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I think step out isn't ratified - for ratified he has to stay on one foot completely sticking the landing (A turn out is allowed)
Ilia Malinin - Solid Quad Axel attempt
- Thread starter Amei
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Yes, that is what I said. But for the step out, this could be ratified.
My understanding is that it has to be fully rotated (no sign), one foot, and neutral or positive GOE.
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- Jun 6, 2019
I see, I misread, my apologies.
That used to be my understanding too, but it seems Mroz got negative GOE on his 4Lz that was ratified so idk. (Maybe I'm forgetful)
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Please stay healthy Ilia but that was a gorgeous jump OMG 
I'm so excited for this upcoming quad-filled quad!
I'm so excited for this upcoming quad-filled quad!
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Yeah Mroz only got -GOE because he was a lower-tier skater. Some might argue he didn't have enough steps leading into it (required of the solo jump in the SP), but IMO he did with the forward sculling, then the choctaw/foot cross over you see on many "down the ice" lutzes. And top-tier skaters have had fewer or non-existent entry steps and have not been deducted. Had Takahashi or Kozuka done the same element the exact same way, the GOE would have surely been positive.
A couple dodgy exits have been labelled the first. Ando's 4S was arguably UR, and Browning 4T had a turn out.
These days to ratify a jump is much harder. A "q" on a jump might drive the GOE to be negative which wouldn't techincally ratify the jump which is bs. And there are several jumps that have issues on the landing that still get +ve GOE (as I said, this one might were it landed on the music, bracket entry, great height/amplitude), so the - reduction for turnout and freefoot down (but weight still on landing foot) might still amount to 0 GOE. Of course, if Malinin had Olympic/World titles, he'd be awarded +2 for that attempt lol.
And yes, he should train this jump at summer events where he'll easily win (or it doesn't even matter if he doesn't win). My thought/hope is if he develops enough of a lead after the SP, he'll be given the green light to go for crazy unprecedented jumps in the FS. I mean, yeah, it's great to land at high profile events, but just make the history first and get it ratified before your body changes further/etc.
Also, I'm blown away that he's gotten this, when it seemed from his insta that he was cooling it on the crazy jump combos/passes. I thought Chen was the absolute peak of technical ability but this guy is so freaking talented.
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That was great. I wish this man good luck moving forward though, dealing with certain fans.
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- Feb 24, 2018
I agree!! That's what I loved the most .....They certainly made Nathan the champion he is. I'm sure Ilia is very much like Nathan with his confidence and competitiveness!
In addition, Ilia lifts his hip and knees to what looks like 90 degree with his foot above knee before 90 degrees in rotation. The 90 degree hip bend looks unique to Ilia's 4A. You can see in image 4 Yuzuru does not have his knee bent that much. Not until image 5 90 degrees mark is his foot above knee.
Yuzuru's height gain is too smooth, too gradual, too much like a 3A.
Of course the video quality for the Ilia's 4A is not great, so I could be mistaken.
Wow 
! Ilia! He shocked me with his quad-quad combos. So, this isn’t too much of a surprise.
I do believe men can do 4T-4T, 4Lo combos, as he has already shown. I wish this was allowed. The next steps are 4A and 5T, which I believe are possible. The women have caught up with 4T, 4S, 4Lo, 4F and 4Lz. So, Men should be pushing for these type of jumps.
Ilia is a master of technical elements. I’m looking forward to Yuma versus Ilia in the next quad.
! Ilia! He shocked me with his quad-quad combos. So, this isn’t too much of a surprise. I do believe men can do 4T-4T, 4Lo combos, as he has already shown. I wish this was allowed. The next steps are 4A and 5T, which I believe are possible. The women have caught up with 4T, 4S, 4Lo, 4F and 4Lz. So, Men should be pushing for these type of jumps.
Ilia is a master of technical elements. I’m looking forward to Yuma versus Ilia in the next quad.
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I don't understand why you say quad combos are not allowed. They are allowed in the LP for sure. However, as many skaters have issues with quads, i cannot see how quad combos will become popular to start with. For Malinin, doing a 4t-4t has no advantage for his layout. He gains more point repeating higher BV quads.Wow
I do believe men can do 4T-4T, 4Lo combos, as he has already shown. I wish this was allowed. The next steps are 4A and 5T, which I believe are possible. The women have caught up with 4T, 4S, 4Lo, 4F and 4Lz. So, Men should be pushing for these type of jumps.
Ilia is a master of technical elements. I’m looking forward to Yuma versus Ilia in the next quad.
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- Oct 27, 2005
OMG. This is shockingly good.
If his family is concerned about funding, they could just start selling tickets to his training sessions.
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- Jun 6, 2019
I'm sure every skater and their dog's are now looking for lessons with Tatiana Malinina given what's happening
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- Oct 22, 2019
Absolutely amazing!!!
I have a question for everyone though: Is it good coaching and jump technique or is he just really gifted?
I have a question for everyone though: Is it good coaching and jump technique or is he just really gifted?
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- Jun 6, 2019
From what we know, accumulation of everything. Best access to ice, facilities, coaches etc.
Of course, it's impossible to rule out other training methods that we don't know about.
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- Jan 25, 2013
A lot of being an elite skater depends on being gifted genetically/physically. But to do a quad axel requires strong technique and lack of fear. Technique can be taught but the mental fortitude to believe one can do unachieved jumping passes and then actually going out and doing those takes a special kind of skater. Even the most genetically/physically gifted skater would be unable to do a quad/quad or quad axel if they did have the gall to go for it.
You can see on his axel takeoff that there isn't skidding and the follow through is really just textbook. He's actually giving himself the height he needs to fully rotate the jump. I suppose being able to reel off the impossible with quad-quad combos does give one confidence in being able to go for a quad axel. Which many view it as the holy grail of skating, this just looks like another insane jump that he's casually checking off his list.
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Comparing quad axel attempts:
Malinin
www.youtube.com
Hanyu
www.youtube.com
https://www.youtube.com/shorts/6xJYPswt494 (harness)
Dimitriev Jr.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iSyJ3umMg-s (Nationals)
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=z1ShHhhjZJk (first ever attempt in competition)
Messing (harness)
www.facebook.com
I know Chen had good attempt but with a fall, but can't seem to find the video.
Malinin
Ilia Malinin landed Quad Axel (4A) in Practice?! The Quad GOD did it??!
On May 1, 2022, Ilia Malinin, the newly crowned World Junior Champion, dubbed the "Quad GOD" in Instagram posted his 4A attempt in practice in his IG Story. ...
www.youtube.com
Hanyu
- YouTube
Auf YouTube findest du die angesagtesten Videos und Tracks. Außerdem kannst du eigene Inhalte hochladen und mit Freunden oder gleich der ganzen Welt teilen.
www.youtube.com
Dimitriev Jr.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iSyJ3umMg-s (Nationals)
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=z1ShHhhjZJk (first ever attempt in competition)
Messing (harness)
Quad axel, anyone? 😱 Keegan Messing with a beautiful 4A in practice on a pole harness. Vid via @sk8erkeeg | By Rocker SkatingFacebook
Quad axel, anyone? 😱 Keegan Messing with a beautiful 4A in practice on a pole harness. Vid via @sk8erkeeg
www.facebook.com
I know Chen had good attempt but with a fall, but can't seem to find the video.
- Joined
- Jan 25, 2013
Comparing quad axel attempts:
Malinin
Ilia Malinin landed Quad Axel (4A) in Practice?! The Quad GOD did it??!
On May 1, 2022, Ilia Malinin, the newly crowned World Junior Champion, dubbed the "Quad GOD" in Instagram posted his 4A attempt in practice in his IG Story. ...
Hanyu
https://www.youtube.com/shorts/6xJYPswt494 (harness)- YouTube
Auf YouTube findest du die angesagtesten Videos und Tracks. Außerdem kannst du eigene Inhalte hochladen und mit Freunden oder gleich der ganzen Welt teilen.
Dimitriev Jr.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iSyJ3umMg-s (Nationals)
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=z1ShHhhjZJk (first ever attempt in competition)
Messing (harness)
Quad axel, anyone? 😱 Keegan Messing with a beautiful 4A in practice on a pole harness. Vid via @sk8erkeeg | By Rocker SkatingFacebook
Quad axel, anyone? 😱 Keegan Messing with a beautiful 4A in practice on a pole harness. Vid via @sk8erkeeg
I know Chen had good attempt but with a fall, but can't seem to find the video.
What seems to be the differentiator in Malinin's is that he really does drive that knee UP - like he recognizes that the jump's height will be limited based on how low that knee is driven up - so the higher he drives it up, the greater the potential height on the jump (which makes sense). As I said, his knees at the peak of the jump seem to be around his shoulder height. While some of the other guys are prioritizing distance on the jump and speed going into it, as well as speed of rotation, it seems that this initial focus on attaining height right from the drive-through knee allows him to complete the rotation more successfully in the end. Obviously more height = more air time (unless you have a harness pulling you up a split second longer), and that's the key factor that has been missing from previous quad axel attempts.
I notice that he's also really using his arms well to drive the upwards momentum of the jump with his arms swinging above his head (his elbows are almost at his shoulders at takeoff), whereas I'm noticing lower arms/elbow height of the other guys, the arms start pulling in and stop at the chest height (it's like they drive the arms/knee through 90%, but then pull in to snap into the backspin and control the rotation). For Ilia, it's like he drives his entire body, including his arms and leading knee. up first as high as they can possibly go, and then pulls into the rotation. It's not quite a delayed rotation, but it's a bit reminiscent of Lussi technique where the priority is to drive the free leg through as much as possible and then pull into the rotation for greater amplitude/rotation.
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- Sep 1, 2020
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Well, to my eyes, Ilia hit the landing cleanly for a few seconds on one foot, and then he turned out (because it was hard to stop the rotation? or because he was not completely balanced, i.e. his body was leaning when he landed so the blade was slightly tilted and couldn't support the lean of his weight; thus he had to turn out to catch himself from falling). It's the best attempt at an unassisted 4-axel that I've ever seen, because the rotations were so crisp and controlled in the air. It was a confident, no second-guessing, solidly executed jump. The next step will be to fine-tune a clean landing. And, as a poster mentioned earlier, Stay Healthy!
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