2018 US Championships Sr Men FS

[museksk8r]

You mean Ross will not compete anymore? No 4CC then What's MJM?

Good for Ross! I would make the same decision. A huge FU to USFSA!

 

[zschultz1986]

USFSA, shame on you! You can not be so cruel to a skater like Ross Minor who has been one of your top skaters, National's and international medalist for more than a decade. You can not ridicule coaches like Mark and Peter who have trained so many outstanding skaters and great human beens for almost 2 decades. 26 years ago Mark Mitchell was left behind the US Olympic team even though he was in 99.99% the best US skater the whole season, ONLY because he placed 3-rd at Nationals. Now, ironically enough, his student Ross Miner is left behind even though he did the performance of his life at Nationals and placed second. He is not even a first alternate for the Olympics and Worlds! What a cruelty!!! What is the "body of work" you are considering? Does it mean anything or just hides your intentions to put in the team whoever you have already decided to put????

Adam has medaled more times on the Grand Prix in the past two years than Ross has HIS ENTIRE CAREER.

Adam beat Ross earlier this year as SkAm. Adam beat Ross at US Nats in 2015 and 2016. Adam has been to the past two GPF, Ross has never made them.

There are criteria in place. Sorry that you don't understand or don't like them.

Edit: This is NOT an Olympic Trial and is not billed as such. Perhaps if you stopped looking at it like that, you'd understand.

 

[somelikeitpink]

some like it pink ;
thank you for the point system regarding the men

but it still boils down they chose the lady's and men's discipline separately.

the lady's used top 3 and worlds not body of work criteria

men chose body of work and gp events stated in their letter chose adam due to his getting to two gp finals.
not his worlds, nor his championship, 4th place medal, his current decent season.

the women stated karen chen beat ashley at last two national championships and worlds

nothing about ashley, mirai, karen chen body of work or how finished in gp events this year or last.

if they are going by criteria they better state same for all disciplines.

not just state well adam got it due to his going to past 2 grand prix finals despite being 4th and off a year ago.
ashley didn't get on because karen chen beat her at last 2 national championships and at worlds in 2017.

why didn't ashley beat mirai off the team.
why didn't they list jason per his getting to gp final this year.
The men of Yuzuru & patrick help jason, & adam get to the Gp Final this year by pulling out. would have they got to the final in 2018 if they stayed in i sincerely doubt it.

the reason is flawed.

which makes me wonder due to some comments during the season and last season if they didn't chose the team ahead of time,
certain skaters.

Obviously I cannot comment on what the USFSA stated as their reasons. But imo it doesn't matter what they said - judged objectively as I showed per the point system you'd still receive the same result in who gets to go and who doesn't.

We can spend a long time discussion what might have happened with Jason if he hadn't gotten that spot last minute, but I don't think it would have had that big of an infuence.

Was it a coincidence that the Ladies podium reflected what the stats or a point system would have shown at that point anyway? well we don't know. Could easily be. I'm sure they were trying to simplify their explanations and that was simply much easier to do than with the mens - hence the mens got a longer explanation than the ladies.

 

[Spinning]

Just out of curiosity, did Mark Mitchell step on someone's toes by any chance? Not even first alternated is just distasteful!

 

[ancientpeas]

I think it's Mark Mitchell who is retiring (or threatening to) not Ross.

I were Ross I'd go to 4CC. I'd be sad but I'd go.

 

[TontoK]

Just to note:

On the board, we use "Body of Work" or "BoW" to indicate that US Nationals are not the only criteria used to select Team Membership, and other competition results are considered.

That is a shorthand term. There are actually very specific competitions for which skaters can receive credit, and they are limited to a relatively brief timeframe - this year and last year.

"Body of Work" in the context of team selection does not imply a CAREER Body of Work.

 

[somelikeitpink]

Just to note:

On the board, we use "Body of Work" or "BoW" to indicate that US Nationals are not the only criteria used to select Team Membership, and other competition results are considered.

That is a shorthand term. There are actually very specific competitions for which skaters can receive credit, and they are limited to a relatively brief timeframe - this year and last year.

"Body of Work" in the context of team selection does not imply a CAREER Body of Work.

THANK YOU. My point.

 

[moonvine]

I still think they should have sent Ross to Worlds. Adam doesn't need to go to both. I don't know what to think about putting Jason as 1st alternate over Ross.

That would put our spots in danger. I was FURIOUS when US Figure Skating named Grant as alternate to Worlds in 2016 instead of Jason. We lost our 3 spots.

 

[MsLayback]

How ironic that Mark Mitchell was on the committee that picked Michelle Kwan over Sarah Hughes and Ashley Wagner over Mirai nagasu

 

[ancientpeas]

Maybe neither Nathan nor Adam intend to worlds and Jason and Ross can go? (I don't know.. just hoping for some good news for Ross maybe?)

Scott Moir (and others) always say how awful the worlds after an olympic games are. How it's nearly impossible to peak twice and you are so over it emotionally when you get there that you just don't want to be there at all.

 

[zschultz1986]

Just to note:

On the board, we use "Body of Work" or "BoW" to indicate that US Nationals are not the only criteria used to select Team Membership, and other competition results are considered.

That is a shorthand term. There are actually very specific competitions for which skaters can receive credit, and they are limited to a relatively brief timeframe - this year and last year.

"Body of Work" in the context of team selection does not imply a CAREER Body of Work.

Right, and as I was saying, Adam's body of work these past two season FAR out shines Ross'. Ross beat Adam by 6 points at Nationals. That is the only piece of this "BoW" argument that Ross has over Adam. All the other criteria have Adam over Ross. It's crazy that I have been fighting with nutty people on here AND on Twitter that don't understand this stuff. Recency Biases are going crazy today.

People need to STOP thinking about the US Nationals before the Olympics as the Olympic Trials. They are not. STOP THINKING ABOUT THEM LIKE THIS.

 

[museksk8r]

That would put our spots in danger. I was FURIOUS when US Figure Skating named Grant as alternate to Worlds in 2016 instead of Jason. We lost our 3 spots.

Come on . . . That was just as much the fault of Adam (6th) and Max (8th) as it was Grant’s (10th) fault.

 

[ancientpeas]

Come on . . . That was just as much the fault of Adam (6th) and Max (8th) as it was Grant’s (10th) fault.

It took a village!

 

[markovai]

Just to note:

On the board, we use "Body of Work" or "BoW" to indicate that US Nationals are not the only criteria used to select Team Membership, and other competition results are considered.

That is a shorthand term. There are actually very specific competitions for which skaters can receive credit, and they are limited to a relatively brief timeframe - this year and last year.

"Body of Work" in the context of team selection does not imply a CAREER Body of Work.

OK, but is it said anywhere how big or small is the credit they receive for each of the competitions? If Nationals is not the most important criterion why do they make the decision and the announcement in the night after Nationals and in such a "dramatic" way? Does this help anybody to trust and respect their decisions? Or rather doesn't this increase even more people's opinion that figure skating is not a fair sport but rather a big joke?

 

[museksk8r]

How ironic that Mark Mitchell was on the committee that picked Michelle Kwan over Sarah Hughes and Ashley Wagner over Mirai nagasu

Emily Hughes, not Sarah.

 

[BravesSkateFan]

If Nathan wins the OG, I think he will retire. My guess is Adam and Max will also be retiring shortly. Even Jason's retirement in the next year or so would not surprise me. If all of those do occur, a lot will fall on Vincent.

My guess is USFS realized that they could not bypass Vincent a second time because if they did, in all likelihood he might retire too. If they wanted Adam, then sorry Ross.

I really like the Olympic Team and JWs.
But I also think Ross really got screwed.:sad21:

Max got 4CC since Karne is a secret member of the selection committee.

I think he'll still do Worlds. He doesn't have a Worlds medal yet, and I'm sure he'd like to add that to his trophy case.

 

[Viiktoruu]

I remember my impression from last night about Vincent's choreo had a lot to do with the moment where he touches his face with both hands during the crescendo of the first part of the program. There was actually a lot going on internally there. And in the section where he stops before going into the second, slower movement of the program. There was also a lot of open arms kind of stuff though--not that interesting. However, none of Ross' choreo was striking to me. I don't remember any of it and I watched it twice.

I thought Vincent's jumps, spins, and steps were timed nicely to the music. Nothing masterful, but fine. Same for Ross.

I can see what you mean about the "pained" expression. But it seemed like he was channeling something from the first moment and that it built as the program went along. Whatever he was channeling reached me. There was character and some emotional detail. I like things that are rough around the edges if they're heartfelt and passionate, which I thought this was.

Ooh I skipped the reply somehow, sorry.

I agree that he opens his arms, he does it A LOT . Way more frequently than fully rotating his jumps..

The lack of emotion isn't even what bothers me the most. It's the painful lack of musicality. He just STOPPED when the music changed and then continued with the same emotion (?), tempo and style as before. Crescendos and decrescendos + changes in the tempo were interpreted only by him putting his hands onto his face and doing one spread eagle at the right time, while the music was charged so much with emotion that many think it's too much. That end of Come What May is simply criminal! And these nuances of music (which are plenty in his music) should be actually seen in the SKATING, not just the opening of arms or grinning. He scored 8,71 for Interpretation of Music. Not out of 50 but out of 10. Eight. point. seventy-one. :angry1:

I have not been this mad at PCS scores like ever. And I know it's nationals but geez he usually scores about 7,5 and they gave him high 8s and 9s. NINES!!! Do they really think he'll score that at the Olympics??

So as you can see, I haven't changed my opinion and respectfully disagree And you're right that he was channeling something and to me it looked like it was either constipation or a peptic ulcer

 

[moonvine]

So many things I don't understand. If the US has a pewter medal (and they do), and you receive it standing on a podium step, why doesn't that count as a "podium finish?" I'm not entirely sure why they have a pewter medal as it seems to count for absolutely nothing, but they do.

I don't understand why US Nationals are Tier 1 and International events are Tier 2 and 3. Can we all agree it is easier to win US Nationals than an OGM or a GPF over Javi, Hanyu, etc? Lets say I was a figure skater and I won worlds in 2017, and won both my grand prix assignments and won the GPF and some craziness happened at Nationals and I ended up in say...12th. Would I not still deserve to go to the Olympics? PCS get a huge bump at Nationals and almost everyone gets a SB and most people are pretty happy, but they aren't going to score that high in International competition and isn't the idea to put the best team together that you can?

 

[dalenofff]

Maybe neither Nathan nor Adam intend to worlds and Jason and Ross can go? (I don't know.. just hoping for some good news for Ross maybe?)

Scott Moir (and others) always say how awful the worlds after an olympic games are. How it's nearly impossible to peak twice and you are so over it emotionally when you get there that you just don't want to be there at all.

I think Kristi Yamaguchi is the only one that won OGM and World in the same year.
correction it look like Katarina Witt also did this twice... beyond that, I didn't follow skating then...

 

[MsLayback]

Emily Hughes, not Sarah.

I knew that ... I'm like a mom with my kids say their name and one will answer LOL