2017 Worlds Men's SP

[Interspectator]

Musing on style, music choice, packaging and enjoyment of a program:
I watch a lot of Ballet and ballroom dance, so my standards for figure skaters who choose that music is more exacting. -which is probably why, though Nathan has had a good grounding in Ballet for many years, and has good carriage and clean lines, his ballet inspired SP is not as enjoyable to me. Ballet requires an effortless and seamless control of the body starting from the core and extending outwards from the back, to the shoulders and neck and then to the arms, legs, toes, finger tips. the spell is broken if the lines are dropped at any time (unless deliberately choreographed ). Misha's SP, though also not quite there yet, is much more within the style one would expect from a ballet inspired program and executed better if one is only thinking of the 'feel' of ballet in a skating program.

Boyang on the other hand has a SP program that is totally unpretentious and requires 'only' musicality, a sharp sense of rhythm and 100% commitment to the character. It doesn't ask you to think of it as any kind of artistic breakthrough but just to enjoy. And I do. There isn't any background of my watching some other great artist dance to spider man and throw webs around. I've never seen anyone do it better.

Which is why, throughout the season, Boyang's program has been the most fun for me to watch.

These are, of course, my personal opinions and have nothing to do with how I think skaters should be scored or PCS or judges or anything.

 

[cheerknithanson]

They hate sharing for free. That's the nature of folks trying to make a buck.

Those people should feel happy and honored that those skaters chose THEIR music.

 

[KatGrace1925]

I was talking to someone about the current standings and results and the scary thing about this comeptition is any of the top 6 could percievably shuffle around to the podium in the long. Predicting this is impossible.

 

[Globetrotter]

I'm on the Bandwagon of 'Hooray for Jason!'
I believe that PCS should be scored for what it says in the rule book. Jason has the qualities that deserve high PCS scores especially when he skates clean. -I just wish it would be applied consistently so that more skaters like Jason could depend upon the judges acknowledging their skills without the presence of a quad to 'beef up' that PCS aura.
On the whole, I'm happy with the Judging for the SP. The standings look good to me. Perhaps Nathan was scored generously in PCS but I've thought so all season, nothing new here. The judges and I have a difference of opinion on his skating skills, transitions, and interpretation.

Oh well, what do we know about PCS scoring these days? It has became totally predictable on who is the judges' golden boy / girl. SS is the most blatantly abused scoring in my observation. Sure, I agree overall that Javi has the best performance of the night and deserves the lead but 9s for his SS?? Same for the ladies, I think Zhenya did skate well and deserved the lead but those 9s in PCS in SS and TR (lots of quantity but not quality) are really a bit rich considering that her basic bladework and edges are really not quite there. As for Nathan, he is the new poster boy of skating. I can't quite agree on his SS - edges are shallow, he doesn't quite flow across the ice and the TR are really very basic although kudos to him for attempting both 4Lz and 4F. His PCS should really only be of Jin Boyang level - they are both about there although Nathan will deserve a slightly higher PE as he does have better overall carriage and posture.

As for the linking steps prior to solo jump, I have long given up that judges will apply that rule clearly. It really makes a travesty to Javi and Yuzu who made their steps before the solo quad pretty obvious. GOEs need to be applied as -2 to -3 according to the ISU rules if linking steps are not obvious but, oh well, it rarely gets applied - perhaps the wow factor on seeing a big 4F can negate that. Brendan Kerry just hadn't yet became a golden boy, tough.

 

[4everchan]

THE SALCHOW HOLMES CUP OF SP CUTOFF SCORE

I will now announce the winners of the Salchow Holmes Cup of SP Cutoff Score competition held in the Men's Pre-Event Thread. Goldenskaters were asked to guess the lowest qualified short program score for the free skate.

The 24th skater who qualified for SP was Michael Christian MARTINEZ with a score of 69.32.

The guesses by 49 golden skaters were as follows:

GF2445 says 75.0
Puchi says 73.20
Marin says 73.04
Isabel_O'Reilly says 72.7
TontoK says 72.5
Liha says 72.24
sallycinnamon says 72.0
Snow White says 71.80
4everchan says 71.43
xeyra says 70.70
narcissa says 70.1
Caustica says 70.09
LRK says 70.0
d6886 says 69.89
Sabrina says 69.7
Skye says 69.69 (+0.37)
Seren says 69.57 (+0.25)
da96103 says 69.5 (+0.18)
Michael Christian Martinex 69.32
el henry says 69.13 (-0.19)
StitchMonkey says 68.95 (-0.37)
TT_Finn says 68.88
market says 68.71
jabberwocky18 says 68.70
AppleEmperor says 68.60
Frag says 68.5
cathlen says 68.47
Florencito says 68.19
L'Kitsu says 67.89
Becki says 67.8
Zebobes says 67.78
Ares says 67.67
NoNameFace says 67.57
Antyy says 67.52
karne says 67.38
shine says 67.24
Crossover says 67.2
eta says 67.18
Mango says 67.0
friedbanana says 66.95
randomfan says 66.83
Neenah16 says 66.6
Greta says 66.24
snowflake says 65.65
figurefan says 65.45
teeannroo says 65.35
Mathman says 65.00
ShiroKJ says 64.37
Sam-Skwantch says 64.20
Marius says 63.99

So the winners are:

Salchow Holmes Cup: da96103 69.5 (+0.18)
Silver: el henry 69.13 (-0.19)
Bronze: Seren 69.57 (+0.25)
Pewter: Two winners Skye 69.69 (+0.37) and StitchMonkey 68.95 (-0.37)

Thank you all for playing and those who took the initiative to research helpful information to help with the guesses. Please congratulate all the winners.

Please wait for the next edition of Salchow Holmes at the Olympics 2018. Pay attention to the whole season to guess the SP cutoff score for the Men's competition.

lol i know this was fair and not a corrupted competition but it's still hilarious that you won the prize for the competition you created LOL hahahahaahha

 

[HB Spud]

Vanya time
I like that he is here not Paniot

Hmm...interesting. Is that because you don't like to see QUADS?

 

[Skater Boy]

Patrick was gorgeous. Not a foot placed wrong and everything was super-extra quality. That was better than standard clean Patrick - really special even for him, I didn't know that he could be even stronger. His 4T-3T was among the best I've ever seen for sure.

Free Skate will be big test but no matter what I am not going to forget his SP at very least.

Glad that he's still there delighting us with his performances in actual competition, that he was able to put in past certain disappointments and use it as a motivation.

i agree but thejudges didn't look at his pcs versus fernandez

 

[Sabrina]

I was so close + 0.38...anyway fierce competition in men

 

[Nika09]

That was fast. Since when did you become such an ardent Hanyu supporter? I was just making a passing comment on some poster's laughable attempt at scandal and vaunting of Hanyu's supposed StSq prowess. I maybe bias but I can't seem to remember ever been impressed by any of Hanyu's step sequences. Something along the line of Ten's glorious 2015 4CC StSq or Chan at TEB in 2013.

Yes a little actually
Do you really think everyone else's (not just an audience) opinion about Hanyu's skating is laughable and yours that he's poor in foot work is not? Maybe you're not impressed by his skating at all but it's just subjective.

Yuzuru is too stubborn & ambitious for his own good. It lets him down from time to time, but without his fearless character he likely wouldn't reach this level either.

This is guy who decided to skate while with stitches on his head and mauled in his Grand Prix event two seasons ago after all, sometimes it borders with insanity.

Seems like he is. Good but sometimes dangerous thing for an athlete. Hope he'll finally finish clean his FP tomorrow with all 4S and could get away with that. I'm so tired of this routine already.

The best FP of this season is Shoma's IMO. Want him to skate it very well and improve his SB like he did yesterday with SP.

 

[xeyra]

I have a question about practices before the FS. Do the runthroughs always happen in the order of the FS in every practice, or do they usually rotate?

 

[zschultz1986]

Exactly but ...
Maybe people who saw Kolyada further ahead are not idiots, just normal people expressing their opinions? It's normal that we don't share the same exact view, otherwise it would not be Figure Skating. I for once don't have a problem with Jason Brown score, I rather admire him for commendable feat and smartly constructed but balanced programs considering lack of quad here. All skaters are free to employ their own tactics and ways of earning points. Jason had better spins, footwork, choreography and polished skating. All that weighted in his favour. I am a big fan of Kolyada, not so much for Jason but I can see his strenghts.

Fine, they're not idiots, but they are wrong.

I see Kolyada's strengths too. He had a great lutz here, his axel and quad combo were ok (not the best runout on either, but still decent), and everything else was good/very good, and that is how it was scored. However, Jason was excellent on the spins and footwork as per usual, but the difference here was the axel was smooth has silk, the other solo and combo jumps were good, and the program was pristine clean.

So look at it this way: In the range of point possible (0-100%), Kolyada got around 80-85% of his max possible points. Brown got 90-95% of his max possible points, but still was edged out by Kolyada because of Base Value. (There's aren't ACTUAL %ages, I was just guesstimating based on the scores.) The way you should be looking at it is that an ok-to-good skate by Kolyada was judged to be better than (arguably) the best short program that Brown has ever skated.

 

[atsumiri]

Analysis of Protocol from Men's SP - https://pp.userapi.com/c636627/v636627993/63b8c/F4haMLKZ8Nc.jpg
WOOW
German judge is strict

 

[Marius]

The competition is just amazing. I'm just so impressed by the way the top men competed (and also all the other out of the top 6 did really well)!
Nothing is decided. Last year, a 12 points lead over 1 skater after the SP seemed impossible to beat, and this year there are 6 skaters in those 12 points! Anything can happen. 12 points, at the end, is the base value of a 4 Loop. And is less than the base value of a 4 LZ and a 4 F. It is obviously Fernandez's to loose now, but really, the FS will be exciting. Remember also that Fernandez, out of the top 6, has the lowest base value for the FS, practically the same of Chan.
For me, tomorrow will win the skater who will land his quads. Pop one, fall on one, and you're probably out the game for the gold.
I can't wait

 

[MaiKatze]

Exactly. I don't understand the drama, because nothing is decided yet. I understand Yuzuru fans are a bit disappointed, but 98 is still a very good score and he can overcome this easily. Sure it's always nice to come in first, skate a new World Record, but we've seen in the past that a first place finish can be added pressure too. For those who are a bit behind this might even be benificial. Javier, though, seemed very calm and collected. He talked a bit in the PC about his career. He's at his tenth! World Championship this year. He knows what he's doing. Patrick Chan, I really liked how intelligent his answers were. I always had a bit of a problem with his, I am the best and the others are beneath me talk, but he's been humbled and seems happy to be there, focusing on what he does best. He's the most vulnerable of the podium, imho. But who knows....I just think that all is still possible, that Nathan Chen even can still win this thing. So no need to paint it black and get depressed yet!

 

[karne]

Now that I've finally had a chance to catch up on Reynolds, I have to say I am...less than satisfied that he beat Brendan. It's probably my super bias, but I just thought everything Brendan did was of a higher quality - cleaner, crisper, sharper, even a touch more personality.

Jason was utterly breathtaking.

 

[da96103]

lol i know this was fair and not a corrupted competition but it's still hilarious that you won the prize for the competition you created LOL hahahahaahha

Haha, I think I am retiring from figure skating fandom and now will be a full time lottery buyer.

 

[da96103]

I was so close + 0.38...anyway fierce competition in men

Sorry, Sabrina, you fell on the 3A and came in at 6th place.

 

[OS]

Haha, I think I am retiring from figure skating fandom and now will be a full time lottery buyer.

So who's going to win on the FS pls? (I need to submit a bid on Betfair)

 

[da96103]

So who's going to win on the FS pls? (I need to submit a bid on Betfair)

Lol. If you want to win small, bet on Javi. If you want to win big but risk big, bet on Shoma.

 

[Eclair]

Analysis of Protocol from Men's SP - https://pp.userapi.com/c636627/v636627993/63b8c/F4haMLKZ8Nc.jpg
WOOW
German judge is strict

wooooooww, great to look at! must have been a ton of work to do that table!