Can you please post Gracie's Gershwin program.
It's on the first page of the thread.
Can you please post Gracie's Gershwin program.
Watched both all through. What struck me was the minute or so in K&C with Alex; she really was a different person. It may be partly that Frank, expectations and fame changed her persona. OR it might be what many adolescent girls go through, a change in self-perception and need to be who others want to see. Also when she talks about making programs their best, it's all tech. Never mentions performance, interpretation, feelings.
Totally different person in the K & C with Alex. Somehow Frank's "send off" from the boards of "Go do your job" just doesn't seem to resonate with Gracie. It just makes me crazy, because she has it all -- ok, maybe her knees are stiff. But still! I don't know, I guess I just like Alex for her.
I'm pretty convinced this is Frank/Lori's fault, and after rewatching TSL interviews, Alex was right on so many things about Gracie: they wanted to make Gracie a princess but she is not that kind of girl.
She liked her 2013 Gershwin's SP, and she made that piece her own. (but Frank hated so much)
Can you or someone else shed some light on that "princess" thing? How does it work and which past skaters were those supposed princesses?
I've been thinking exactly this for a long time. It puzzles me that if an observer can see something, it shouldn't be so hard for the team. If Frank has a weakness as a coach, and every coach surely does, I think it may be that unvarying method or attitude. OTOH, listening to the whole interview, it struck me that Gracie doesn't understand Frank's subtlety. She seems to think he's been unobservant (such as with her doing the Rippon lutz), but I think he's asking her a question to make her come up with the answer that he wants her to think about. Alex's directness may have been more effective for her.
The thing that I find with Gracie is that she doesn't make the music her own. The closest I've seen her come is with her 2014 national & olympics programs, the Grieg, which Lori choreographed, and Sleeping Beauty, which Marina choreographed. I've seen so many posts blaming Gracie's problems on Lori's choreography, and by implication Frank's choices. I don't see that at all. She just isn't an expressive skater unless she's doing perfect jumps.
On the triple loop thread, I haven't watched every video but I noticed that with Carolina's Ave Maria and Secret Garden and with Ilia's Liebestraume, it's all about making the music their own.
This is part of why I uber Ashley. She pretty much makes every piece of music she skates to her own. So much emotional power.
Can you or someone else shed some light on that "princess" thing? How does it work and which past skaters were those supposed princesses?
I've been thinking exactly this for a long time. It puzzles me that if an observer can see something, it shouldn't be so hard for the team. If Frank has a weakness as a coach, and every coach surely does, I think it may be that unvarying method or attitude. OTOH, listening to the whole interview, it struck me that Gracie doesn't understand Frank's subtlety. She seems to think he's been unobservant (such as with her doing the Rippon lutz), but I think he's asking her a question to make her come up with the answer that he wants her to think about. Alex's directness may have been more effective for her.
Sounds as if we have had some very similar thoughts! Just because Frank won a gold with one coaching style with no-nonsense, no-fun Evan Lysacek, that doesn't mean that approach will work with Gracie. One thing that concerns me a little bit about Alex is that Tomoki Hiwatashi (coached by Alex) just won the U.S Men's Jr. title, and now just a few weeks ago we heard that Tomoki has left Alex and is now working with Kori's team in CO. So I guess that makes me think that we never really know as much as we think we know. Is there some reason that skaters just don't feel like Alex is the one to take them to the next level. Or is it not even Alex but the training environment. (Ok, I know no one likes our weather -- but Detroit and the east coast are cold too! ) Felt a little bit bad for Alex when I heard that news.
Agree. I do not have of course any professional insight but, whenever I watch Gracie on TV, I go to the kitchen to make my cap of tea... There is nothing in her skating, except her physical beauty, which would have make me to be interested to watch her programs to the end. There is an emotional coldness. Yes, I can see her undeniable talent but it is not enough to make someone to watch figure skating. She seems to be quite introverted personality, too. There are many talented pianists for example, but only few have a gut to be a concert pianists. It is not enough with a perfect technique, there has to be something else- ability to forget about oneself and an inner desire to give/perform.
Now that I've "gotten to know" Alex a little through that interview and like him, I feel bad and wonder too. And you're right, there's lots we don't know.
This touches on something that has concerned me about Frank and Gracie for a while now. Frank has an interview where he said that he tends to get sarcastic with his skaters when they are starting to annoy him/frustrated him. A lot of Gracie's "Frank is so cute" comments sound like they could be Frank being sarcastic due to getting annoyed with Gracie...but Gracie completely missing that he is getting upset that she is not doing as well as she could. More than once I have seen comments from her about Frank and wondered if she was misreading him.
This does not mean that Frank is a bad coach or Gracie a bad skater. But if a skater thinks her coach is being cute, when he is trying to tell her to shape up... there is a bit of a breakdown in communications going on I think. I think they like each other... but I am not sure they really *get* each other well enough to communicate as well as they need to.
This does not mean that Frank is a bad coach or Gracie a bad skater. But if a skater thinks her coach is being cute, when he is trying to tell her to shape up... there is a bit of a breakdown in communications going on I think. I think they like each other... but I am not sure they really *get* each other well enough to communicate as well as they need to.
And their "honeymoon year" was such a whirlwind, and everything went so well!
Also when she talks about making programs their best, it's all tech. Never mentions performance, interpretation, feelings.
I have no real opinion on Gracie, as I don't follow the ladies enough to know (Other than that I love that she loves Jason)
But on the topic of Frank, I posted this vid in another thread, but I think it's relevant here. 1990 Worlds with Frank coaching the completely un-coachable (and wildly talented) Christopher Bowman. Watch Frank at the beginning ... I can't imagine that's not complete and total sarcasm. And how fed up and direct he is with Christopher in the KnC (even though Christopher had just with this skate won bronze).
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6Q3LST_EkA0
If you care to watch a men's skate, the rest is entertaining too, from Christopher's waking up after falling out of his 3A, playing the crowd, the judges, and the ref, and throwing in an unplanned jump in the last 20 seconds. But I offer it for Frank...
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