effortless. Med skating looks difficult. That is not a complement to her abilities. However, I am not going to say more because I admire her greatly. She is an amazingly mentally strong skater.

This is the criteria for SS. I will agree that there is too much two foot skating at points in this SP program. Other than that, Carolina hits everything perfectly.
Criteria:
Balance, rhythmic knee action, and precision of foot placement
Flow and effortless glide
Rhythm, strength, clean strokes, and an efficient use of lean create a steady run to the
blade and an ease of transfer of weight resulting in seemingly effortless power and
acceleration.
Cleanness and sureness of deep edges, steps, and turns
The skater should demonstrate clean and controlled curves, deep edges, and steps.
Varied use of power/energy, speed, and acceleration
Variety is the gradation – some of which may be subtle
Multi directional skating
Includes all direction of skating: forward and backward, clockwise and
counterclockwise including rotation in both directions.
Mastery of one foot skating
No over use of skating on two feet.

 

[yume]

The scoring is unfair but are you guys really surprised? Since the start of the season there are 4 skaters with inflated scores and that won't change at olympics. Barring serious disasters they will be in top5.
Those who think that next season the scoring will be like in 2014-2015....you will be surprised.

 

[Tolstoj]

One thing very few people here considered and it is something judges often said in the past is the fact that scores are contextualized to the event.

Being at the Olympics, skating at last and clean when your biggest contenders made mistakes can give you that little extra for the PB.

 

[bramweld]

The SD scores don't get carried forward and the FD is another event. It's definitely possible for ITA to beat OAR. And even USA.

No, not with that tired retread of a program from C/L. What am I saying it could happen, the Shibs FD is also a dudd.

 

[Jammers]

I just don 't get the love for the Shibs from USFSA. The last two outings in the FD they have had huge mistakes and team USA can't afford any mistakes now. H/D being US champions deserved the nod.

 

[Hevari]

Now the judges officialy gave us know - nearly everything is deciding in and with PCS scores. Bradie and Da Bin got a 2-nd and 3-rd TES respectively but low PCS and lost to a number of skaters with technical faults... Seems that it's not right - "the system has failed" (c) once more...

 

[snd]

ok watched satoko for the first time. very confused re her score. her performance was so crisp... phenomenal, really. combo was rotated? only the single jump pass looked iffy to me? pcs should have been higher, unsure about that tes.

carolina's combo was ok. better than anything radionova lands these days.

 

[cathlen]

The highlights for me today were Dabin Choi and Marchei/Hotarek :yay: So great to see them skating their personal best! :hap93:

ETA: It was awesome to see Sui/Han cheering for their teamates!

 

[Mathman]

The judging was fine. Placements were correct. No drama, no controversy. In ladies, Medvedeva was in a league of her own. Kostner skated great. Osmond might have challenged for second except for the mistakes. Was Satoko better than Tennell? Maybe by a hundredth of a point.

 

[Anyasnake]

I just don 't get the love for the Shibs from USFSA. The last two outings in the FD they have had huge mistakes and team USA can't afford any mistakes now. H/D being US champions deserved the nod.

All 3 US teams deserve it given their record this year. However, SHibs still do have the highest FD score of all of them and they had a choice to make between splitting Ice Dance and Men or Ladies, so that is a safer bet for them I guess.

 

[FSGMT]

I found the scoring quite correct (especially Tennell's PCS, I'm so relieved they didn't hold her up too much just because she's the US champion). The only problem I have is with Medvedeva's GOEs: she deserved to be in first, no doubt, but the FCSp and LSp were quite slow, not well-centred nor well-controlled and not effortless: why +2s and +3s? :scratch: I would have given her 0 or at most +1... Anyway, we all know who's going to be 1st and 2nd, so I guess I'd better stop complaining altogether now

 

[FSGMT]

I think the real issues is that judges have too much to do in a short amount of time. They are judging both technical and artistic elements. If there were a separate panel for judging PCS, I think there would be more variation between the marks and the PCS marks would rely much less on reputation and more on actual skills.

I SO wish there were separate panels, too

 

[frallik]

In 2010, one athlete was strippedof the Olympic gold medal because his programs were the most technically difficult. Nobody in the USA did not:shamebject. Why today, someone resents Costner victories over:dev3:Tennell and Osmond?

 

[yuki]

Satoko is beautiful but you can't deny that her skating is still very small, especially when you watch her live without the camera close on her.

I can. I've seen her live and she covers the ice very well, especially considering how tiny she is. Very good (and effortless) speed too.

 

[wasabi]

How do you figure we all treat this event the same way? I happen to have respect for nations with talents and competitiveness across all disciplines. Olympics come around once every 4 years and the nations' standings can change drastically. Canada has the star veterans around to contribute to and share this probably glory which will mean a lot to them as Canadians and as long time friends. And most of them will retire after this and the competitive landscape will be completely different. Which will be the figure skating power nation in 2022 is completely open to wild speculation.

The FS team is a silly event and it is very easy to figure which nations will be the powers in 2022 - no wild speculation needed!

 

[wasabi]

Not big enough.Maybe he can coach Patrick Chan.

McMorris is a hero!! From massive life threatening injuries last March to Olympic Medallist 11 months later - WOW!!!!

 

[readernick]

In 2010, one athlete was strippedof the Olympic gold medal because his programs were the most technically difficult. Nobody in the USA did not:shamebject. Why today, someone resents Costner victories over:dev3:Tennell and Osmond?

This comment does not make any sense. And, if you are trying to say that Canadians and Americans think that Tennell and Osmond should be above Kostner, I think you will find the vast majority of the comments here from Canadians and Americans express the opposite view. Most think that Kostner deserves her postion and that Miyahara should have higher PCS than Osmond.

You are just trying to start a stupid argument. Be more mature.

 

[geige]

I can ALMOST understand people when they ask Satoko’s jumps. But when you bash her artistry, you are WRONG. Just so completely wrong. If that’s not artistry what do you even think artistry is???